Jonathan Martin Is Not An NFL Starting Caliber OT

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Elliott 1, Feb 6, 2013.

  1. Elliott 1

    Elliott 1 A True Fan

    Joined:
    May 2006
    Messages:
    4,316
    Likes Received:
    40
    Trophy Points:
    0
    https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/02/04/rookie-recap-afc-east/

    and he may very well never be one.

    Sorry, but this just plain fact. Not only did he grade out poorly he actually led the league in QB hurries given up.

    There is a good chance that he will be a total bust.

    People on this sight need to get in touch with reality and stop penciling him in as a reliable starter.

    It is far more likely the Dolphins need starters at both tackle positions because Jerry isn't the answer at OT and Garner is worse than Martin on the outside.

    People should stop thinking the Dolphins are going to spend 20 mil in cap on WR's and use the #12 pick on WR's as well.

    Is there anybody out there in touch with reality who has an answer for the 2013 Dolphins OT positions???????????
     
  2. Elliott 1

    Elliott 1 A True Fan

    Joined:
    May 2006
    Messages:
    4,316
    Likes Received:
    40
    Trophy Points:
    0
  3. jlfin

    jlfin old pro

    Joined:
    Mar 2005
    Messages:
    8,827
    Likes Received:
    31
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Perhaps you should dispense with premature and emphatic statements and actually study NFL history. Your idiotic post suggests that no rookie in NFL history has ever been able to develop his game. Your post suggests that what a player does his rookie yr, reflects the rest of his career. Drew Brees would probably disagree with you, because he looked completely clueless his rookie yr.
     
  4. Nublar7

    Nublar7 Retired Finheaven VIP

    Joined:
    Aug 2003
    Messages:
    35,672
    Likes Received:
    116
    Trophy Points:
    63
    He was a rookie
     
  5. Andyman

    Andyman Canadian Fin Fan

    Joined:
    Mar 2004
    Messages:
    1,015
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I thought most of his troubles came early in games but then he settled in. He needs to get stronger but to say he is not NFL calibre because of those stats is silly.
     
  6. Dolphins91

    Dolphins91 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2011
    Messages:
    168
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    :hclap:
     
  7. Chubby

    Chubby SUPERFAN

    Joined:
    May 2002
    Messages:
    6,872
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I was going to insult you by saying he has a better chance of becoming an NFL Caliber OT then you do at becoming an Allstar Poster but I decided to take the high road and not insult anyone.
    Chubbs
     
  8. Hayden Fox

    Hayden Fox Love Creating Turnovers Donator

    Joined:
    Jan 2009
    Messages:
    30,898
    Likes Received:
    65
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Yes he is. I like Martin. Good pick. Liked him before the draft and hope to see more in 13.
     
  9. Nublar7

    Nublar7 Retired Finheaven VIP

    Joined:
    Aug 2003
    Messages:
    35,672
    Likes Received:
    116
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Martin did struggle last year, but I think the biggest contributions to those problems were because he was a rookie, he started the majority of the year at right tackle(was a left tackle in college), had to switch positions late in the year and his lacks elite strength at this point. Strength can be improved with a full offseason of training, he will be solidified at either the right or left tackle position this spring(depending on what they do with Jake Long) and he will have had a full 16 games of NFL starting experience.
     
  10. DolfanISS

    DolfanISS Perennial All-Pro

    Joined:
    Aug 2002
    Messages:
    10,966
    Likes Received:
    27
    Trophy Points:
    48
    I'm not willing to throw in the towel on Martin until we see him after a 2nd full NFL offseason. It will say a lot about his drive if he comes back stronger. It's silly to think he will automatically be better than Jake Long, even the current version, though. That remains to be seen big time.
     
  11. Vaark

    Vaark Nihil taurus crappus Finheaven VIP Donator

    Joined:
    Apr 2007
    Messages:
    23,688
    Likes Received:
    273
    Trophy Points:
    83
    You're certainly entitled to your opinion which may or may not be born out over the long haul. However, just so there's no one around here who might associate it as a statement of fact, in the future kindly use the above "post tag" to categorize it appropriately.

