Lets Face the Facts

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by 67Stang, Nov 13, 2017.

  1. tay0365

    tay0365 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP Donator

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    ...Or 7-2 if Tannehill had not gone down...just saying.
     
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  2. WCUPUNK

    WCUPUNK Active Member

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    Suh injured his knee last week against the Raiders, he has been dominate all season up (2nd best DT in football according to PFF) until last night.
     
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  3. BSQ

    BSQ Scout Team

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    The defense is not as bad as it looked against the Panthers. With one minute left in the first half it was 10-7 and our defense balled the whole half. Then Mr. Clutch throws a back breaking pick into 3 Panthers, this is a rudderless team on the road and that's all it takes to break them. They have no leaders and the offense is really raising the bar at being pathetic, why should the defense even bother. That's what they're thinking. If they thought they had a chance to win the game you would see a whole different effort. They KNOW THAT CUTLER DOESN'T CARE, why should they?? From what I saw they don't.
     
  4. Lionstone

    Lionstone A True Fan

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    “Could be” never, ever matters! We are 4-5. The team has many challenges, but stop acting like we are the Browns.
     
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  5. Lionstone

    Lionstone A True Fan

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    I was wonderi
    I was wondering when someone would notice this fact and the fact that he looked weaker last night.
     
  6. Mike8272

    Mike8272 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    Do we need to blow this team up and start a rebuild?

    I don't think we are at that stage on the offensive side of the ball. We have the quarterback position filled, the receiving core is solid, we have a decent enough bunch of tight ends, and Kenyan Drake might just be the answer at running back. So we do have a good group of play makers on the offensive that should be able to function and become a potent offense. The biggest thing we need to fix on this side of the ball is the O-Line, and when that is sorted, the rest should fall into place and we could see another exciting Miami Dolphins offense.

    Where I do think we need to rebuild is the defense. We do have some nice pieces but we also have a number of ineffective players that just aren't very good. I think our D-Line is good enough to go forwards with, but we need to upgrade our entire group of starting line backers, and we also need to strengthen the secondary as well. The problem we have is that our defense is either really good or really bad, there really isn't much middle ground with our team. What we need to do next season is make sure that our defense becomes more consistent and become less boom or bust. I know we got to the play offs last year with a bend don't break defense, but that same approach is killing us at times this season.

    For me, I don't think we need to blow everything up and start over. What we need to do is upgrade the O-Line, line backing core, and secondary. If we can fix those three positions then maybe we can return to being a better football team next season. Or perhaps we should start a semi-rebuild and remove the band aids and start to rebuild around young talent on this roster rather than the ageing (and perhaps declining) talents.
     
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  7. SF Dolphin Fan

    SF Dolphin Fan Seasoned Veteran

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    I do think this is close to a major rebuild.

    I will put this out there, though, how much farther along would Miami be with an offensive line that was at least league average? I think in that scenario, even with Cutler at quarterback, this would be a different team. The Ajayi trade may never have happened either.

    Not saying that the offensive line is the only problem, but it's a big one.

    Suh is still a great player, but teams have figured out that you can double him and no one else will step up. Carolina doubled him the entire game and no one else on the line made a play --- really the entire game.

    Miami's biggest need might be a shutdown corner. The team still needs to add to the pass rush. But, I'd concentrate almost entirely on offense in free agency and the draft.
     
  8. Gordykr

    Gordykr Falkirk PhinFan Donator

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    In defence of the defense ...(see what i did there ...)... time of possession is a big stat...35 mins to 25 in panthers favour...nothing like tiring a defence out. offence not converting 3rd down mean very little rest for the defence. Saw a stat during the game that Suh had played 86% of defensive snaps this season...thats alot of time on the field..
     
  9. AJ Duhe

    AJ Duhe FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I've been reading opinions from some of the columnists that urge the team to start questioning everything, and I think they're right. You can't throw out a whole scheme mid-season, but I think the defensive scheme has a basic flaw and we've doubled down by collecting flawed players to execute the scheme.

    Gase also needs to take a good look at what he's trying to accomplish on offense. Play to play, I can't decipher what it is he's trying to do. I remember him talking about building a multiple offense, kinda in the mold of the Patriots, to attack opponents with different emphasis every week, but I never see the playcalls changing.
     
