For the Ireland Supporters

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Cleetus, Feb 26, 2013.

  1. Cleetus

    Cleetus Well-Known Member

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    I have made it known that I really would like a new GM and front office here but if Ireland can prove me wrong and get us into the playoffs next season I would change my opinion of him. For all the ireland supporters on this board I have a question- What would it take for you to want him out of here? Would another 6-10 or 7-9 season do it? Are you giving him another 2 more years no matter what?
     
  2. jtoomuch

    jtoomuch Apalled and aghast Donator

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    Undecided. I want to see what happens between now and opening day. IMO, he has a chance to redeem his rep.
     
  3. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    Ireland is bulletproof.

    He will always be considered the most qualified person for the job. Why? Because he currently has "Miami Dolphins" in front of his title. Its only when he loses those words will he be considered trash.
     
  4. erralyn

    erralyn Starter

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    I won't put words in their mouth, but my opinion is you will get few Ireland supporters who will state right now that they will withdraw their support after another sub-500 season. They will make sure they have wiggle room if he is retained.
     
  5. Ikema

    Ikema FinHeaven VIP

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    What you Ireland critics failed to realize is most fans loyalties lie deeper than your usual knee-jerk reactions. I could care less whether you're a dolphin fan or not, and why in the world would you think I would? You mean nothing to me, and you never have, and you never will unless you're willing to give me an incredibly large amount of money for nothing. I've been a dolphin fan since 1970, hell yeah I want them to win, but I go in anywhere regardless.
     
  6. uk_dolfan

    uk_dolfan Founder of the FH Adam Gase fan club Moderator Finheaven VIP

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    If we continue to show progress he stays.

    If we keep losing, thanks Jeff but lets see who Joe likes from the Packers.

    If he does get a new deal it will be highly amusing around here for a few days lol
     
  7. JFoxx

    JFoxx Seasoned Veteran

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    Not an Ireland supporter, but I don't think it's going to matter what he does. He obviously has photos of Ross in a very compromising scenario. That's the only way an incompetent GM who's resume repeatedly embraces .500 or sub .500 seasons. How many draft picks from the last 5-7 years are still around? How did our 2nd round picks (which are supposed to be your bread and butter guys) pan out for us? Those have to be some good pictures he has on Ross!
     
  8. The Omen

    The Omen Well-Known Member

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    This is Irelands 3rd year running the show on his own, he's set himself up nicely with the cap and picks. Considering we are 3 Dan Carpenter missed field goals away from a 9-7 season, I expect this team to go at least 9-7 to 10-6 this year. Playoffs or at least the same record as a playoff team but booted out due to tie breaker is the bare minimum to save his job.
     
  9. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    Just to clear up, we dont know if hes a "free agent". When they announced Ross had resigned Ireland, they refused to reveal the years. The media speculated that it was 2 years because thats how long Sparano's extension was. That rings false to me, as Ross made it apparent that he intended to keep Ireland after he fired Sparano(apparent because the Harbaugh thing...and the fact he did keep Ireland).
     
  10. Dolph N.Fan

    Dolph N.Fan A True Fan

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    No....it's win or get fired this year for Ireland. Not "this continuing to show progress" stuff. That could mean a 8-8 or 9-7 non playoff year this season but according to you that's showing progress and he stays. Playoffs or Ireland is gone this year. Period. No exceptions.
     
  11. uk_dolfan

    uk_dolfan Founder of the FH Adam Gase fan club Moderator Finheaven VIP

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    good for your. Doesnt change my view though. We wont be a playoff team this year its too big a gap in one year.
     
  12. The Omen

    The Omen Well-Known Member

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    we were still in playoff contention week 16 last year. We are on the cusp, and like I mentioned before Dan Carpenter single handedly blew 2 wins for us early in the season.
     
  13. AFCMiamiEast

    AFCMiamiEast A True Fan

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    Okay...? LOL.
     
  14. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    "We were playoff contenders, if only...."

    http://cache4.asset-cache.net/xc/92...FBB4F780774E5B98CC80FC0D29F8BD603737D618EA007

    "We were playoff contenders, if only...."

    [video=youtube;cRInQyUV16k]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRInQyUV16k[/video]

    "We were playoff contenders, if only Carpenter hadnt missed his kicks!"

    Same song, different year. Good teams are able to succeed even if their kickers screw the pooch a few times. For us it sinks our season.

    And had Carpenter really screwed us that badly, our general manager probably should have replaced him. Heck, Carpenter has been missing kicks for years, why were we put in this position in the first place?
     