    Also, for those who still might be inclined to mistake your premises as gospel, it really wouldn't be not so bad an idea to further confirm the same by using the following available smiley ..


    :imho: (colonIMHOcolon).

    Thank you in advance for your consideration :up:
     
  12. Kdawg954

    Kdawg954 The D will RushYa, Like Moscow Donator

    Joined:
    Apr 2006
    Messages:
    20,659
    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Martin made HUGE strides from what we saw in preseason to what we saw at the end of the year . . . . and that included a flop from RT to LT. He needs to get stronger, but he has the feet to be a real good LT and he really fits the type of LT that tends to be successful in the system we run. If he puts in the work this offseason, I could see him being a solid OT come next year.
     
  13. PHINANALYST

    PHINANALYST Seasoned Veteran

    Joined:
    Nov 2005
    Messages:
    1,391
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    38
    well, i'll go on record and state that in fact Martin WILL be one of the starting OTs next year ... sorry. I do think we saw that at this point - he is better suited for LT, regardless of his overall stats or performance. Will he be Long as he was in his first 2 years in the league -- ummm, no - but then again, neither is Long. He has to get stronger and better this offseason ... i don't think anyone disagrees with that.

    what needs to happen quickly is for the FO to determine whether or not they will resign Long and keep Martin at RT, because if that is so -- he will need the entire offseason to work @ RT. it can't be a camp decision thing ... that is for sure.
     
  14. fsuhunter

    fsuhunter Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 2008
    Messages:
    164
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Even if what you say about Martin is true, does he represent better value for the Dolphins than paying Long $10+ million a year? I did not notice much of a drop off in overall production when Martin came in.
     
  15. Kdawg954

    Kdawg954 The D will RushYa, Like Moscow Donator

    Joined:
    Apr 2006
    Messages:
    20,659
    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    48
    I don't believe we keep Jake Long, unless he really signs less of a deal to prove his health to the Dolphins and other teams. I also wouldn't sleep on the progress of Will Yeatman. He was very solid blocking TE that has gained the weight and has been practicing behind the scenes fully as a OT and actually was kept over a couple of full fledged tackles last preseason.
     
  16. dolfin530

    dolfin530 Student of the Game

    Joined:
    Jul 2008
    Messages:
    984
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    16
    He had a bad year but started to pick up towards the end. You don't throw in the towel after his rookie season.
     
  17. Kdawg954

    Kdawg954 The D will RushYa, Like Moscow Donator

    Joined:
    Apr 2006
    Messages:
    20,659
    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    48
    You can't judge Jake Long fully on what you saw last season. Jake has looked hurt the past 2 years and that IMO is a bigger reason not to commit long term to him. He definitely is a top tier tackle when he is fully healthy. The ZBS is less about having a dominant LT and more about the OLine working as a group. It requires good feet, which Jake does have, but he fits best as a smash mouth type of OT, which we don't necessarily run down here. You hate to lose your #1 overall pick after the rookie contract, but Miami's focus needs to be getting weapons for Ryan Tannehill and continue retooling this defense so that it can create more turnovers. I don't think Jake wanting 10 million plus is a great move for the Fins and losing him and not being able to replace him certainly shouldn't pressure me to make that type of commitment to him.
     
  18. Penthos

    Penthos Am I on speaker phone?

    Joined:
    Sep 2002
    Messages:
    4,800
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    0
    That's very admirable of you, Chubby. It takes a big man not to take advantage of such an easy opportunity to insult such a horrible post.
     
  19. Wildbill3

    Wildbill3 Misery Loves Company Administrator Finheaven VIP

    Joined:
    Dec 2001
    Messages:
    28,187
    Likes Received:
    145
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Get outta here with this crap after one rookie season... gtfo.


     
  20. Wildbill3

    Wildbill3 Misery Loves Company Administrator Finheaven VIP

    Joined:
    Dec 2001
    Messages:
    28,187
    Likes Received:
    145
    Trophy Points:
    63
    it takes talent and determination, I'd definately give credit to Yeatman as far as determination goes.
     
