Brilliant article on Wallace and Ireland

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by uk_dolfan, Mar 6, 2013.

  1. uk_dolfan

    uk_dolfan Founder of the FH Adam Gase fan club Moderator Finheaven VIP

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  2. Nublar7

    Nublar7 Retired Finheaven VIP

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    It is a very good read and makes me very excited about the potential addition of Wallace. I just wish next Tuesday would get here already.
     
  3. J. David Wannyheimer

    J. David Wannyheimer 5 Years of Posting Excellence. Finheaven VIP Donator

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    If we sign him, we will overpay. That's free agency.

    Just gotta hope it's not a ridiculous overpayment.
     
  4. HarryBagpipe

    HarryBagpipe Archibald Meatpants Super Donator Donator

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    Better to overpay for really good players who are playmakers than to overpay for average ones. If you're gonna overpay, make it count
     
  5. The Omen

    The Omen Well-Known Member

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    I remember reading somewhere the Ireland has been in love with Wallace for sometime now (I'm talking for a few years now)... Pressure is on Ireland, all the fans want Wallace. It will take a ridiculous amount of money for another team to take Wallace from us, as it seems both sides (Wallace and Miami) seem to fancy each other.
     
  6. AFCMiamiEast

    AFCMiamiEast A True Fan

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    It feels like I keep reading the same articles tirelessly over, and over, and over again....man I can't wait until free agency fires off so all the speculation comes to an end!
     
  7. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Premium Member

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    Some things in that article are just astounding.
     
  8. J. David Wannyheimer

    J. David Wannyheimer 5 Years of Posting Excellence. Finheaven VIP Donator

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    You mean like the implication that it was Ireland's conservative, steady stewardship that has just FINALLY brought the Dolphins out of the horrible salary cap mess that drove one coach to quit in 2006 and that Ireland then inherited... in 2008? Heh.

    Jeff is just that good, man.
     
  9. FrostyFinFan

    FrostyFinFan Well-Known Member

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    My guess is that Wallace will be signed early in free agency and the same could be true with Jennings. I think the rest will drag out as it usually does. Everyone wanting to get a deal with the free agents available. Miami will be no different. The best deals are swooping in and getting someone after they find out they aren't going to get what they wanted. The seems to take a week or more, sometimes multiple weeks. I fear we'll have to be patient in free agency, although, I think Wallace will be gone quickly. Hopefully to us without an outrageous salary cap number.
     
  10. Twitches Brew

    Twitches Brew A True Fan

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    Nice read. I think Ireland is feeling how precarious of a position he's in: going into a second year without giving a young QB anyone to stretch the field is trouble for Tanny's development. It's hard for that young a QB to really succeed without a go-to guy (see: Reggie Wayne and Pierre Garcon who worked wonders for Luck and RG3).

    That said, I'm not a fan of Wallace due to his recent play; production fell off midway through 2011 and was disappointing in the more possession passing game last year. He's not a chain-mover, not a guy you can consistently count on on, say, 3rd-and-7.

    I'm curious: what's everyone's absolute limit on what to pay him? Would you go up to, say, 12.5, 13, 13.5?
     
  11. hoops

    hoops exited stage left

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    it's about time ireland grew a pair...

    but at the same time signing hartline to a almost $7 mil per year contract reeks of playing it safe...

    if he screws up this offseason no excuses...hit the road jack
     
  12. jd13

    jd13 Starter

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    I think Wallace is the 1 guy that Ireland will overpay for because of his speed and age.
     
  13. LouPhinFan

    LouPhinFan It's ok to say "I don't know". Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Brilliant article? I like Darlington but how is it he knows so much about Ireland's plans for next week? Wallace's agent must be doing back flips after seeing this on the web. This article just gave Wallace another couple million. Oh we're going to over pay and we're going to overpay like a champ. Hopefully it won't hamstring us when Wallace's speed disappears due to age. We better have a way out of this contract after 3 or so years.

    And after this article Ireland BETTER end up with Wallace. If he doesn't then there aren't enough eggs on the planet to throw at Jeff's face.
     
  14. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    Ireland miscalculated the situation last year? Perish the thought! As we all know, only Bill Parcells miscalculates stuff, so it wasnt Irelands fault.