  15. Anvil35

    Anvil35 Leave Users Titles Alone!! Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I have been a fan of his for one reason - I am a Dolphin fan, and I think he is still a member of the Miami Dolphins front office. I come to this site to get new information, not to proselytize. If I knew more than Mr. Ireland I would be in the business of football. Again, since some of the low information users here refuse to understand about control and decision making, they lay all of the blame for the Dolphins troubles at Irelands door. Parcells and Sporano drafted poorly during their time here - was Ireland GM, yes but Parcells was the FINAL decision maker then - put down the game controller and read something about Parcells and his well known decision making control - Were you in the room when Tuna and Tony said Pat White is next - Do you know for fact that Ireland agreed or maybe declined? Something we will never know - but the blame goes to Ireland because he was the GM...I think Mr. Ireland gets this year to prove his value. If he drafts as successfully this year as he has the last two there will be many disappointed users here at Finheaven.
     
  16. JFoxx

    JFoxx Seasoned Veteran

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    Yes, we all know that this as Ireland has indirectly already layed blame on Parcells for some past draft decisions. So we have an innept GM that had no true GM authority during most of Parcells tenure and now the last couple years he has??? Is that a better excuse for him or worse for defending his job ???? Sorry, but look at the history of deals he has and repeatedly has not made. Comments to prospective draft picks (your momma a prostitute?). Repeated comments from coaches who turned us down over the two years we were looking. Etc Etc.
    I wish people would stop defending this behavior!
     
  17. Etuoo33

    Etuoo33 Seasoned Veteran

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    The answer, 9 or 10 wins and playoff contention, period. This BS about the previous regimes is just that, BS. Ireland has set himself up to succeed with this draft... or not. I have been softly on the Ireland side of the fence for the past 2 years and see progress, but that's no longer enough. Many pieces are in place, some glaring holes exist so now it's time for him to earn his title.
     
  18. SouthPaul

    SouthPaul Well-Known Member

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    At this point it doesn't matter whether you like Ireland or don't like Ireland, he's our GM and we're stuck with him for better or worse. Best thing we can all do is hope for the best and give the new players our support.
     
  19. dcnr226

    dcnr226 A True Fan Donator

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    I don't find this issue that complicated. They chose a qb - and yes u could argue we should've drafted Matt Ryan - in Henne, he showed promise, so Ireland gave him time. It was the correct approach, just the wrong QB. He was given a do over, and so now, with the promise shown last season by Tannehill, the pressure is on to win and compete IN THE PLAYOFFS. And with the right offseason moves I feel that it's perfectly achievable
     
  20. NY8123

    NY8123 Sophisticated Redneck Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    I've seen enough, turn the corner of get the **** out. 8-8 or worse and he is gone, 9-7 depends on the how the 9-7 unfolds, 10-6 or better is what I want out of this team this year.
     
  21. ChambersWI

    ChambersWI Owner of the Palace of Wisdom Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I think Ireland has to see the team fight for a playoff spot, if not get it. Obviously something is different as Ireland has taken more scouts this year to the combine than he has in past years.
     
  22. Cleetus

    Cleetus Well-Known Member

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    I am guessing the people that answered by questioning fan status or by saying that they will root for the team through thick and thin have no criteria for the front office to meet. Also I realize that we as fans have no power to cause any change to the front office situation but we also have no power to enact imaginary trades and free agent pickups but we have fun doing that on this board as well. Thank you to all the people who actually gave an answer to the question posed, it helps me understand your point of view a little better.
     
  23. taz_butcher

    taz_butcher Rookie

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    I too am an old timer who doesn't believe in the knee jerk reaction. What will show up more is because this year he has cap and draft picks and no one looking over his shoulder like Parcells. If he falters then Ross should look to a replacement. He will still need help from coaches and scheduling. I do believe we go playoff this point forward.
     
  24. Wildbill3

    Wildbill3 Misery Loves Company Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    Bull****. sub-500 and he won't have any supporters. this is it. winning season and playoffs or he's gone.
     
  25. CRIOS

    CRIOS PERFECT PHINS '72 Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I have been opposed to Ireland in all the posts I have made on the forum and to be frank I need to chill out. Negative thinking is never the right way to go. I will thus think positively with the hopes that our GM will indeed make the right moves. We are all together on this - to make our Miami Dolphins a contender. So I am from this point looking at Ireland in a new way. He will get it done. We must believe he will...get it done.
     
  26. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    I suppose i didnt answer your original question, my apologies. Im not a Ireland supporter, but because of the history of this forum i feel erralyn hit the nail on the head. People might be filled with conviction now, but give themselves wiggle room to change their "vote" after next season.