  21. SCLSU Mud Dogs

    SCLSU Mud Dogs foos-ball is the devil! Donator

    Joined:
    Mar 2007
    Messages:
    7,934
    Likes Received:
    92
    Trophy Points:
    48
    I forgot you were qualified to make such a distinction
     
  22. 2413fanphins

    2413fanphins A True Fan

    Joined:
    Mar 2006
    Messages:
    6,624
    Likes Received:
    34
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Luckily for the rest of us fans, this staff subscribes to the notion of developing talent, instead or constantly turning the roster over due to some struggles in a rookie year.
     
  23. DuderinoN703

    DuderinoN703 I can get you a toe Finheaven VIP Donator

    Joined:
    Oct 2004
    Messages:
    35,578
    Likes Received:
    103
    Trophy Points:
    63
  24. rembrandt

    rembrandt Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2007
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    He was a rookie. Give him some time.
     
  25. DANTODUPER

    DANTODUPER Scout Team

    Joined:
    Apr 2005
    Messages:
    933
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    You are right, If Long is not resigned I think the most probable scenario is Martin at LT and Yeatman at RT.
     
  26. TealAttack13

    TealAttack13 A True Fan

    Joined:
    Jan 2013
    Messages:
    1,632
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    The kid needs more time. You want to make this case in a year or two, then go for it. Not in his rookie year where he was forced to play two different positions. Hard enough to settle into one role, much less two.
     
  27. Kdawg954

    Kdawg954 The D will RushYa, Like Moscow Donator

    Joined:
    Apr 2006
    Messages:
    20,659
    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    48
    I mean only the staff knows how he is developing, but I think ideally as a fan you would hope that is the scenario going forward . . . because that more than likely means he developed quite nicely. We have thrown money and picks at this line since the Parcells regime has come in . . . it would be good to get a little lucky at OT with a guy like Yeatman who we plucked from the Pats.
     
  28. DeathStar

    DeathStar Hall Of Famer

    Joined:
    Nov 2004
    Messages:
    15,604
    Likes Received:
    26
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Enough with these garbage analysis...

    One year and he's not meant for it? Really?
     
  29. Zounds

    Zounds A True Fan Donator

    Joined:
    Jan 2005
    Messages:
    8,203
    Likes Received:
    23
    Trophy Points:
    38
    I think Martin's pay was pretty bad his rookie year, but I'll give him a pass because he's a rookie. He probably wouldn't have started for most teams at LT or RT. 40+ QB hurries is unacceptable. If he still plays like crap next year, then I'd be worried, but right now he gets a pass.
     
  30. CalDolFan10x14

    CalDolFan10x14 Your QB for the next 10 years. Finheaven VIP Donator

    Joined:
    Sep 2004
    Messages:
    14,901
    Likes Received:
    68
    Trophy Points:
    48
    The reality is that he's a damn rookie! Can we at least give him another season before we make such claims? I can't wait until he DOES become our starting OT and proves all this wrong.
     
  31. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit A True Fan

    Joined:
    Jan 2006
    Messages:
    10,198
    Likes Received:
    25
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I just want him to hit the gym this coming season. We need him to be stronger than he's ever been.
     
  32. Oronde

    Oronde Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2013
    Messages:
    262
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I thought he did alright relative to expectations. I know with rookies being more successful than ever it's reasonable to expect more out of him, but I'm not feeling too bad about the pick right now. I was jealous of what I saw from Kelechi Osemele in the Super Bowl, though.
     
  33. Chubby

    Chubby SUPERFAN

    Joined:
    May 2002
    Messages:
    6,872
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    0
    He does need to put on some muscle mass
     
  34. Austin Tatious

    Austin Tatious Starter

    Joined:
    Sep 2004
    Messages:
    4,192
    Likes Received:
    31
    Trophy Points:
    48
    IIRC, Martin came out as a junior and just needs to get stronger. I like his potential.
     
