I think one thing we ALL can agree on is that Tannehill, regardless of his ceiling,

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by BGtoKNfor6, Nov 24, 2013.

  1. BGtoKNfor6

    BGtoKNfor6 Where is the reset button?

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    cannot accurately throw the long ball. The kid can hit pretty much every other throw and has a high ceiling (assuming we get some good qb coaching) but in the end his deep ball is not that good and accuracy is nothing you can teach. He isn't the first qb to not be able to hit a solid deep ball but with an offense predicated on the deep ball big play and leveraging part of your future on Mike Wallace, it makes you wonder how this is going to play out. Can we win without the money play we thought we had? I am not so sure in the long run.

    Other than that, he doesn't play defense or kick field goals or isn't an official. So, nice team loss.
     
  2. The Tannehills Have Eyes

    The Tannehills Have Eyes A True Fan

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  3. Yessir

    Yessir Dolfan for Life Donator

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    His ceiling is Jake Plummer. That's not high. He blows.
     
  4. Miami 13

    Miami 13 Pro Bowler

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    I close my eyes when he throws deep because I can't take seeing how off target he is and I close my eyes when ANY opponents QB throws deep because they always place it in the bread basket. Thus is the life of a Dolphins fan.
     
  5. J. David Wannyheimer

    J. David Wannyheimer 5 Years of Posting Excellence. Finheaven VIP Donator

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    The 60 yard bomb at the end of the game was catchable. Just saying.
     
  6. Dick Pepperwood

    Dick Pepperwood A True Fan

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    Average. One TD pass a game is not going to cut it. And for all you Mike Wallace Haters. Dude is open 24/7. Just need a QB who can throw a Long Ball
     
  7. Daytona Fin

    Daytona Fin Playoffs Moderator Finheaven VIP

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    ignorance running rampant in this thread
     
  8. Dick Pepperwood

    Dick Pepperwood A True Fan

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    Should have never came to that if he could have hit Wallace 3 other times during the Game instead of settling for Field Goals. Well if you like Settling, you will Love the Dolphins
     
  9. DeathStar

    DeathStar Hall Of Famer

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    Should have sucked for luck

    You guys enjoy those past wins?

    Hahahahajs
     
  10. MadDog 88

    MadDog 88 TANNERECTION!!!! Donator

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    Absolutely. Unless you have an agenda.
     
  11. BGtoKNfor6

    BGtoKNfor6 Where is the reset button?

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    How high was Trent Dilfer's ceiling? That is just one example of a qb that wasn't all that great but won a superbowl. Hell you can even make the argument from the guys that went to a superbowl and lost. Much of your success in the NFL is indeed predicated on the qb, however I can give you plenty of HOF qb examples of guys who would tell you it definitely a team game due to the lack of a single winner ring on their finger...
     
  12. LANGER72

    LANGER72 A True Fan

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    I am starting to think that way too. The deep ball was there all day. On the two that connected, they should have been 6 points each.
    I understand that we have had nothing at QB for the last decade, but RT has to make those throws. If he can't, he will be the guy until a better QB comes along.
    Keep drafting QB's. Let him compete until he either improves or is replaced.
     
  13. PALMA

    PALMA A very famous spit

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    I don't see why everyone is so quick to want to keep the guy. The quicker we see he's mediocre (which he clearly is showing us that he is), the quicker we can draft another.

    We have to keep drafting Quarterbacks until we hit. Tannehill is not that guy.

    We should be 11-5 with this schedule, but won't.
     
  14. Geordie

    Geordie A True Fan

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    Wallace made it catchable
     
  15. DrMom9900

    DrMom9900 Well-Known Member

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    How'd we lose?! We had the lead! Derp.
     
  16. shoveyjoe2442

    shoveyjoe2442 Well-Known Member

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    And yet he didn't

    ---------- Post added at 04:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:45 PM ----------

    The defense allowed a 80 yard drive. Tannehill is average but he didn't lose the game. Oline is in shambles, kicker misses kicks, defense folds.
     
