Handing out big $$$ to Branch & Kiko instead of committing that money to a guard??

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Snoop, Aug 20, 2017.

  1. rent this space

    rent this space Starter Finheaven VIP

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    last year Miami was top 10 in rushing offense and sacks allowed, meanwhile they were 30th in run D and tied for 19th in sacks. I think I would invest on Defense, too
     
  2. Spiff

    Spiff Starter Finheaven VIP

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    The guard situation and the extensions of Branch, Stills and Alsonso do not correlate with each other. Having said that, the FO did address the guards with signing Laursen and drafting Asiata.
     
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  3. DuderinoN703

    DuderinoN703 We? What the **** we? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Next year it's imperative Miami drafts a QB and a C in their first few picks. I would invest in a G as well.
     
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  4. Asicswrg85

    Asicswrg85 A True Fan

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    No because that means if half (16) of the teams play a 4-3 and have 2 DEs (32), that means he is the 9th out of 32 highest paid starting DE. That means 72% of starting DEs make less than him. That is my point! Not to mention Cam Wake is also top 5 on that list, oh and should we mention Suh?
     
  5. Asicswrg85

    Asicswrg85 A True Fan

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    Is "want to reward him for reasons not seen on a stat sheet" helping your case? I think that is exactly the issue this thread is bringing up. You shouldnt pay guys who dont perform at that level. Meaning, if you pay him as the 9th highest DE in the league, he better be the 9th best (which he clearly isnt).
     
  6. J. David Wannyheimer

    J. David Wannyheimer 5 Years of Posting Excellence. Finheaven VIP Donator

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    You have a great point, but our offense didn't put up those numbers because of great blocking. Jay Ajayi had a ridiculous number of yards after contact (i.e., he broke tackles at or behind the LoS) and we severely limited our exposure to opposing pass rushes by running the ball more and throwing lots of screens / running play action.

    There's also the fact that our excellent starting LG moved to LT and we replaced him with... a guy off the street who has never been very good.
     
  7. Digital

    Digital Starter

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    I realize you were asking Snoop, not me, but I think he was referring to the 1st round tender we placed on Kiko prior to signing him to a long term deal. If any other team had signed him they would have owed us a 1st round draft choice.

    It was a temporary solution, but both options were good options, either a low salary year with Kiko, or a 1st round pick (which no team would have done) if a team were foolish enough to sign him for more money.

    The problem is that we wanted him here long term, and that move would have most likely caused him to leave Miami next year.

    Hope that helps clear things up.
     
  8. rent this space

    rent this space Starter Finheaven VIP

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    I would agree but we will still have Ajayi in 2017 and we can have the same approach as to avoiding sacks. imo, the Guard situation, while not great, was not bad enough to choose over the horrendous run defense and thin pass rush
     
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  9. Always Next Year

    Always Next Year Starter

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    He's not 9th, he's 12th, just behind Wake (11th).

    It's also important to remember that Branch just signed his new deal, he will move further down the list as players sign new deals.

    Of players listed above Branch on this list, three of their teams run 3-4 (HOU, NYJ, PIT)

    http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/defensive-end/


    Crawford from DAL, makes more than Branch, has 1 less sack, 20 fewer tackles, 2 less FF, had 3 more starts
    Hughes from BUF, makes more than Branch, had half a sack more, 1 less tackle, 1 less FF, had 4 more starts
    Wolfe from DEN, makes more than Branch, same sack, 2 more tackles, 2 less FF, had 3 more starts
    Curry from PHI, makes more than Branch, ZERO starts with 16 games played, nuff said

    Aside from Wake, you have to go up to Michael Bennett from SEA before you find a player that is much better than Branch, and he makes over $10 million, when you go higher from there the salaries really start to jump up, with Olivier Vernon making $17.2 million (ouch!).

    Based on these metrics, Andre Branch is a VALUE for what we signed him to, especially when you remember he just signed his deal, and other deals will go higher in the years to come.
     
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  10. Snoop

    Snoop A True Fan

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    I agree. It's sad that next offseason we'll basically have the same needs we had this offseason: multiple interior OL, DT, CB, Safety. Could need a TE again if we cut Julius Thomas.
     