  35. gdiaz0358

    gdiaz0358 Rookie

    Joined:
    May 2007
    Messages:
    1,407
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Considering ALL reports prior to us drafting Martin said he needed to bulk up, work on his strength, and technique means we were expecting him to take time to develop. A lot higher rated Olinmen that were taken before him have done worse than he has, and although I dont have numbers I do know he still has time to get it together. Is he going to be the next Jake Long? No! But we dont need him to be Jake Long good, we just need him to hold his own, we dont need all probowlers across the Oline.
     
  36. utahphinsfan

    utahphinsfan Puck Fitzburgh

    Joined:
    Jan 2005
    Messages:
    8,674
    Likes Received:
    28
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Yes, because JM came in and was not a unanimous all star then he must be a bust?

    Martin does need to improve. However, given this coaching staff and that kids from Stanford are quite sharp then I will hold reservation on Martin's career outlook for awhile.

    There is more pressure IMO on Bob Griffin just maintain playing at a high level than there is for Martin to improve.
     
  37. Elliott 1

    Elliott 1 A True Fan

    Joined:
    May 2006
    Messages:
    4,316
    Likes Received:
    40
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Man the manure is deep on this site.

    Struggled a little you say???????

    Oh he'll get it together?????

    And then you accuse me of being subjective.

    Fact is he finished the year ranked in the seventies amongst NFL tackles. That means several backup OT's who saw significant playing time played better than him.

    If he had finished anywhere in the top 64 I'd be inclined to share some optimism, but he didn't. Martin is just plain awful. He can't pass protect on the outside and he isn't a powerful run blocker.

    Best case scenario IMO is that he is moved to OG and eventually get's stronger.

    I used to post the same kind of realistic posts about Chad Henne and I got the same kind of absurd reactions.

    I'm not anti team. I'm just saying that all the confidence being displayed on this site is really unfounded.

    The Dolphins are anything but set at OT. This team may need to add 3 OT's this offseason if it actually wants to be solid at the position.

    Yeatman,Adams, and McDonald are all late round or undraffted guys who are untested.

    The Dolphins might not have any starting caliber or even backup caliber OT's on their roster, although I like Jeff Adams' potential.

    The situation is pathetic.

    I saw that nobody was able to offer any suggestions on what make the situation better.

    Cowards!
     
  38. CalDolFan10x14

    CalDolFan10x14 Your QB for the next 10 years. Finheaven VIP Donator

    Joined:
    Sep 2004
    Messages:
    14,901
    Likes Received:
    68
    Trophy Points:
    48
    You really expect anyone to take you seriously when you insult anyone with an opinion on these boards??? You're digging your own grave as far as your credibility is concerned. Com'on now.

    Not everyone is going to agree with you here...that's just the nature of a site with tens of thousands of members.No need to insult the members' intelligence and then call them cowards when they happen to disagree with you.
     
  39. iambanned

    iambanned A True Fan

    Joined:
    Apr 2012
    Messages:
    2,339
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I was really getting on the Martin bandwagon until that Patriots game at the end there. He got embarrassed and Miami really had no chance to do anything on offense because of the pressure he was giving up on almost every play. He's just so easy to bull-rush and his foot-quickness offers nothing when there's just zero leverage he can use.
    When you're watching the draft and they start going '+/- on every player and every negative against Martin that was highlighted was what we saw from him this year. I really am far from convinced that he is an NFL player. It's not just size, either. Smaller players have become much better players than what he showed.
    If he is a tackle for us next year, we will not eclipse 7 wins no matter what else we do this offseason.

    ---------- Post added at 03:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:28 PM ----------

    Also, that game against the Colts was really where the bottom dropped out on our season, and his play in the game went a long way towards facilitating our failure.
     
  40. Elliott 1

    Elliott 1 A True Fan

    Joined:
    May 2006
    Messages:
    4,316
    Likes Received:
    40
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I didn't call anyone a coward for disagreeing. Far from it. I called everyone a coward for not offering an answer for what could be done about improving the Dolphins OT situation which is what the thread was supposed to be about.

