Meet our potential 1st round pick....

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Lukin, Mar 14, 2004.

  1. Lukin

    Lukin Colbert '08

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  2. Agua

    Agua Fighting the media, one lie at a time

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    He isn't #20 talent. If he's our first pick, I hope we trade down to the 2nd.
     
  3. touborg

    touborg Board Linebacker

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    Anyone see Regie Williams 40 yard dash at the workout?
     
  4. phinsfan1221

    phinsfan1221 FinHeaven VIP Donator

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    yes i think if we go that route we trade down:cool:
     
  5. Lukin

    Lukin Colbert '08

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  6. dolfan22

    dolfan22 Well-Known Member

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    I think Carey may be a very late 1st , but I agree with you , I think only Shawn Andrews is value at 20 for Olineman. Obviously Gallery is an early selection.

    I doubt Miami will be "set" on draft day. I think they will have several scenarios , and let the draft unfold.

    If by the draft Miami still feels that Oline is a notable deficiency , and that they feel they need to rectify that via the draft and if Andrews is not there I do feel they drop in the draft and get one of their targeted Olineman.

    The value for Oline is not in round one this year , but strating in round two and down.

    I think from how Rick has approached the offseason so far , we will make solid decisions and acquisitions in this years draft.
     
  7. Lukin

    Lukin Colbert '08

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    What makes everyone think Carey isn't #20 talent????

    #20 isn't exactly a high pick. And Carey is the 3rd best olinman in the draft. I would even say he's a safer pick than Shawn Andrews since andrews seems to have several question marks. Carey will be a great RG in the NFL. He's experienced, proven, and versatile. I say pick him up if you get the chance.

    If we don't take him at #20 we may not get him. According to that article i posted Tampa and New England have interests in him.
     
  8. LIQUID24

    LIQUID24 hi

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    I haven't seen one mock draft that has him rated in the top 20. Plus he's a guard. Plus there are questions about his work ethic from what I've read. Are those good enough reasons not to take him at 20?
     
  9. touborg

    touborg Board Linebacker

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    draftday.tk (danish, sorry guys) have him at:

    4.45, 4.56 ,4.35
     
  10. Lukin

    Lukin Colbert '08

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    I know he's a guard. Is that not what we need? But he's versatile enought to play tackle.

    I don't care what mock drafts say. I've seen mock drafts that have Kellen Winslow going 1st overall.

    Work ethic? This guys been a proven starter for 4 years. I've read nothing about him have a bad work ethic. What i've read says he's the most polished, nfl ready lineman in the draft.

    IMHO, he's who we need the most. So why not take him with our pick and be happy? He will complete what will be one of the youngest, most talented lines in the league that would be able to grow together and only get better as a unit.
     
  11. Agua

    Agua Fighting the media, one lie at a time

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    Just because he *probably* is the third best OL in the draft doesn't make him #20 value. There are too many players who are more talented at their respective positions than Carey that will be available at 20. Obviously, that' is completely subjective assessment but that is how you judge *value* at a position. Carey is late, late 1st round to 2nd round talent. If he could be picked up in mid 2nd and we pick up a 3rd, *that* would be a good trade.
     
  12. Agua

    Agua Fighting the media, one lie at a time

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    Let me guess - you're a UM fan / alumnus? :D

    Not dumping on ya man, just a lot of UM fans overestimate the worth of all their players in the draft. And, not without some justification because UM has been a veritable factory line of NFL superstars. And UM fans aren't alone in possessing that type of bias, it's just something as a non Cane fan that I've noticed over the years.

    [Edited to correct from the plural "alumni" to singular "alumnus"]
     
  13. Lukin

    Lukin Colbert '08

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    Okay...i'm not trying to make enemies here. I'm really not. I like you guys. But i'm really having a hard time understanding why everyone wants to trade down to get Carey. I don't care what his value is or how many players will be there at #20. TO US, he's PRICELESS. Why trade down and risk loosing him to another team??? He's the perfect choice for us to complete our young line. I don't know why everybody has this "Carey isn't worth #20 thing" going on. Someone must have said it one time and now everybody is preaching it. I bet if Mel Kiper or someone came on TV and said that he's a top 20 - 25 pick you'd all change your mind.

    Philip Rivers was a 2nd round pick 2 months ago now he won't be there past #11. Just give it up guys and admit that Carey is our best bet and we should draft him at #20.
     
  14. KB21

    KB21 A True Fan

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    How can Carey be a great guard at the NFL level when he isn't even a good one at the college level?

    Anyone drafting him as a guard is making a mistake. Plus, he has the same problem that Andrews has. FAST FOOD!! Andrews is a far more dominant blocker though.
     
  15. Lukin

    Lukin Colbert '08

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    Actually no, i live in KY so i'm obligated to be a UK fan. I know we suck but hey, we have Jared Lorenzen!
     