  17. gofins60

    gofins60 A True Fan

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    This offense only plays in the first half.
     
  18. HoneyB

    HoneyB A True Fan

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    It was pretty plain to see.
     
  19. Phindog

    Phindog A True Fan

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    Love how the OP speaks for everyone....
     
  20. Elle Clouds

    Elle Clouds A True Fan

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    It was catchable after Mike Wallace had to contort his body. There were at least 4 times that Wallace was wide open down field to only be under thrown. I hate that Wallace is dropping the ball, but Tannehill leaves a lot to be desired from the quarterback position. If you can't throw the deep ball accurately, you will be a dink and dunker and I don't want that for my team. Get him some competition next year and see what he can do. He was handed this job by Sherman, Philbin and Ireland. He didn't not win it or deserve it apparently.
     
  21. BGtoKNfor6

    BGtoKNfor6 Where is the reset button?

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    Love how you actually managed to not contribute a thing to this thread so why bother?
     
  22. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Premium Member

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    That was 63 yards thru the air. An incredible throw. Rare throw. It would have taken an incredible play from Wallace to make that catch and score the TD (being tackled short would have resulted in the clock running out), but that's just testament to the situation they were in. They were in a situation where they needed to make an incredible throw and incredible catch to end up with an incredible result.

    The premise of this thread is off base. Ryan Tannehill has some real problems and I'm not anymore convinced that he's going to end up elite than I was before the draft. But people are barking up the wrong tree on this deep throw stuff.
     
  23. J. David Wannyheimer

    J. David Wannyheimer 5 Years of Posting Excellence. Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I'd love to read your thoughts on Tannehill's deep passes in this game, because he is being crucified on this site for them, whereas I honestly think two of them were ****ing incredible and one of them was still pretty good (the completion that wasn't a TD).
     
  24. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Premium Member

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    Sure.

    1. Tannehill made good on his promise to "let it rip". Every deep throw was thrown with more power and distance than the tendency he'd shown in Weeks 1 thru 10.

    2. A note on throwing distances. Football games are not some distance throw competition where you've got a light breeze at best (or you're in a dome) and you're in your sport shorts and a t-shirt, where you're able to run up to a line at your leisure and shotput the ball anywhere onto a 15-yard wide landing strip. Football conditions are different. You've got pads on, you've got a pocket, you're in a drop back, you can't throw the ball at your leisure, you can't run up to the throw like it's some javelin throw. There may be wind. Even in the DISTANCE THROW setting (which is not a football setting), I've seen tons of pro level QBs fail to get the ball 60 yards. For example recently in a competition featuring pro prospects like Mike Glennon, Ryan Nassib, Jordan Rodgers and E.J. Manuel, only Manuel managed to get it 60-plus yards (63 yards as I recall) and Glennon only got it 54 yards (and he's known as a guy that has a strong arm). Drew Brees couldn't get it 60 yards in a distance throw competition. I believe his ball fell down at about 56 yards. As I recall, Jake Delhomme won a distance throw competition one year against the likes of Brees, Palmer and someone else with a 63 yard throw. Those were strong arms he was competing against. In a football game, connecting on a 60 yard throw is INCREDIBLY rare. It's rare you ask your QB to throw that far in a functional football setting. Dan Marino sure as hell rarely, if ever, did that. Hell Ryan Mallett has a freakshow arm and I tracked every deep ball he threw in his final year and never found one that exceeded 52 yards, and that was just one throw. Everything else was 45 yards or so.

    3. The first deep throw, the one for a TD, ended up underthrown but again this was a timing issue as Tannehill waited for a point in his roll-out at which he was comfortable he could get under the ball. He threw it about 53-54 yards thru the air at a dead run to his right side. That's a throw that would have pushed every quarterback in the league to his limit, given the roll. The reason it went for the TD is because Wallace located the ball in the air early and adjusted to it very well, then finished the play. He hasn't done those things very often in 2013. And if you REALLY watch all his deep throws from 2012 in Pittsburgh (I'm sending you a PM), then you'll notice he didn't do them that year, either.