    I'm fine with getting bashed. It happened with Ronnie Brown, Chad Henne, and Kaepernick for two years on the draft forum. In the end, I'm always right and nobody ever apologies for their bashing when reality plays out.

    The ironic thing is that I get obvious personal attacks and I'm the one the mods warn about being pugnacious when I never attack anyone personally.

    I used the words cowards, because no stepped up and actually offered a solution to the OT problem other than Martin needs to lift more weights.

    As far as my credibility shouldn't it be based on content, rather than style?

    If I'm wrong about Martin I'll admit it. I was wrong to support the drafting of Pat White and I openly admitted it. I didn't want him in the 2nd round but, whatever.
     
  41. dolpns13

    dolpns13 Chest Rockwell is my hero Donator

    Joined:
    Nov 2005
    Messages:
    28,777
    Likes Received:
    77
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Posts, you mean. 99% of the OPs posts are thus bad.
     
  42. Dolphins91

    Dolphins91 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2011
    Messages:
    168
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    You know who else was probably rated horribly his rookie season; Paul Solai. And he just pissed on your logic.

    Players develop. It happens all the time.
     
  43. jason_taylor

    jason_taylor Pro Bowler

    Joined:
    Aug 2004
    Messages:
    4,336
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    0
    BRO !!!!!!! Martin was only a junior , he came out really 2 years early , and he played 2 diff poss in the NFL , LT and RT , imo Martin WILL BECOME A VERY VERY GOOD OT in the NFL and not if , but when he dose , he will atleast be a top 15 , if not top 10 OT in the NFL. BECAUSE from what i saw from Martin there where just a few players that he couldnt handle , and he was a junior ? come on bro .
     
  44. Andyman

    Andyman Canadian Fin Fan

    Joined:
    Mar 2004
    Messages:
    1,015
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Your 'ranking' is based on a subjective opinion from a website. Some of us watch the games and recognize he was a rookie who had to learn a new position for the bulk of the year.
     
  45. Awsi Dooger

    Awsi Dooger A True Fan

    Joined:
    Feb 2005
    Messages:
    7,692
    Likes Received:
    50
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Martin will give you everything he has. Feet aren't terrible. Obviously a smart guy.

    But on the NFL level he looks like a 7-9 player. That's the inescapable conclusion. Loses balance frequently. Not naturally strong. Handful of truly disastrous plays when he steps up in class. His college coach wasn't effusive in praise.

    The idea was to trend in the other direction, to finally sprinkle the roster with great players here or there. Martin seems like more of the same.
     
  46. EvilDylan

    EvilDylan A True Fan Donator

    Joined:
    Jan 2008
    Messages:
    4,387
    Likes Received:
    31
    Trophy Points:
    48
    LOL @ this logic.

    Give up after a rookie season.

    Pathetic.

    Elliott, shutup.

    Warn me IDGAF!
     
  47. doubleg4

    doubleg4 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2010
    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    We need to give this kid some time to turn his boyish body to an NFL starting lineman. He is definitely soft around the edges but give him an off season of NFL conditioning and he could turn into a stud right before our eyes. The footwork and mechanics are there. He just lacks upper body strength which could be improved upon with good weight training.
     
  48. 67Stang

    67Stang FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP Donator

    Joined:
    Aug 2004
    Messages:
    7,664
    Likes Received:
    52
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Jake Long as a rookie was night and day better.
     
  49. Smith21

    Smith21 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

    Joined:
    Aug 2008
    Messages:
    2,034
    Likes Received:
    11
    Trophy Points:
    38
    thats true first over all, the guy drafted ahead of Matt Ryan.
     
  50. dcnr226

    dcnr226 A True Fan Donator

    Joined:
    Mar 2007
    Messages:
    1,109
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
    A- Martin was a rookie who held his own according to my eye ball test..dating back to Stanford.

    B- He has the frame.

    C- He certainly has the brains.

    D- Ireland might have issues identifying and pulling the trigger for playmakers at skill positions, but i more than trust his eye for big men.
     

Share This Page