Landry contract

[Dajesus]

I am a huge Jarvis fan. I have his throwback jersey, and a t-shirt with his number and name. That being said I would not pay him any more than 8-9.5 a season. He isn’t a great WR that warrants north of 10 million. He is a slot WR who lead the league in receptions but didn’t gain 1000 yards. We waste too much money on non pivotal players. We can’t afford to have our two highest paid players be a DT and a slot WR.

If you look at the top 50 in receptions this season only Jack Doyle (a TE) has a lower yards per catch than Jarvis’ 8.8 ypc. Only Kenny Stills fumbles more than he did. Only Alvin Kamara (a rb) has a lower 1st down % on his catches.

Worst case scenario Jarvis walks and Grant moves to the slot. Grant who averages almost double his ypc, has home run speed, who fumbled zero times, had zero personal fouls, and 16% better at getting a first down than Jarvis is. Oh, and he will get paid less than a million dollars next season.

 

[Danny]

I am a huge Jarvis fan. I have his throwback jersey, and a t-shirt with his number and name. That being said I would not pay him any more than 8-9.5 a season. He isn’t a great WR that warrants north of 10 million. He is a slot WR who lead the league in receptions but didn’t gain 1000 yards. We waste too much money on non pivotal players. We can’t afford to have our two highest paid players be a DT and a slot WR.

If you look at the top 50 in receptions this season only Jack Doyle (a TE) has a lower yards per catch than Jarvis’ 8.8 ypc. Only Kenny Stills fumbles more than he did. Only Alvin Kamara (a rb) has a lower 1st down % on his catches.

Worst case scenario Jarvis walks and Grant moves to the slot. Grant who averages almost double his ypc, has home run speed, who fumbled zero times, had zero personal fouls, and 16% better at getting a first down than Jarvis is. Oh, and he will get paid less than a million dollars next season.

Exactly what I've been trying to say when it comes to pay structure. It's dumb to have broken the back for a DT and now we're going to do it for a slot WR?
It's time we start using the money and draft the right way

Ozzy rules!!

 

[BobDole]

I get that his antics are a nuisance. It is annoying when he's doing his stupid pointing after a first down catch when the team is getting destroyed. Everyone should be in agreement that it would benefit everyone if he dialed it down a notch.

However ...

Can we stop acting like he's throwing it to himself behind the LOS? Bitching about the 8.8 yards a catch doesn't make a lick of sense when he's 7th in the league at YAC. Golden Tate is the only other receiver with more. Compare those two receivers. Look at how they're used. It's not Landry's fault the offense is funneled through him the way it is. You telling me he's only capable of catching 3 yard passes? Please.

All the other stuff is reasonable. His YPC catch numbers have to be taken in context.

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/stats...ECEIVING&opp=0&sort=5&qualified=1&sortOrder=0

 

[Dajesus]

I get that his antics are a nuisance. It is annoying when he's doing his stupid pointing after a first down catch when the team is getting destroyed. Everyone should be in agreement that it would benefit everyone if he dialed it down a notch.

However ...

Can we stop acting like he's throwing it to himself behind the LOS? Bitching about the 8.8 yards a catch doesn't make a lick of sense when he's 7th in the league at YAC. Golden Tate is the only other receiver with more. Compare those two receivers. Look at how they're used. It's not Landry's fault the offense is funneled through him the way it is. You telling me he's only capable of catching 3 yard passes? Please.

All the other stuff is reasonable. His YPC catch numbers have to be taken in context.

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/stats...ECEIVING&opp=0&sort=5&qualified=1&sortOrder=0

That’s a naive view just like you are accusing others of having. His yards after catch is inflated because he is getting so many quick hitting screen passes that he is isolated with a CB. Most WRs catch balls on deeper patterns that allow the S or LB time to help on the tackle. It’s also points out that he has an inability to shake defenders on deeper routes. If you look at his apc and ayac then it’s obvious the majority of his receptions occur with in 1-2 yards of the one of scrimmage. If his route goes deeper he isn’t open and the qb goes to stills or Parker. I would much rather see more of these passes go to Drake, and have a WR who can get open down field.

 

[Danny]

I get that his antics are a nuisance. It is annoying when he's doing his stupid pointing after a first down catch when the team is getting destroyed. Everyone should be in agreement that it would benefit everyone if he dialed it down a notch.

However ...

Can we stop acting like he's throwing it to himself behind the LOS? Bitching about the 8.8 yards a catch doesn't make a lick of sense when he's 7th in the league at YAC. Golden Tate is the only other receiver with more. Compare those two receivers. Look at how they're used. It's not Landry's fault the offense is funneled through him the way it is. You telling me he's only capable of catching 3 yard passes? Please.