  16. BLITZKRIEG

    BLITZKRIEG ~LACUNA LEGIONS~

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    If everything works out, and we sign WR D. Boston, we'll most certainly look OL with the #20 pick IMO....

    If OG V. Carey is there, it should be a no-brainer. He'd be a perfect RG, and that's exactly what we're lacking right now....

    With WR D. Boston, there's really no need to draft a WR at #20. Unless Rick feels like there's a WR out there that's too good to pass on, I'd put my money on the OL....

    PHINZ RULE!!!

    :pirate:
     
  17. touborg

    touborg Board Linebacker

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    He is so funny.
     
  18. KB21

    KB21 A True Fan

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    Guys.

    Carey was much better at tackle for Miami than he was as a guard. He should be rated as a tackle, not a guard. He really struggled when he had to pull and make movement blocks as a guard. He's a right tackle that has a lazy streak to him.
     
  19. fairbanksb

    fairbanksb Panhandler

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    Where can I find the information that says Carey isn't a #20 talent? I have seen mock drafts that have him going that high. I believe one of them is on nfl.com. I have also seen mock drafts that show that he has moved up from the bottom of the first round. I don't remember seeing any mock drafts that show him lower than a 1st round pick.
     
  20. Lukin

    Lukin Colbert '08

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    Finally some people that agree w/ me. :whew:
     
  21. Nicky Napoleon

    Nicky Napoleon We'll Miss You Nubs

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    Lets assume we are getting Boston,then the biggest need for us are G, DT, and LB. IMO the biggest of these needs is G, I think Carey will be a great guard in the NFL. He has already trimmed down from his 363 college weight to 350. He is a dominating run blocker who allowed only three sacks all year at UM. That being said if one of the top 2 DT slip here I would be happy with either. But neither Wilfork or Harris barring some miracle will be there. Now if they go LB DJ Williams is the only LB they could possibly be looking at here. Of the three needs IMO G is the most in need of help which means either you reach and take Carey, or try to move down four or five picks and take him there. Unless of course Rivers is there then the front office should be fired if they pass on him. I just dont think Feely is the answer. Since Dans retirement we have raided other teams backup QB's its time to pony up the dough.:jetssuck:
     
  22. KB21

    KB21 A True Fan

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    If you go guard, Justin Smiley and Chris Snee are both better guards than Carey.

    Again. CAREY IS A TACKLE!!
     
  23. fairbanksb

    fairbanksb Panhandler

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    This info is from Sportingnews via foxsports.

    14 Bears Shawn Andrews OT Arkansas 15th (+1) 7/15
    With the addition of free-agent RB Thomas Jones, the team can address its hobbled and disjointed offensive line. OT Marc Colombo is recovering from a knee injury, and the coaches would prefer to move LT Mike Gandy back to his natural OG position. Andrews is more dominant than Gallery, but character, weight and durability issues will cause him to drop.



    20 Dolphins Vernon Carey G Miami, Fla. 26th (+6) 20/32
    With QB A.J. Feeley in the fold, the Dolphins now can address glaring needs at WR and OL. Carey has great experience, size, strength and versatility. While scouts say he can move to OT, he fits best at guard and could start there as a rookie.
     
  24. Nicky Napoleon

    Nicky Napoleon We'll Miss You Nubs

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    Thanks Fairbanks:hi5:
     
  25. Jaj

    Jaj What you say?

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    It's entirely wrong. Carey struggled as a guard. He is a tackle who can play guard, but not that well.

    I'd rather get someone in the 3rd like Snee or Smiley, and have them compete with a great run blocker in St. Clair, and Whitley.
     
  26. Saint Greg

    Saint Greg Pro Bowler

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    Vernon Carey
    Guard
    Miami FL
    6'5" - 360 lbs
    5.3 Estimated 40
    OTC Mock Draft Status: giants, #35 Overall Pick

    Vernon Carey is huge. He's a powerful, commanding blocker who excels in run blocking. He's no scrub in pass blocking, either. He's got pretty good feet, though he will have tough time with quick, smaller DTs like LaRoi Glover or Brian Young. He's got to make sure to keep his weight in check, however. If he gets much bigger than he is now, he'll really struggle to stop speed rushing tackles. He is very talented, and has good size, but teams question whether he'll be able to keep himself in shape. Should be a solid 2nd round selection.
     
  27. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Premium Member

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    The bottom line is a RIGHT GUARD in the NFL is not worth the #20 pick in the draft unless you firmly believe he will be the next LARRY ALLEN. Because otherwise guards, right guards especially, are MADE in the NFL not bought using high amounts of your resources. Using the #20 pick in the draft on a position is almost like paying him an $8 million dollar signing bonus in free agency.

    Why do you think the Patriots never even attempted to bring Damian Woody back? They don't want him at Center because he can't shotgun the ball, which is probably important in that offense, and they weren't about to pay that much money for a guard.