    4. The second deep throw for a 57-yard bomb was 60 yards in distance. A RARE throw distance for any QB of any arm strength, in pro or college football. Yet the ball was underthrown. Why? Look at the backfield action and then look at the route. This was not just any ole play-action. This was a play-action from under center with a half-roll that was a result of an off-center mesh point between the quarterback and running back. The play-fake delayed the football from coming out of Tannehill's hands tremendously. Meanwhile Wallace runs a simple "out and up" that was a heck of a lot more "up" than "out". I'm not blaming him, he's probably coached to run that route exactly as he did and it faked the HELL out of Captain Munnerlyn. He ran it perfect. The problem is he's too damned fast. He's way up the field by the time Tannehill can even throw that ball. Tannehill throws him a downright RARE distance, and it's still a big time underthrow. That, my friends, is an issue of play design.

    5. There was another deep throw that Tannehill missed on the overthrow. I still haven't gotten the chance to break this one down. There's rumors Wallace stumbled on the play and that could certainly explain an overthrow. But even aside from that, people do not realize how COMMON it is to not connect on guys that deep down the field. Completion rate league-wide on throws 41+ yards beyond the line of scrimmage is in the 20 to 30 percent range. All week Tannehill has had people giving him crap for underthrows, including the coaches who instructed him to "let it rip" this week. Is a 1 or 2 yard overthrow REALLY not expected to happen at some point, given that?

    6. The final throw was a real beauty. Ball traveled about 63 yards through the air and Tannehill could barely even step into it because he was about to be MURDERED with a hit. Wallace got his head around to look for the ball late (he does that a lot) and so he traveled left-to-right a little too far before figuring out where the football was and twirling back to the other side to catch it. This was was an incredible throw, and it would have taken an INCREDIBLE catch effort by Wallace to make the catch, because of the situation. If he goes down short of the end zone, the game is over. He needed to make a great adjustment on the football, finish the catch, stay on his feet and go the rest of the way into the end zone. It's just not something you see players do often. But then, you also don't often see receivers making $12 million a year.
     
  25. Namor

    Namor Pro Bowler Finheaven VIP

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    This,my friends is the sound of the Tannehill haters getting bitched slapped.
     
  26. Heinegrabber

    Heinegrabber Since 84 Finheaven VIP

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    Again accuracy is not the problem timing is.
    Wallcace is open 15 to 20 yards from the LOS the ball should be in the air.
    The ball should be released well before he is at the top of the route.
    If it was accuracy the passes would not be catchable.
     
  27. royalshank

    royalshank Scout Team Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Analyze all we want. He needs to hit Wallace and Clay on those plays. Period.
     
  28. J. David Wannyheimer

    J. David Wannyheimer 5 Years of Posting Excellence. Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Did you even watch the replay? Clay broke off the route. Tannehill threw it deep, and Clay came back. If Tannehill 'hits clay' on that play, it means he would have thrown it back underneath, and it would have hit a defender in the friggin' back.
     
  29. HoneyB

    HoneyB A True Fan

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    I'm not sure what all this breakdown is about. We all watched, we know he struggles connecting with Wallace on the deep ball. Of course there's things like pressure, timing, wind, etc, but that's football and every QB contends with that. The announcers rolled out some ridiculous stat, and the percentage of 20 plus yards completed balls were very low for Tannehill.

    The name of the game is touchdowns. How they get there is the coaches problem. I don't care if Daniel Thomas crawls on his knees to the end zone, if it works then I won't be complaining. But their plan was Wallace. If you don't plan on relying on the deep ball as critical to your game plan, then you don't outbid everyone for the services of Wallace, period.