  10. dirkey

    dirkey FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    For me, there are a few things that need to happen.

    1: Tannenbum needs to go. He's a terrible GM. He was at the Jets, and he is now with us. Some of his decision making is just baffling. And his talent evaluation leaves a lot to be desired. It's funny, I keep thinking how I wish Raekwon hadn't got injured - but what's the guarantee he's actually any good? Less than 50/50, given who picked him, in my book.
    2: Gase needs to give up the play calling. I think he is giving himself too much to do. He's still learning to be a head coach. I think it's time he relinquished that control so that he can concentrate on what he's supposed to be doing. And if he was to do that, maybe he could get on Burke to do more - I agree, the defense isn't the major problem, but when you've that much money invested in the defensive line, are they producing enough? No way. That's on the DC in my opinion.
    3: Draft some decent players. The more I look at it, this franchise can't even be fixed in one off season. Hardly any cap space, after that abysmal decision to bring Cutler out of retirement, and so many holes. The entire OL needs to be replaced, though I'd give Tunsil a pass, given he's on his rookie contract. We need a new safety. Entirely new LB corps. More pass rush - again, our first round pick, what's he doing? Great talent evaluation. Bad coaching. Who knows which the problem is. Either way, it's not good enough.

    These are just a few of the things that need to happen. There are many more.

    Top of the list though, unsurprisingly, number 1 above. GET RID.
     
  11. Kingdom Come

    Kingdom Come Well-Known Member

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    The Cutler signing is meaningless, it was a one year deal.

    The Dolphins could easily clear well over 60 mil in cap room by releasing or trading veterans that aren't earning their money.

    Right now, the outlook for the off season is dismal; and it well should be if Ross keeps the buffoons making the decisions.

    A new GM and coach would have no qualms about trading and cutting players, adding draft picks and signing some good contracts with guys who are actually good NFL players.

    A GM with a brain would quickly look to replace Branch and Kiko, and have a plan to trade Reshad Jones if he isn't playing 110%.

    Obviously Pouncey, with the 2nd worse run blocking grade in the NFL needs to be replaced. Ju'wuan may be expendable as well as Julius Thomas and others.

    It's time to trade RT and draft a QB. If the NFL idiots continue to sleep on Baker Mayfield because he is short, we could get Drew Brees with wheels for a very value pick.
     
  12. Aquablood

    Aquablood Well-Known Member

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    Not so fast.
    First need to find out whether Gase is the right man for the HC job?
    What do you do if you blow up the team and Gase is not HC material.
    Always always always find a competent HC first.
     
  13. DefensiveEnd76

    DefensiveEnd76 Football Guru

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    Find a Head Coach who has had previous success as a Head Coach and is highly motivated to run an NFL franchise. Get a guy who can bring in top assistant coaches.
     
  14. Gadsden86

    Gadsden86 #1 Oronde Gadsden & Cameron Wake Fan

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    I don't think that dumping a coach after 2 years will do any good for the team. I would like to see a HUGE overhaul in the O-line first and foremost. Tunsil is the only one worth keeping. Its unrealistic to replace 4 starters on any unit. So i think we try for a new RT and at least a guard.
    I would hope with that start it would improve the team some.

    I don't think in all my years as a fan even during the 1-15 season i have been as upset and mad at the team as I am now. As a fan i can do nothing that can affect the team but come on when other teams in the NFL can get better and do the phins can do it as well.
     
  15. dolfan91

    dolfan91 Starter Donator

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    The inexperience within the coaching ranks is hurting the team. When the defense was playing well, Burke was solid in his adjustments during the game. But since The Baltimore game there seems to be some sort of disconnect on defense. More like the dam has broken. He’s not getting it done, especially now that teams have figured him out. I’m baffled by the lack of control on Ross’ part in keeping the spending in check. Ever since the Suh signing it’s been one questionable contract after another. Suh is Suh, a great player at that, but, his contract had a domino affect on the rest of the roster decisions that are being made. No one seems to be held accountable. The Cutler signing was a damn waste of $10m if ever there was one. The illusion of a 10-6 season hurt the team moving forward, because of the false belief the team was close, when in fact, it wasn’t and was full of bloated contracts to players not worthy of the money being paid to them. The cavalier attitude I’ve seen from the high priced players is telling. It’s all about the Benjamin’s for them, living in and playing in a state with no income tax. It’s the saddest time for me as a long time Dolphins fan. Bad decisions are killing this franchise on and off the field.
     