All the other stuff is reasonable. His YPC catch numbers have to be taken in context.

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/stats...ECEIVING&opp=0&sort=5&qualified=1&sortOrder=0

No it's not his fault the team is dumb enough to be running the offense thru a slot WR. I agree he can catch passes that are more than 3 yards. As far as his YAC, there's a different way to explain that too. When you go deep you're having to beat the DB and get yards after that. When you run those little bubble screens to Landry he's got 3 guys already on blocking mode by the time he catches the pass so of course he will get YAC. The defense doesn't have to respect his speed(or lack of)so they're back and they don't mind him catching a 1 yard pass and run for 5 more on a 3rd and 9. Two things can be done to give us a chance at a high scoring offense. Stop running the offense thru him in which case he'd throw a tantrum or they can let him go

Ozzy rules!!

 

[Danny]

That’s a naive view just like you are accusing others of having. His yards after catch is inflated because he is getting so many quick hitting screen passes that he is isolated with a CB. Most WRs catch balls on deeper patterns that allow the S or LB time to help on the tackle. It’s also points out that he has an inability to shake defenders on deeper routes. If you look at his apc and ayac then it’s obvious the majority of his receptions occur with in 1-2 yards of the one of scrimmage. If his route goes deeper he isn’t open and the qb goes to stills or Parker. I would much rather see more of these passes go to Drake, and have a WR who can get open down field.

beat me by a minute but we're on the same page....lol

Ozzy rules!!

 

[BobDole]

That’s a naive view just like you are accusing others of having. His yards after catch is inflated because he is getting so many quick hitting screen passes that he is isolated with a CB. Most WRs catch balls on deeper patterns that allow the S or LB time to help on the tackle. It’s also points out that he has an inability to shake defenders on deeper routes. If you look at his apc and ayac then it’s obvious the majority of his receptions occur with in 1-2 yards of the one of scrimmage. If his route goes deeper he isn’t open and the qb goes to stills or Parker. I would much rather see more of these passes go to Drake, and have a WR who can get open down field.

Those quick screens with Stills blocking are hurting his numbers, not helping. He's never had an issue getting open. Just runs the plays that are drawn up.

 

[superphin]

Can it be possible that the reason he averaged 8.8 yards is because the offense was changed due to Cutler starting. Also Cutler being a pretty bad QB. With Ryan Tannehill he went from 9.0 to 10.5 to 12.1. Thats an upward trend with a better QB. So can we stop acting like 8.8 is his norm when clearly its the result of a limited offense due to a limited QB. He had 2 back to back 1100 yard season before Cutler. When is the last time a Dolphin WR had back to back 1100 yard season? 1996-1997 Irvin Fryar.

We don't really draft a lot of good WR's or players in general. It's like people forgets the days of Chris Chambers and waiting for him to breakout year after year.

 

[BobDole]

beat me by a minute but we're on the same page....lol

Ozzy rules!!

Same-ish reply from me as well. Had Parker developed like we hoped ... had Stills been incorporated more ... had the TE position not been geriatric ... had Thill not gotten hurt ... this conversation probably isn't even happening.

I still say he's worth every penny of $12 mil. $14 is the high water mark. He'll get every bit of it on a team who may even know how to use him in FA.

 

[Danny]

Same-ish reply from me as well. Had Parker developed like we hoped ... had Stills been incorporated more ... had the TE position not been geriatric ... had Thill not gotten hurt ... this conversation probably isn't even happening.

I still say he's worth every penny of $12 mil. $14 is the high water mark. He'll get every bit of it on a team who may even know how to use him in FA.

So let me ask you something. Well a couple of things. First, do you think it's a good idea to have a slot WR as your higher paid player on offense other than the QB? Also, do you think that we should continue to run our offense thru Landry? And if the answer is yes, how can we do that and yet become the high scoring offense that we all want?

Ozzy rules!!

 

[Dajesus]

Can it be possible that the reason he averaged 8.8 yards is because the offense was changed due to Cutler starting. Also Cutler being a pretty bad QB. With Ryan Tannehill he went from 9.0 to 10.5 to 12.1. Thats an upward trend with a better QB. So can we stop acting like 8.8 is his norm when clearly its the result of a limited offense due to a limited QB. He had 2 back to back 1100 yard season before Cutler. When is the last time a Dolphin WR had back to back 1100 yard season? 1996-1997 Irvin Fryar.

We don't really draft a lot of good WR's or players in general. It's like people forgets the days of Chris Chambers and waiting for him to breakout year after year.