    In defense of Tanny, we have a crap running game. Few QB's can be successful with that problem. But...this thread isn't about the ****ty running game, or the O line, or the lack of great TE's, or the stifling O coordinator. It's about Tanny's arm and brain and instincts. He needs to improve.
     
  30. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Premium Member

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    What I'm hearing from you on this post is, "details don't matter".

    They do. They matter a lot. Football is a game of inches. Football is about details.
     
  31. bird33

    bird33 Well-Known Member

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    how bout that missed pass to matthews on 3rd and 3 in the 1st quarter in panthers territory? how bout on numerous 3rd down plays he has time to throw or run yet panics and makes one bad decision after another. the guy will never ever ever ever be a franchise qb. pretty hilarious how after 27 games not many of you can see that. ZERO 4th quarter points sunday and 1 4th quarter td the past 7 games...but i guess thats because of sherman OR the oline OR the rb's OR the wr's OR the te's? but for most of dolphin nation 7-9 is seen as progress. we'll see what most of you say when we finish this season 6-10.
     
  32. Namor

    Namor Pro Bowler Finheaven VIP

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    This...In every play,there are multiple moving parts that have to happen to allow a play to successfully
    succeed.We have a lot of bad,old or not yet ready parts.
    It's not always the drivers fault.
     
  33. AZPHINSFAN66

    AZPHINSFAN66 Active Member

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    It looks more and more like RT is a good second tier quarterback and nothing more than that. He has had some great moments, but more often than not he looks ordinary. I know we all wanted him to be the savior we have been looking for since Marino, but it's obvious he is not.
     
  34. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Premium Member

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    Tannehill throws an interception rolling to his right because he didn't clear the passing lane and the linebacker was able to tip the ball up, he throws what should have been a BAD interception rolling to his right on a play where two Panthers defenders converged on the football, and here we sit talking about how awful it is he went 2 of 4 for 110 yards and a TD on super-deep pass attempts.

    Focusing on the wrong things people. I'm not just sitting here saying Tannehill is faultless or an awesome player. I'm trying to direct you guys away from the cheese and toward what you should probably be talking about instead.
     
  35. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Premium Member

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    Tannehill throws an interception rolling to his right because he didn't clear the passing lane and the linebacker was able to tip the ball up, he throws what should have been a BAD interception rolling to his right on a play where two Panthers defenders converged on the football, and here we sit talking about how awful it is he went 2 of 4 for 110 yards and a TD on super-deep pass attempts.

    Focusing on the wrong things people. I'm not just sitting here saying Tannehill is faultless or an awesome player. I'm trying to direct you guys away from the cheese and toward what you should probably be talking about instead.
     
  36. HoneyB

    HoneyB A True Fan

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    I agree with you that a lack of TD's in the 4th quarter in the last 7 games is a problem, and is not a meaningless statistics. Tannehill has to take his share of responsibility for that.

    I thought he played well, and had a sufficient time to throw. However, a "W" is not on the scoreboard, and part of the reason for that is Ryan Tannehill.

    And it's not just 4th quarter stuff. I didn't think we scored enough in the first half, with the opportunities presented to us.
     
  37. mrbunglez

    mrbunglez Reading Is Fundamental Donator

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    I wanna hear what you think Tannehills faults are, I'm not going to lie I'm a Tannehill fan but I do see he makes quite a few mistakes, given the fact he's a young QB.
     
  38. AZPHINSFAN66

    AZPHINSFAN66 Active Member

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    This loss is only a link in a chain of disappointment that this team has shown throughout the year. Add to that all the controversy surrounding the locker room and investigations only makes for the look of another losing season.
     
  39. matt11390

    matt11390 Starter

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    Well RT did overthrow Wallace on that one toss in the 3rd. That's the first I have seen that.
     
  40. Despacio

    Despacio Pro Bowler

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    Last year it was batted balls, he corrected it. Then it was pocket presence, he's now getting mobile. Now it's the deep pass. He's a rawer than average second year guy. He's always taking steps to improve. Give the kid the third year he deserves.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  41. J. David Wannyheimer

    J. David Wannyheimer 5 Years of Posting Excellence. Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I guess you didn't watch the Cleveland game.
     