  16. fansinceGWilson

    fansinceGWilson FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    I like James, but not at his current $$. Tunsil is a keeper. I wish there was some evidence on Asiata, Smith, Brendel to give fans some idea if there was talent, but I suspect 2 OLmen will be needed. We've seen this year (as wee see every year) how much an injured OLman on a top team can change a team's fortunes. Miami needs 3.

    Not to beat a dead horse, but when the average watching-on-TV fan can often call Miami's plays, we know what an above average DC can do. I'll not beat the QB dead horse.
     
  17. daryl

    daryl Well-Known Member

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    If this was a race to outrun mediocrity, the Dolphins would be getting lapped by teams that were recently in worse shape. The Rams? Lapped. The Jaguars? Lapped. Eagles? Lapped. Raiders? Lapped. Titans, Saints, Vikings, maybe the Bills? Getting lapped. Just a stuck-in-neutral franchise while others find competent head coaches, GM's, and finally acquire talented players.
     
  18. fansinceGWilson

    fansinceGWilson FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    I understand the signing of Cutler (kinda). Tannehill went down, the team had a shot at the playoffs IF Miami had a decent QB (and I think Culter was 'decent'). BUT, if MM was not seen as capable, why is he getting $5mm? And I admit, while I though Cutler was 'decent,' he has turned out worse than Cleo. Sadly, the only remaining option is Fales, and I'm not excited about that.
     
  19. dolfan91

    dolfan91 Starter Donator

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    I agree 100%, Tom Coughlin in Jacksonville is the quintessential Football man, who’s turned around the Jacksonville franchise in one off season. He truly knows how to build a team from the ground up, then throw in Doug Marrone a Don Shula desiple and you get a strong running game with a tough defense. The Rams and Eagles are both the beneficiaries of smart DC hires to go along with long term assistants as new HC’s. Wish Miami would have followed these formulas.
     
  20. fansinceGWilson

    fansinceGWilson FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    Sounds like success can come without an elite QB. I buy that. Good teams can be built with consistently disciplined play and upper third talent.
     
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  21. dolfan91

    dolfan91 Starter Donator

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    Well at least in Jacksonville it’s working. Wentz IMHO is in his way to being elite. In LA, Goff is developing into a solid QB. But the common denominator in all three teams are strong defenses with above average running games. A Shula staple in his early years.
     
  22. CaSh

    CaSh Nothing bigga than the B

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    But do you really think Blake Bortles will outplay Tom Brady in a playoff game? Marrone will out coach Belichick? Not a chance. Not now not in 3 years
     
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  23. <O>

    <O> Well-Known Member

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    It can, but it requires the unlikely prospect of compiling enough talent at positions other than QB to compensate for the non-elite QB.

    Think about it like this -- the 2016 Dolphins' passer rating was 95.5, slightly above average. Its opponents' passer rating was 88.5, right about average. A differential of +7 points.

    That made them a weak sixth seed that got waxed in round one of the playoffs.

    Compare that to the Patriots' passer rating of 109.5, and its opponents' passer rating of 84.4 -- a differential of +25 points. That much greater imbalance in favor of the Patriots produced a 14-2 record, a first-round bye, and home-field advantage throughout the playoffs, and we know what that led to.

    Look at the difference there -- Tom Brady versus Ryan Tannehill and Matt Moore (who played well), and what that can do.

    The Dolphins would've needed to have a defense that held its opponents to a passer rating of 70.5 to produce the same differential as the Patriots.

    Now think of how unlikely that is. Between 2004 and 2016 there were a mere 20 teams of the 416 that held their opponents to a passer rating between 68 and 72.

    So there is a mere 4.8% chance that the Dolphins -- given the level of QB play they had in 2016 -- would've performed well enough on defense to produce the situation the Patriots were in, heading into the 2016 playoffs.