    Either way, we got weapons for Tannehill last year. Legedu Naanee. That wasnt enough?

    edit: I have no idea why people are responding to this article in a positive light. All it did was making me roll me eyes. Sure, Ireland "thinks" he has the market pegged, but only because of a damn rule change.
    Seriously people? Other teams have no trouble whatsoever figuring out what to pay a player. We have to rely on the league changing it up to make things easier? This is so indicative of our franchise: a year behind everyone else. Its unbelievable people are applauding our front office. I vote we hire someone who doesnt have to rely on the league office to do half the work for him.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 6, 2013
  15. PhinSoldia

    PhinSoldia Miami Dolphin Columnist in the Making

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    with the three day period between the 9th and the 12th expect good players to sign early because they have three days to talk to several teams and to get offers and teams have the chance to outbit


    im thinking Wallace is going for 14 m a year.....SMH
     
  16. fininpsl

    fininpsl A True Fan

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    In this way Hartline and Bess complement him very well. We moved the chians ok with our current WR core. What we lack is both a consistent deep threat, and a WR that will make plays in the endzone. That's Wallace's cup of tea.
     
  17. PhinSoldia

    PhinSoldia Miami Dolphin Columnist in the Making

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    still need a big body WR, with decent hands,
     
  18. kcbrown

    kcbrown Life is what we make it. Donator

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    Sorry, Wallace, Hartline, and Bess is not enough.

    As someone said in another thread, all defenses will have to do is double Wallace....and there are no other threats. I hope if we land Wallace, we still pick up a young, fast, RAC hungry WR in rounds 1 - 3 (and a pass catching TE in free agency).

    I do expect Matthews to get more run, which I like...but just the above three guys is not enough.

    Are we just trying to go 10-6 or are we trying to make some serious noise? Let's make some noise and get multiple play-makers on this team.
     
  19. uk_dolfan

    uk_dolfan Founder of the FH Adam Gase fan club Moderator Finheaven VIP

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    Im not sure we are in a position to complain about "just" going 10-6!
     
  20. flynryan15

    flynryan15 A True Fan Donator

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    Like not getting Kyle Orton?
     
  21. JTech194

    JTech194 Starter

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    This is a team and we need players to play roles. We have Chain Movers in Hartline and Bess what we don't have is TD makers which Wallace is 10, 8 and 8 the past 3 years. I'd pay him whatever it takes, last few millions would be incentive based, score 10 TD get an extra 3 million, score 8 TD get and extra 2 etc..
     
  22. theedge55

    theedge55 Rookie

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    Anybody else still feel like with a young quarterback it's best to be bringing along a young receiver to complement him as well. I mean we're talking about Tannerhill being our QB down the line. So are we forever bringing in vets to complement him? Where's our practice squad with young reciever talent waiting for their turn?
     
  23. MiamiDolphin618

    MiamiDolphin618 A True Fan

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    I gotta agree with some of the earlier posters. Wallace is going to get overpaid...no doubt about it. But I would rather overpay for a guy like Wallace who can change the dynamic of an offense that pay 5 mil per to a bunch of average joes like Richard Marshall. Give me two or 3 impact players rather than 5-6 mediocre players.
     
  24. JTech194

    JTech194 Starter

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    I believe this, but the players complimenting him need to be good, not the marlon moore's and roberto wallace's of the world. Mike Wallace is 26 years old and is proven. I think he qualifies as a young compliment.
     
  25. Geforce

    Geforce FinHeaven VIP

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    You are right, his production did fall off midway through the 2011 season. Like Mike Tomlin said, once the tape got out on Wallace, teams started to play him differently and good teams have other players step up.
    As for Wallace disappointing in the more possession passing game last year, all the Steelers wide receivers disappointed in that system and Wallace was the only receiver to go over 100 yards in any game. Which he did twice.
     
  26. DolfanDuBbZ~

    DolfanDuBbZ~ Avoid the 'Noid

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    To me it makes sense to sign Hartline if your going after Wallace. With Jennings people putting out that 12mil asking price, IMO, it locked up Hartline back to MIA. It said to me, if the market/player is going to be that high for Jennings, might as well pay for the super threat and pay your own FA. I think when its all said and done. MIA will have damn near 20mil locked up between 2 WRs.