    When we have a losing season next year i feel fans will suggest our draft class showed potential and give the team a mulligan because of how hard our schedule is. They will advocate keeping him because of the "quality" of the rookies he brought in. If he is actually fired, i believe those same fans will slam him relentlessly. I base this prediction on the behavior i witnessed after Sparano was fired.
     
  27. Daytona Fin

    Daytona Fin Playoffs Moderator Finheaven VIP

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    IMO, we need to make the playoffs. I want ireland to succeed and I don't like to sit around criticize him for his mistakes in the past. I just want everything to work out for the better of our team and I hope ireland is our successful gm for the next 5-10 years. However if we don't land a spot in the playoffs this year , I believe it is time to make a change at our gm position in 2014.
     
  28. CRIOS

    CRIOS PERFECT PHINS '72 Finheaven VIP Donator

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    In truth, is it Ireland's fault that we did not make the playoffs last season or is Carpenter's fault? Those field goals would of given us a winning season last year. And yes I understand that Ireland did select Carpenter in his first year as a Dolphin GM. Still...
     
  29. AJAYFIEDLY

    AJAYFIEDLY Member

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  30. CRIOS

    CRIOS PERFECT PHINS '72 Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Which post? My post?
     
  31. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    He could have built a team that scored touchdowns instead of one that relied on fieldgoals. He could have cut Carpenter during the offseason due to previous seasons mistakes. He could have cut Carpenter during the season when he began to act shaky.

    Carpenter is only playing up to his level of talent. Its up to Ireland to determine if that level of talent is acceptable for his team. Ireland determined it was. He clearly misevaluated the situation.
     
  32. CRIOS

    CRIOS PERFECT PHINS '72 Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Yes. A better team. One that would not have but us in such a situation. Good point.
     
  33. flynryan15

    flynryan15 A True Fan Donator

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    How many games did we win from other teams miscues? It goes both ways.
     
  34. BC26

    BC26 Active Member

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    This is going to take time. You can't put a specific number of wins or he's out on this season. We currently have the second youngest team and we will be very young again this year. The cap room and significant number of picks is by design. We (Ireland, Philbin, Ross and the fans) are building a winner here. Get on board or get out of the way! The thing I hate to see on these forums is when fans drum up every 30+ veteran that gets released by another team and feel like we need to have them...Michael Turner, Cullen Jenkins...etc. Let the team build a young team that will compete for a long time. If we kick Ireland out the door, then you can say good-bye to Philbin and Tannehill. There will be a whole new regime and we will be starting all over again. Like we've been doing over and over since Shula walked out the door. You need to keep in mind, too, the devil you know may be better than the devil you don't. I support Ireland and look forward to the winning that is coming our way as this time matures together.
     
  35. flynryan15

    flynryan15 A True Fan Donator

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    Yeah well the "we have the second youngest team" excuse got old in 2009-10 around these parts.
     
  36. The Omen

    The Omen Well-Known Member

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    Wow, your hatred for Ireland is so deep it has deluted your sense of reality. Carpenter, until last year was one of the most clutch FG kickers in the league. Missing 3 game winners is Carpenters fault, NOT Ireland's. Boy oh boy.
     
  37. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    Drinking Irelands koolaid must have caused memory loss.

    In 2011 he missed 3 field goals in 2 weeks. One was during a 16-17 loss to Cleveland.
    In 2010 he missed 7 field goals in 4 weeks. One was also during a Browns loss, this time 10-13. He went 0/4 against the Bills, we ended up losing that game by 3 points(guess what peoples excuse was after that season?).

    Carpenter has been shaky for years. At times, hes shown he can be a quality kicker. But he cant sustain that quality for an entire season. He goes through streaks of misses. When it costs us multiple games over multiple seasons, thats Irelands fault for not cutting him.

    And all of that ignores the fact that we rely way to much on field goals to win games.
     
  38. Tureo

    Tureo Seasoned Veteran

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    This debate always seem to end the same way with both factions on the extreme sides holding their stance that Ireland sucks or that he is doing great. Then those in between will take a more reasonable approach of win now or he needs to pack his bags. We've seen this over and over again with Wanny, Tony, Cam, Saban, Fiedler, Feeley, and on and on. I personally look at all the picks and money from both sides. Of course it is great but it also represents the hole he and Tuna put the team in.
     
  39. BC26

    BC26 Active Member

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    So are you suggesting we sign a handful of older veterans so that we aren't young? You must be one of the guys that thinks we should chase Cullen Jenkins and Michael Turner. The average age of the team will go up, so naturally we will win more games, right?
     
  40. NYinBostonFin

    NYinBostonFin Playoffs Please!!