His average ypc has been 9, 10.5, 12.1, and 8.8, and you said 8.8 is an aberration rather than the norm. If you agree with math 12.1 is the aberration not 8.8. His career average is 10.1, and that is far too low to break the bank. I want him back, as I love his effort, and he has been my favorite Dolphin the past 4 years, but every statistic out side of receptions is below average. We have to spend smarter. We have a lb and de that got gauranteed contracts that would suggest they are in the top 15 at thier position, but in realality wouldn’t start on the majority of NFL teams. We have 2 strong safeties with huge contracts that both over 100 passer ratings when targeted. We have a DT making more than 90% of QBs next season. If we pay a slot WR #1 wr money this team will not be able to afford fixing the broken oline or lb core.

 

[TeeMoney]

he is the only one in the WR that has fight. Parker is a diva and Stills is inconsistent. Carroo is a bust.

His girlfriend agrees with you

 

[BobDole]

So let me ask you something. Well a couple of things. First, do you think it's a good idea to have a slot WR as your higher paid player on offense other than the QB? Also, do you think that we should continue to run our offense thru Landry? And if the answer is yes, how can we do that and yet become the high scoring offense that we all want?

Ozzy rules!!

I think people make too much about him playing the slot. It's not like he isn't getting the snaps. Production is there. TDs were the issue ... that got resolved.

So am I comfortable with the receiver who consistently produces getting paid? Very much. Indeed so. He's earned it.

If he wants 15 mil+? That would be pricing himself out of Miami.

I don't think we have to run our offense through him. I think it's worked out like that because the guys around him aren't the consistent safety valve he is. If Parker was winning on the boundary like he should ... if Stills was used more ... if the running game was more balanced ... then the offense wouldn't have to run through Landry. But he's the best bet to move the chains so the ball finds its way into his hands. I can't fault him for that.

And I sure as hell don't want to hear any more excuses for Tannehill. Give him the receivers, offensive line, and running game he needs to alleviate any reason why he couldn't take us to the next level and see what happens. Taking away his most reliable target just sets us up for another season of 30+ page long QB threads.

 

[artdnj]

Dolphin qay, get rid of youth and pay old ass vets....interesting that we're in the basement year after year.

 

[Danny]

I think people make too much about him playing the slot. It's not like he isn't getting the snaps. Production is there. TDs were the issue ... that got resolved.

So am I comfortable with the receiver who consistently produces getting paid? Very much. Indeed so. He's earned it.

If he wants 15 mil+? That would be pricing himself out of Miami.

I don't think we have to run our offense through him. I think it's worked out like that because the guys around him aren't the consistent safety valve he is. If Parker was winning on the boundary like he should ... if Stills was used more ... if the running game was more balanced ... then the offense wouldn't have to run through Landry. But he's the best bet to move the chains so the ball finds its way into his hands. I can't fault him for that.

And I sure as hell don't want to hear any more excuses for Tannehill. Give him the receivers, offensive line, and running game he needs to alleviate any reason why he couldn't take us to the next level and see what happens. Taking away his most reliable target just sets us up for another season of 30+ page long QB threads.

Ok, first, I like having this debate with you because you're very respectful and I respect your opinion even thought I of course don't agree with it which it happens.
You're saying that the TD's are there this year but here's where I see things different. I'm looking for the TEAM to score way more and not just for him to score more. I believe that Cutler not being able to go deep often and the lack of production by Thomas left some chances for Landry to become a bigger target in the zone this year and he did a good job with it but at the end of the day, the team still didn't score enough and while this was NOT Landry's fault, running our offense thru him was.

When you say he's "earned" it......how much are you talking about?

Then you said that we don't have to run the offense thru him. AGREE.......but you want to pay him as a #1? That makes no sense at all. You pay a guy #1 money because he's going to be your #1 target and as long as Landry is the #1 target the offense will never score enough. It's not guessing on my part either. He's been the #1 target for 4 years and it hasn't worked yet. Again, I don't blame him for it. He is what he is. A very good slot WR that is NOT a top 5 WR. He's not the type of WR that would help you become a high scoring offense if he's the #1 target in it. The problem is that Parker has not develop into that #1 and Still is a very good deep target but not a #1 but he's not getting paid as one while you want to pay Landry as one.

At this point Landry will not be happy if he's not the #1 target so the team has 2 options. Either pay him what he wants and keep running a low scoring offense thru him or let him go.
I'd let him go in that case even thought he's one of my favorite players. It's not personal. It's only business. I want the team to score way more and it will not happen with him as our #1

Ozzy rules!!