    And I am not a Ireland person. I just understood that once he drafted Tannehill he wasn't going anywhere, like the echo chamber here thought. He knows as well as we do, that his tenure in MIA rides on what he brings into MIA this year.
     
  27. DolfanDuBbZ~

    DolfanDuBbZ~ Avoid the 'Noid

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    Yet, he pegged the market on the likes of Kevin Kolb, Matt Flynn and Kyle Orton. Other teams figured out how much to pay those players.

    Like Jeff, you have holes in your own theories.
     
  28. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    He tried to pay Orton $9 million a year, our owner shut that down.
    He offered a hefty contract to Flynn, who is apparently so horrible that only 1 other team wanted him.

    He did refuse to give a second round pick for Kolb. So, because of that, should we go ahead and build a statue for Ireland? I mean, he did use that second round pick productively, Daniel Thomas is certainly tearing up the league.
     
  29. PhinSoldia

    PhinSoldia Miami Dolphin Columnist in the Making

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    they were supposed to be Roberto Wallace and Marlon Moore, we will probably pick up at least 3 with the draft and udfa process
     
  30. PhinSoldia

    PhinSoldia Miami Dolphin Columnist in the Making

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    can we please get the link to him paying orton 9 M? and also to us wanting to pay flynn a hefty sum, what was that figure? and why did he sign with Seattle for 5.5 M if we were giving him a ....in your words....hefty sum
     
  31. andyahs

    andyahs Bahamian Redneck Donator

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    You mean Seattle offered him a hefty contract because he didn't sign here because he was offered backup pay - which is what he is worth.
     
  32. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/story?storyId=7031691&wjb

    Flynn signed a $26 million($10 million guaranteed), 3 year deal with Seattle. Instead of the $8 million or so Seattle offered him, at the time it was reported we offered something around $6.5 million per season. We "low-balled" him because we felt he wanted to play for Philbin more than he wanted an immediate high contract. And yes, i consider $6 million to be a hefty contract. Heres a link about the story, albeit with no final contract number. And im absolutely not digging through a year of Jason Cole tweets looking for the number. Take my $6 million for a grain of salt if you want.
    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/16/report-dolphins-make-low-ball-offer-to-matt-flynn/

    Either way, if this player was just so darned god awful, so bad he was benched, so not worth the contract he was given...why did Miami bring him in and try and sign him at all?
     
  33. TheJetsBlow

    TheJetsBlow A True Fan

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    Good read.
     
  34. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    "I mean", why offer a contract to a bad player at all? Much less a contract comparable, albeit thats slightly less, than the 3 year, $26 million Seattle offered him.
     
  35. Vaark

    Vaark Nihil taurus crappus Finheaven VIP Donator

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    You're right about Orton - and thank heavens Ross stepped in; that was when I realized he was turning the corner as an owner. I still maintain that after the Harbaugh fiasco resulting in the Meatball being given more personnel say, it was probably Sparano fearful of losing his job (as it was obvious Ireland was safe at that point) who was the one lobbying hard for the player in Denver they called "3 and out Orton".

    However, if Philbin wanted Flynn for more than a stopgap, he wouldn't have offered him backup money. It's likely that as payback for Flynn being a good soldier for Philbin in GB, they went through the motions of extending him an offer so Seattle wouldn't think they were the only one who wanted him. I wouldn't doubt that for the same reason, they candidly told Flynn that they were drafting Tannehill with an eye toward the future.

    I don't give Ireland too much credit for passing on Kolb for a 2nd rounder.. even Rick Spielman wouldn't have bit on that one.

     
  36. Geforce

    Geforce FinHeaven VIP

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    When the Dolphins brought Flynn in he had just come off an 6 touchdown performance in the last game of the regular season and was not view as god awful by anyone.

    The Dolphins brought him in because he was familiar with Philbin's offense from their days in Green Bay.
     
  37. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/20...back-matt-flynn-west-coast-offense-chad-henne

    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/27/joe-philbin-ask-matt-flynn-why-hes-in-seattle/

    Anyways, i'll agree that we should be extremely thankful that Ross stepped in on Orton and that Ireland shouldnt get credit for not trading for Kolb.

    But if Ireland was influenced by Sparano to trade for Orton, then thats still on Ireland. Tony Sparano is a coach, not a scout. Its Irelands job to shut down horrible trades. Thankfully for us, Ross did his job for him.
     
