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a different view about zach thomas and jason taylor

Alien

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if you were a fan of another team and you were non biased against the dolphins like a jets, pats, or bills fan what would you think of zach thomas or jason taylor? being a dolfan i think zach thomas is top 5 in the nfl when healthy and jason taylor is the best pass-rusher in the game and is tied for the second best de in the game with dwight freeney behind strahan.
 
Please understand,I'm trying to downplay ZT's performance over the course of his career. However, I am curious to see how much of an impact Z will have after his first full season in a defense that is not entirely 4-3 sets.
 
I would think that ZT would be in the top 5 at ILB and JT being in the top 3 at DE.


I think that size os overrated in the NFL. IMO ZT will still do great in the 3-4.
 
Im not sure my opinion would change much. I still think Jt is the most complete DE in the league with 65 sacks over the past 5 years and his ability to play the run being significantly better than either strahan or Freeney (who's purely an upfield rusher and teams run right at). The only real competition for JT's #1 ranking would be Peppers, Strahan and Seymour (if you consider him a DE which I personally dont but hes still a stud regardless of where he plays).

As for Thomas, I think Id still see him where I see him now. Probably 5th or 6th best MLB who's career was made, through no fault of his own, by the system he played in. Without the 2 big DT's in front of him Im very interested to see if ZT can handle the physicality considering his recent injury history. At this point in his career Id have to put (in no order) Lewis, Fletcher, Morgan, and Wilson ahead of him, and Trotter probably right on par with Zach. The biggest problem really isnt the system he plays in, its his lack of big plays/TO's caused. He makes a lot of tackles but often its 4-6 yards downfield. And god knows Edge absolutely OWNS ZT everytime ZT tries to stand him up and hit him edge still always falls foward. Its a trend with bigger backs and ZT; he gets overpowered frequently.
 
oh man, how was i so stupid, i forgot peppers, the panthers werent too loud till the end of the season last year, yeah peppers most definately over freeney, i have to go kick myself, but i ask this because i remember those top 50 player rankings and how jt was like 41 with quite a few other defensive ends in front of him.
 
JT can even drop into coverage for Pete's sake!!!!!! Zach is getting long in the tooth but if he gets near a guy the guys going down.
 
Alien said:
oh man, how was i so stupid, i forgot peppers, the panthers werent too loud till the end of the season last year, yeah peppers most definately over freeney, i have to go kick myself, but i ask this because i remember those top 50 player rankings and how jt was like 41 with quite a few other defensive ends in front of him.
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You have to remember, when they made that list it was right after a 4-12 season. Having a year like that kind of takes you out of the mind of the people ranking the players. JT's numbers were also down some from what he had done in recent years.
 
Megatron said:
JT can even drop into coverage for Pete's sake!!!!!! Zach is getting long in the tooth but if he gets near a guy the guys going down.
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He heard that, and got bigger and faster to prove comments like this wrong. he was damn fast at minicmp, i think its his new workout routine.
 
well for zach, if you look at how many tackles he had before he got injured last year and how many he was averaging per game, he was heading for quite a bit of tackles and for about 7-8 weeks of the season he was leading the nfl in tackles and then he got hurt so i would think he is still way up there
 
3-4 years ago, I'd have Zach as a top 3-4 MLB in the NFL. Today? I think he drops to 6-7. I still love him. He's still productive and a tackling machine. But, you do have to take into account his injuries - part of his injuries may relate to his size. Also, I don't think he's quite the werckless hitter he was his first 3-4 seasons. He would crush people. The Troy Brown hit his rookie season is still one of the better hits I've seen in the last 10 years.

JT - I definitely have him in the top 5 DE's. He's always been better against the run than people think. He's potentially 2nd behind Freeney, imo. I don't think Strahan is as good as he was 2-3 seasons ago. Right now, I'd put JT ahead of Strahan, especially in Saban's new system. JT will be making a lot of plays - though not always from the DE spot.
 
Lets see: Crowder 6-2 252lbs
Spragan 6-3 240lbs
Seau 6-3 250lbs
Thomas 5-10 228lbs

I think this year might be interesting, no wonder Zach beefed up and tried to get faster !!!!
 
JT- Probably tops in the league currently. Strahan is slowing down, he had a few great years but they are definately behind him. Freeney is quickly approaching JT's level, but he is a little too one dimentional (pass rush). Peppers could supplant JT this year, he is a phenom. His potential is limitless and he could be the one all others are compaired to. Right now though, JT is my #1.

Zach- At one time he was a top 5 MLB in the league. Part of his success of course is due to the system he played in. But without a doubt he has the biggest heart in the game. He was born to play football and he does so with wreckless abandon. He appears to be quickly winding down and his lack of size might be catching up with him. Still a top 10 MLB. Channing Crowder is the future of the Phins.....JMHO
 
That is a tough question because if I was a fan of say, the Seahawks, I would not see the Dolphins play that much. I probably would have seen enough of Zack to call him a very solid linebacker, definatly top ten, just outside the top five. Jason Taylor on the other hand, everybody with a brain who has watched the guy play knows that he is the best, the only two that can even compare is Simion Rice and Micheal Strahan
 
I can't see how Al Wilson gets all this pub. about being a great MLB. He is good but he hasn't had but one Zach Thomas like year in his whole career... One of the more overrated players in the NFL in my opinion..
 
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