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    Most SB and playoff teams have a mix of solid veterans as well as youth. Not saying to sign Cullen or Turner, but experience on this team in the lockerroom would be far from a detriment.
     
  41. flynryan15

    flynryan15 A True Fan Donator

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    No I'm suggesting it is the same old tired excuses! Guess what those young players from 08, 09&10 are one the way out the door.
     
  42. endorPHINS72

    endorPHINS72 Restore the greatness!

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    Uh, no. My loyalty is to the Miami Dolphins and if I believe the person in charge of bringing in talent over the last five years hasn't done a good job of it, then I want that person gone. A five year analysis of his work isn't knee-jerk. Is Jeff Ireland the worst GM in the league? I don't believe so. But I don't believe he has the eye to consistently bring enough talent to make this team a Super Bowl team.
     
  43. DeathStar

    DeathStar Hall Of Famer

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    Well said.
     
  44. ohall

    ohall A Miami Dolphins fan, not a players fan.

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    I wouldn't have minded if Ireland was let go before last year, but when we retained him IMO at that point we were stuck with him for a minimum of 2-years. I don't believe in turning things over again and again. IMO it's one of the main reasons our franchise has suffered the last 10-years or so.

    I won't say if we don't make the play-offs he needs to go, but we need to be at least 9-7 and there needs to be a positive feeling about where the franchise is heading. Especially concerning our offense, and with Tannehill's progress within that offense. I'd also like to add it's more important to have a positive feeling than the results of final record. Ireland shares in a lot of the blame when the TUNA was here, but the TUNA was such an egomaniac it only seems fair to allow Ireland a little rope to hang himself. If that positive feeling is not there, as much as I hate it, I say we throw them ALL OUT and start all over again.
     
  45. roy_miami

    roy_miami 2020 cant get here soon enough Donator

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    Omar actually said on wqam this season Irelands contract ran through 2015 (maybe 2016, don't remember exactly), he said it all nonchalantly and I remember the host freaking out, the conversation went something like this:

    Host: Well we'll see what happens when Ireland's contract is up after next season..
    Omar: His contract isn't up until 2015
    Host: WHAT!?! BACK UP, WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!?!
    Omar: Huh, you didn't know that, I thought it was common knowledge. Oh yeah, he's under contract through 2015.


    Take that for what its worth, it was a strange conversation and I have no links but Omar seemed to think Ireland would be under contract for at least 2 more seasons.
     
  46. ohall

    ohall A Miami Dolphins fan, not a players fan.

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    Where I always get confused is why would someone who is a Dolphins fan support Ireland? I assume none of us are his family. I guess I miss the connection. Are you implying those ppl just love anything that has the Miami Dolphins in front of it? If so, how insulting is that?

    For me the way I see it is the ppl who are always calling for ppl to get fired or whatever are just frustrated GM's. Short of winning a title the same ppl do the same things. I've seen it since 1997 on these MBoards. It seems at times they think they know more than the paid professionals. I tend to think the ppl who support what we have simply try and deal with the reality of the situation. Even if we don't like the decision, the Dolphins are still our team, why make it a negative thing? This is supposed to be our hobbies, yes? I guess I don't understand the frame of mind.
     
  47. ohall

    ohall A Miami Dolphins fan, not a players fan.

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    I think specifically with this subject, this seems to be the root issue. You either believe the TUNA had final say when he was here or you don't. If you believe the TUNA was in TOTAL control, you tend to give Ireland a bit more leeway. And if you believe Ireland has been in control the entire time, it's understandable to not see any upside there.

    My thing is the TUNA hired Ireland, and the TUNA has such a large ego there's no way IMO he would even allow Jesus to make the final call.
     
  48. finfan54

    finfan54 A True Fan Donator

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    For the life of me, I listen to people bash Ireland, then I see your answers to solve the problem and all I see is Madden.

    But I got news for you all, you can poo poo the man all you want, but it will do no good, you know why? Cus we are going places! Joe Philbin is the reason why, then Ryan Tannehill.

    We are so set up to succeed its not funny and timing is everything is my favorite cliche.

    Last year all I heard was all about Ireland and how bad he is and how we shouldnt draft RT. Then after the draft, everything Ireland dissapeared. You people were no where to be seen. Your like leeches.

    Fact is, Ireland's downfall is he started out a rookie GM under Parsells toutalage. Then he set out to collaboratively work with Sparano to get guys with some of them guys Sparano pounded the table for.