  38. BringBackDan13

    BringBackDan13 Well-Known Member

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    I can't wait for all the articles to get out of the way and for free agency to start. Hopefully this is the year that we make a big splash.
     
  39. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    People cant have it both ways. Ireland cant deserve for passing on him and also deserve credit for trying to sign him.

    This forum swings to the extremes. People love to boast and crow about anything we do. Its why a select number of poster expect 7th round draft picks to become studs. Its why threads were started about how we STOLE from the Colts in the Vontae trade. Its not enough that we get a good player or deal, its that we have to humiliate everyone else. We have to prove to be smarter and better and etc, etc, etc. I get it, its human nature. I just find it amusingly shortsighted when it comes to our history.

    If people want to say Ireland deserves credit for bringing in as much "talent" at the quarterback positions as possible, then fair enough. Id even agree with that, as i felt we should double or triple up on the position(still do). But you cant also talk about how brilliant Ireland was(or how he completely pegged the market on Flynn, or any other game of semantics people are playing) for passing on some player who "was awful". We tried to sign him. We tried hard to sign him and revisionist history wont change that.
     
  40. Geforce

    Geforce FinHeaven VIP

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    Why can't people have it both ways? At the time Flynn was brought in, Matt Moore was the only veteran QB on the roster and team wanted to atleast bring in some competition for him and Flynn was thought to be the most logical choice since he was familiar with the offense being installed.

    There is no revisionist history going on. Once again, Flynn was not viewed by anyone as god awful when Ireland tried to sign him. The fact that Flynn was beat out for the starting job in Seattle by Wilson does not make him god awful or anything else.

    Yes Flynn was brought in. Yes Flynn was offered a contract the Ireland felt he was worth and Flynn decided to go elsewhere. If Ireland doesn't get credit for sticking to his guns, then who does?
     
  41. MIDolphins#1

    MIDolphins#1 Rookie

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  42. andyahs

    andyahs Bahamian Redneck Donator

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    What baggage does Wallace have?
     
  43. uk_dolfan

    uk_dolfan Founder of the FH Adam Gase fan club Moderator Finheaven VIP

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    If hes as good as Marshall he will be an amazing pickup, we didn't get rid of Marshall because of his production.
     
  44. thedayafter

    thedayafter Pro Bowler

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    Wallace is veiwed more as a major component... not an accessory like Reggie.... it's a good spend based on history... are they (RT/MW) going to explode out of the box next season... odds are... probably not.

    It's a step in the process... hope we take it.
     
  45. phinman1

    phinman1 Seriously now

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    Surely not brilliant.
     
  46. uk_dolfan

    uk_dolfan Founder of the FH Adam Gase fan club Moderator Finheaven VIP

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    Darlington is currently on the radio show on dolphins.com talking about Wallace, it seems the Dolphins are all in on Wallace and have been for some time.
     
  47. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    Well, okay, i suppose people can have it both ways. That Ireland is a genius because he passed on Flynn and hes a genius because he tried to sign Flynn. And no doubt Flynn was viewed as a stud when Miami was trying to sign him. And unsurprisingly, those same people viewed Flynn as hot garbage when he refused to sign with us. After all, Flynn was only brought up in this thread after someone pegged him into the "bad quarterback" catagory and suggested Ireland did a good job by not signing him.

    But as long as posters are so blatantly backwards and hilarious, i'll keep pointing it out. We all must stay amused.

    Personally, i liked Flynn. I still like Flynn. I thought we should have signed him and still do. Even had we signed him, i still would have advocated drafting a quarterback in the first round. Im for drafting another quarterback this year(in a late round). Then again, my opinion doesnt do a complete 180 based on what our general manager does.
     
  48. Dolphinokie

    Dolphinokie Active Member

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    WallIace would be a great deep threat but at WHAT price is he worth having??? I DONT want another Brandon marshall type BUST
     
  49. dlockz

    dlockz Hall Of Famer

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    Marshall as a player was never a bust here, us signing a guy who was always trouble and expecting less is the bust, horrible decision by Ireland on all accounts
     
  50. sinPHIN

    sinPHIN A True Fan

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    man I miss darlington being our beat writer.
     

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