  11. Yessir

    Yessir Dolfan for Life Donator

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    Every last team in NFL has to repeat off seasons addressing the same needs year after year. This is a league with a 100 percent injury rate, and s salary capped sport to boot. It's going to happen.
     
  12. Snoop

    Snoop A True Fan

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    The smart route to take would've been to give Kiko the low tender (1 year, $1.8M), signed Warford or Leary, sign Alex Okafor to the same 1 year $3M deal the Saints gave him and same deal we gave Branch last year, we still trade for Hayes and draft Harris. This saves us a couple mil on the cap this year but about $10M next year, with the front 7 virtually the same as current day and we get a bolstered OL. Maybe Landry would already be signed had we done it this way.
     
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  13. Superself

    Superself If you want to, we can supply you.

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    I think he is getting paid exactly where he is ranked. You seem to think Branch is a bust DE not worth his new contract. Based on what? Gase has him starting and I haven't seen any reason he shouldn't be.
    Please enlighten us with his glaring faults and reasons why he shouldn't start.
     
  14. FanMarino

    FanMarino HOF Pass Master

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    Negative Vibe Merchant Of The Month Award goes to...... cheer up!
     
  15. Atila

    Atila Atila - the freshmaker. Finheaven VIP

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    I'm not totally against them having waited on Kiko, but I didn't hate the deal either. With that said, your Patriots comparison is pretty off base. The Patriots investment in Gilmore has less to do with what they're paying Butler and more to do with their ability to coach up players playing beyond their contracts - how much money do they have invested in their OL? Or in their receivers? Or in their running backs?

    Butler is going to get paid, and they're gonna be paying premium money to both guys. They'll also maybe end up paying an extra small premium to lock in Butler next season (contract inflation), but being they're in win-now mode they are playing it correctly.

    We aren't the Patriots and we aren't built anywhere like them. They need to play each season by ear because they should be the favorite every year. It's a very unique position to be in, but you handle roster decisions a little differently when the short term is so important for your squad.
     
  16. Sons Of Shula

    Sons Of Shula not a dull boy Hammered Super Donator Finheaven VIP Donator

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    We used zone running plays almost 80% of the time last year. It'll be similar this season. It won't change b/c of a single rookie lineman. Main reason being it's Ajayi's preference as well.
     
  17. miamiron

    miamiron A True Fan

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    You forgot the offense was
    31st in total 3rd downs converted(69)....31st in the NFL

    Total Overall first downs 278 (31st again)

    Offensive plays per game ("LAST" in the NFL with 57)

    Offensive time of possession (27th)

    4TH downs converted (32nd last in the NFL)

    Yards per game average (25th )

    1ST quarter points per game (31st)

    2nd Quarter Points/Game (24th)

    1st quarter time of possession ( 32nd LAST in the NFL)

    1st Half Time of Possession Share % (31st)

    Team QB Sacked Percentage (23rd)

    Passing First Downs per Game (27th)

    Team Rushing First Downs per Game (22nd)

    Might want to reconsider
     
  18. Superself

    Superself If you want to, we can supply you.

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    Nahhh, I think Gase and the FO still made the right moves.
     
  19. tay0365

    tay0365 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP Donator

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    That could also be misleading, because a 3-4 DE is probably a 4-3 DT with different responsibilities. Then the question becomes of those 8 that are being paid more then Branch, how many can rush the passer (Pass-rushers are paid premium money), as well as hold up at the point of attack against the run.

    Branch, though not exactly a great pass-rusher, did show enough to warrant a new contract, considering how well he also can play the run. Might be a bit more then we would hope for, but he is still young, and could develop into a premium player in Miami, which would then make the contract a steal.
     