    Well, here we are today and the guy running this football team is Joe Philbin. Most people didnt even want the guy and thought he looked like the old Miami U coach and made a little fun of him. Well, Philbin is well respected around the league and you should clearly have seen the difference in drafts from last year to Sparano years. This year should be even better but of course, he will get poo pooed until reality sinks in again and what you will soon realize is that we will be playng with more of a full deck as opposed to Legadu no no starting. I cant even friggin believe we were a couple of FG's and a close game with Indy and SF away from actually doing something starting out with friggin legadu naanee!!!!!

    People who hate Ireland will always hate Ireland. It doesnt matter what we do next year even if we go to the playoffs, once you hate someone, thats it, you dont change your mind. Your just fooling yourself. If you cant see the progress, you wont see it next year. But Joe Philbin will be the real reason for success because Ireland works closely with his HC to buy the groceries. You should love that in these days of the ego. To think that people cannot see that Pouncey was a great pick because its not a skill position, as if you need to draft a skill position in round one no matter what according to what the media sets as the value of what a friggin football player is.

    whateva! Im just going to enjoy this offseason knowing I got a QB, and if we land Swope, we got ourselves a real playmaker that no one even thinks belongs in the 2nd round cus he doesnt sound great! hehehehe! whateva!
     
  49. phintim

    phintim Seasoned Veteran

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    Why I support Ireland this year is because of last years draft class plus Philbin. I counted 10 college rookies contributing on last years roster. All the Ireland hater conveniently overlook Thigpen a free agent pickup last year and bring up the missed and toward the end of the year I like the street free agents like Patterson and some of the young college free agent offensive line men. He also resigned Wake and Pual S. good moves. In reality and I have said this many times I thought RT and Philbin were bad decisions last year and I posted I felt Ireland was on a very short leash and would volunteer to run him out of town. Well I cannot blame the guy on one hand and not give him credit on the other like most of Ireland haters continently do. Moving on I also believe that many of our losses were a product of Tony S after seeping him perform with the Jets. Ok that covers reasons to support the guy.

    First Ireland needs to close as many holes as possible with as many of our own free agents as he can reasonably afford to do. Recently they polled the top 50 NFL free agents and the Phins had 20 percent of them.
    I believe that Clemons, Fasano should be retained because they are cheap (3 million per year each) and fill voids until replacements can be found, Starks they should use the franchise tag on him he has been a good player but is getting older so the tag fits him pretty well, Sean Smith would be my next target if he is willing to stay and be reasonable I would hate to pay him 8 million but I would because loosing Davis last year and Smith just leaves to large a hole, next target would be Hartline at 5 million and either Bush or Moore at around 5 million to decide to choose to sign from and I would go with bush first as he provide another weapon instead of a replacement with approximate 10 million to spend on Wallace. Restructure the contracts of Marshall and Patterson would give us the room for the rookie class. We have holes at tackle and backup QB which Ireland has to roll for in the draft.
    This leaved us in a better postion to attempt to draft the best player available but let face it this team would still have needs at DE pass rusher, CB, OT and TE. If Irland did all of the above or appeared to have really tried to make it happen and get the same amount of college rookies to make the team this year as well as last then I say Ireland has done his job regardless of losses. I personally have concerns that Sherman might be more of a problem than a solution. I would say if Ireland could pull off a really good DE in the first round, TE and CB in then second round, OL and Safty in third, RB in 4th if Bush is not resigned, 5th round would be a QB or LB according to if Moore is signed and in the 7th round kicker and probably another LB. If all but let's say like last year 2 do not make the team plus let's say 3 college free agent rookies from this year or last year make the team then guys it is a success. You keep Ireland and start evaluating the coaching staff.
     
  50. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    Im more than implying that, i bluntly stated it in an earlier post. Every organization has individuals who feel it can do no wrong. Every company has yes men. People deify those they admire, even if the thing the person is famous for has nothing to do with ethics. You find that offensive, i say its human behavior. Its just a behavior i have very little regard for. As someone who forms my opinions based on evidence and logic, i find peoples sycophantic tendencies to be frustrating, albeit one i recognize.

    And football, and the Miami Dolphins specifically, are hobbies. Some of us like our hobbies to be fun. We have an emotionally attachment to our hobby because at one point in time it was fun. Its not fun when the Miami Dolphins lose. In order to have fun again, we would like them to win. If someone had the hobby of building model planes they wouldnt want the planes to come out flawed. If someone had the hobby of sailing boats they wouldnt want the boat to only be in stuck in place.
    As well, just because something is a hobby doesnt mean we are blind to reality. The Miami Dolphins are, at the moment, a bad team. Thats reality. Only saying great things about a bad team isnt "trying to deal with the reality", its indulging in denial.
     

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