  42. HoneyB

    HoneyB A True Fan

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    It does, and I didn't mean anything by that. But the eyeball test means something too, and football is not about making beautiful throws or being perfect, it's about getting it done. You mentioned Marino, and he had instincts, he got it done. And he had a strong arm and quick release. I don't think Marino, frankly, got a lot of respect from his peers (other QB's). Marino wasn't necessarily the most accurate QB, from what I remember watching him play. But he was magnificent.

    There are always going to be variables. In the end, you have to make it work. Today, I watched a QB get sufficient time to throw from his O line. He had lots of opportunites. On the overthrown ball to Wallace, he could have even run for a first down. The object of the game is to get first downs, and TD's. That's all that matters.
     
  43. AZPHINSFAN66

    AZPHINSFAN66 Active Member

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    RT is a good average QB, just not a QB who can be looked to in crunch time to finish games. He does make great throws at times, but he doesn't have the killer instinct the greats(Brady Manning) have. Add to that all adversity following this team this year makes it worse. He has lost most of his O-line and several weapons(Gibson Keller). Look last year how bad things went for the Saints, and Brees is a great QB. P.S. Brees should have been a Dolphin.
     
  44. mrbunglez

    mrbunglez Reading Is Fundamental Donator

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    I think one thing we ALL can agree on is that Tannehill, regardless of his ce...

    You're talking about the same Bree's that got ran out of SD? I honestly hate the Bree's comparison, he was considered a bust after a few yrs in SD.

    BTW Tannehills led the team for wins in crunch time on a few occasions.
     
  45. J. David Wannyheimer

    J. David Wannyheimer 5 Years of Posting Excellence. Finheaven VIP Donator

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    We never played Seattle. I don't know what you're talking about. Ryan Tannehill has never played the Seattle Seahawks.
     
  46. mrbunglez

    mrbunglez Reading Is Fundamental Donator

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    I think one thing we ALL can agree on is that Tannehill, regardless of his ce...

    He also never played against the Browns, Colts, and Bengals......... :D
     
  47. eman41

    eman41 New Member

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    They had a huge opportunity in the 3rd quarter , Wallace was wide open and of course " Henne" I'm sorry Tannehill over threw him bad. I mean that would have been a touchdown , just like in the 2nd quarter if he would have thrown a good pass that would have been another 6 pts , and at the end of the game if he would have put the pass in front of him , instead of reaching back that would have been the game winner. So yes I feel that Tannehill does not have that " it ". He is missing what the good quarterbacks have. He is decent BUT I don't feel like he will be the elite quarterback
     
  48. AZPHINSFAN66

    AZPHINSFAN66 Active Member

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    Trust me I really want RT to become an elite quarterback in this league. To this point he has shown flashes of brilliance, and I know it's only his second year. However, with the money we spent in the offseason he needs to show more improvement right now. I'm willing to keep him in there right now because we want him to succeed, but right now it looks like he's not progressing. Nevertheless, I'm not giving up and will be yelling at the TV next week when we beat the Jets.
     
  49. ProStyle

    ProStyle Well-Known Member

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    His ceiling is probably Pennington, noodle arm.
     
  50. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Premium Member

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    He overthrew Wallace similarly against the Cleveland Browns. One could argue he overthrew him a second time against the Browns although Wallace stumbled on the route so it's hard to be certain. Also there was a play against the Ravens that looked destined to be an overthrow but Wallace was held by Jimmy Smith early in the route so again it's impossible to be certain. Some believe the deep throw in overtime against the Bengals was an overthrow. Again, pass interference grabbing Wallace around the ankles on purpose makes it impossible to know for sure but it's possible it would have overshot Wallace by a few feet.

    ---------- Post added at 10:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:31 PM ----------

    I hope this was sarcastic.
     

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