  20. rent this space

    rent this space Starter Finheaven VIP

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    I was going for things more directly associated with the O-line
     
  21. Snoop

    Snoop A True Fan

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    That decision is looking real stupid right now. Tannenbaum for executive of the year lmao
     
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  22. gunn34

    gunn34 Pro Bowler

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    Kiko needs to be cut before the 4th quarter starts
     
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  23. joeylats

    joeylats Well-Known Member

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    Kiko sux,let Timmons go back to Pittsburgh.Give Allen a chance.Howard blows
     
  24. Highzenga

    Highzenga Well-Known Member

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    Guards are the two least important positions on the field. Hypothetically, we should be able to find two decent enough guards in the middle to late rounds to start. I mean, every other team does it. Somehow, we haven’t been able to do so lol
     
  25. mmikel30

    mmikel30 Starter

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    Exactly this!,
     
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  26. Travis34

    Travis34 chea Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Did you see Kiko with his like half assed shoulder / lightly back into a guy earlier on a tackle attempt? I think in the first quarter. Wow, pathetic.

    Not a good game at all by him. I still think he can be an okay / average (at times above average) player, but not tonight
     
  27. DolfanDuBbZ~

    DolfanDuBbZ~ Avoid the 'Noid

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    I'd gladly take a Cody Whitehair over X Howard right now.
     
  28. Asicswrg85

    Asicswrg85 A True Fan

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    Agreed. I said it last offseason, paying Branch that kind of money was ridiculous. There's nothing good about him
     
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  29. Jerrysanders

    Jerrysanders A True Fan

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    Did SOS get banned ?
     
  30. SQuinn17

    SQuinn17 League Dominator

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    Andre Branch is invisible this year.
     
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  31. finmann

    finmann Pro Bowler

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    Yes, yes, yes......and until we make those moves this team will never go anywhere.
     
  32. NorFlaFin

    NorFlaFin PowerHungryMo'fo

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    I did not bump this thread but it appears half of Finheaven has crystal ball the other half just apologizes for not having a crystal ball.
     
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  33. vcip

    vcip Starter Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I really would like to see Tunsil Pouncy Brendel Asiata Davis for the remainder
    Yes i know Pouncy and his time at G was not good but if we get decent performance this way we only need to fill 1 OL position and we at least know what we got

    Just one thing...Gase needs to gameplan to give these guys the best chance to succeed
    Keep D guessing
    More Gray less Thomas
    More Drake less Williams
    More I formation with FB
    Slants
    Crossing patterns
    RB screens
     
  34. Michael Scott

    Michael Scott A True Fan

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    This money should have been saved for Landry, and/or used for a guard or two. Two of the biggest bonehead contracts I've seen in a while.

    Kiko is absolutely garbage as a football player -- he sucked when he had trash around him, and he sucks now with better players around him. Branch was mediocre last season and hasn't done **** since getting that contract. Two fringe backup players who are being paid like Pro Bowlers. Disgusting.

    We had Kiko for cheap for another year to evaluate him. They should have let Branch walk knowing they were going to spend their top pick on a DE.
     
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  35. Michael Scott

    Michael Scott A True Fan

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    He was invisible half the time last season. He's pretty much the player he's always been.
     
  36. datruth55

    datruth55 Starter Finheaven VIP

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    Pouncey can't play OG...and I thought Larsen looked decent out there especially considering it was his first game back in 9 weeks. We need to move from Pouncey and the faster the better...the real question is what does the front office think cause they haven't exactly put any real effort into fixing this O-line. If they think all they need is a tweek and not an overhaul then they're as delusional as I think they are.
     
  37. vcip

    vcip Starter Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Eagles did
     
  38. CaSh

    CaSh Nothing bigga than the B

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    I hate Kiko right now. I want him cut. Either he is injured of has quit on the team. Absolutely dreadful awareness, effort and tackling out there. He made at least 15 mistakes last night I don't know if they can watch the tape as a unit with him in the room. Good god he was bad!
     
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  39. Snoop

    Snoop A True Fan

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    Saints as well, they just ran all over the Bills with Warford paving the way
     
  40. Snoop

    Snoop A True Fan

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    You guys remember who I wanted instead of Branch? He came for a visit, signed with another team, smaller deal than Branch, PFF's #9 edge defender, and #2 against the run.

    You don't even wanna know what Branch is ranked.
     

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