    So you can see there what a Tom Brady can do for you. If you don't have the likes of him, you need a highly unlikely level of play elsewhere to situate yourself in the most favorable conditions heading into the playoffs.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
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  24. miamiron

    miamiron A True Fan

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    Easier said than done, No team out there is going to want to take over our inflated contracts unless
    Tannebaum has a brother running another team into the ground
     
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  25. miamiron

    miamiron A True Fan

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    and a cap hit of $26 million next season
     
  26. Kingdom Come

    Kingdom Come Well-Known Member

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    The only two players of significant trade value would be Tannehill and Ja'Wuan James. Timmons and Xavien Howard may have 5-7 th round value; however, if you are able to get a couple 2nd rounders a 5th and a 6th.....A good GM can do some very good things with just those picks, and just those moves alone clear nearly 40 mil in cap. Pouncey and Julius Thomas another 14 mil cleared. A good GM could make vast improvements with those kind of resources.

    Kiko,Branch,and any other under performing veteran with too much guaranteed money on the books would have to come in 2019 and forward, unless they can't really contribute at all and are soundly beat out by other players, but the dead cap would be obscene.
     
  27. WCUPUNK

    WCUPUNK Active Member

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    ...and if he's not on the roster we are still eating $23m. It just doesn't even make sense to lose an elite player for $3m cap savings. Suh is back 100%.
     
  28. Highzenga

    Highzenga Well-Known Member

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    That is the nature of football. Bottom line is that we are 4-5 and currently in the playoff hunt. If we were healthy we could be 9-0 for all we know.
     
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  29. Awsi Dooger

    Awsi Dooger A True Fan

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    Great post. There was another great post by <O> immediately below yours. Teams like Jacksonville are doing swell for mid November. I appreciate the intensity level and wish we could borrow it. But it would require a series of favorable matchups for them to be a factor deep into the playoffs. In this era you need either a great quarterback or at least a half dozen great defensive players. Since I'm always about the easier and more foundational route I'd like to shop for option number one. That quarterback can hang around a decade or more while you might get lucky and maintain the defense for 3-4 years maximum. Seattle has stretched that 3-4 a little bit but the defense is hardly what it was.
     
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  30. dlockz

    dlockz Hall Of Famer

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    actually we know we would not be 9-0. Injuries happen and that is a true test of a coach
    3rd place in our division and tied with two teams that beat us already this year
    At this point very few teams are not in playoff possibilities but we currently sit in the 8th spot with two games vs N.E and Buffalo remaining
    Plus we travel to KC and Denver. Lets just ignore that we have been outscored by 100 points
     
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  31. Highzenga

    Highzenga Well-Known Member

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    Actually we have no idea what our record would be if tannehill was healthy. True that lots of teams are still in contention but we certainly are as well. None of the teams left on our schedule are juggernauts. Of course, our offense has been disappointing, but I feel like we’ve began to establish some kind of offensive identity over the past two weeks.
     
  32. Dolph N.Fan

    Dolph N.Fan A True Fan

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    The league is suffering from a serious lack of elite QBs right now. What little they have are injured. In the AFC Brady has no QB to worry about outplaying him in the Playoffs. It’s Brady and Roethlisberger and that’s it. South have no elite QBs, and no one in the east after New England has one either. North is just Roethlisberger. And the West you have Carr who took a slight step back this year.
     
  33. dlockz

    dlockz Hall Of Famer

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    The pats only have the best record in the league and easy to show some offense when the other team is beating you by three tds. Outside of the one long run our run game was crap
     
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  34. Snoop

    Snoop A True Fan

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    Don't forget Landry on the tag.
     
  35. miamiron

    miamiron A True Fan

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    What's even worse than that is Kiko Alonso has played 100% of the defensive snaps this season
    573 aimless snaps
     
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  36. BahamaFinFan78

    BahamaFinFan78 A True Fan

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    We need a total and complete rebuild, something we have not done since Parcells. I don't blame Ross as the team is an investment for him; he doesn't know the game like Jerry Jones. He needs to find someone that he can trust to completely run the organization, tell them to go in and no heads are safe. Find someone with experience of building a winner in today's NFL. Pay them whatever they ask and go for it.
     

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