    We can find a RG by other CHEAPER means, might already have him on the roster (Yates or probably Whitley). Whitley wouldn't be the first offensive lineman that appeared lost his rookie year then then made a big jump in his 2nd or 3rd year.

    Having Boston means that we can select the best available talent, not draft a RIGHT GUARD way higher than most people had him on their boards. The bottom line is I have seen a lot of mock drafts, and I do mean a lot, as well as just plain draft research sites, and not one of them has given me the impression that Carey is worth the #20 pick in the draft. Any time I've seen him picked that high, or close to #20, it was TO the Miami Dolphins and these mock draft sites (if you know them as well as I do), tend to just assume that when a University of Miami player is on the board at Miami's pick they'll grab him...they also do it somewhat with UF and FSU players.

    We have a lot of options at this pick and there's a lot of positions we could use a potential star at way more than we could at RG.

    BTW if we get Steussie, which Big O called a 50/50 shot and all the papers are reporting that we're talking to him after we lost out on Folau, then why get Carey? We've already got our 2004 RG. His name is Billy St. Whitley. St. Claire would most likely win the start at RG with Steussie playing RT, and our line would be much the better for it.
     
  28. phinsfan1221

    phinsfan1221 FinHeaven VIP Donator

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    were not putting Carey down #20 might be to high i agree:cool: :eat:
     
  29. fairbanksb

    fairbanksb Panhandler

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    I just finished reading an article on Carey that says he has his weight down to 331.

    http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/7118328

    Offensive lineman Vernon Carey has spent the past four years as a key contributor to the Miami Hurricanes football team. The 6-foot-4, 330-pounder has won numerous team awards and has also received national recognition while helping the Canes advance to the Rose Bowl, Fiesta Bowl and Orange Bowl over the past three years. With the NFL his next step, Carey will spend some time each week sharing what's on his mind with NFL.com between now and the 2004 NFL Draft.)

    NFL Network

    NFL Network

    Analysis, opinions, features and more!
    MIAMI (Feb. 25, 2004) -- My trip to Indianapolis was a successful one as I did my drills and performed well at the combine. The NFL folks expected me to come in at 6-foot-2 and 350 pounds, but I actually came in a 6-foot-4 and 335 pounds. The 23 teams I met with were impressed.

    Now I have to turn around and get ready for my Pro Day on Feb. 28 -- nearly a week after the combine. Truthfully, I'm just trying to keep my weight down. By the time NFL scouts come to Miami I want to be at 330. Right now, I'm at 331, so I'm doing well.
     
  30. Saint Greg

    Saint Greg Pro Bowler

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    Absolutely right. You can get a good guard cheaper. I like what the Saints have done with their interior line. Lecharles Bentley was the #1 center in the 2002 NFL draft. We got him in the 2nd round....He's now a Pro Bowl Guard. In 2003 I had Montrae Holland as the 2nd guard available in the draft. He fell all the way down to the 4th round....And played extremely well when he filled in for injuries as a rookie. I think we will have one of the better young guard combos in the league now. I think you guys are doing things a little backwards if you take a guard in the first. You take a guard in the 3rd.....tackle in the first....not the other way around.
     
  31. BLITZKRIEG

    BLITZKRIEG ~LACUNA LEGIONS~

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    We've already got our 2004 RG. His name is Billy St. Whitley. St. Claire would most likely win the start at RG with Steussie playing RT, and our line would be much the better for it.
    =================================

    I don't understand what you're trying to say????....

    Are you saying that our RG will be either Billy Yates??? Taylor Whitley??? or J. St. Clair????.....

    None of them impress me as our possible starting RG.

    I've watched Yates and Whitley during the 2003 training camps, and neither appeared ready to start IMO. Maybe this off-season will be different, but I would rather find a proven starting RG, than go with a questionmark like those two are....

    PS. Isn't St. Clair an OT???

    PHINZ RULE!!!:pirate:
     
  32. eltos_lightfoot

    eltos_lightfoot FinHeaven VIP

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    I am comfortable one of the three at Guard. I am more concerned about tackle, but Steussie would alleviate that concern.
     
  33. Atila

    Atila Atila - the freshmaker. Finheaven VIP

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    same


    PS: i thought we're getting bobbie williams?
     
  34. FinFan4Life814

    FinFan4Life814 All-Pro Armchair QB

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    yea, i thought we had Williams in for a visit....what happened with that?
     
  35. Danny

    Danny FinHeaven VIP

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    I agree with the guys that think 20 is way to high for Carey. Not only that but KB's right. He was a better guard his junior year than a tackle his senior year. And I'm a Canes fan all the way. I'd rather have Snee, Locklear or even Justin as my starting RG. Again, not putting Carey down but I'd not take him at 20.

    Ozzy rules!!
     
  36. BSQX4

    BSQX4 A True Fan

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    C.K., Did you merge three names or something? Billy St. Whitley? Irony or typo?
     
  37. Atila

    Atila Atila - the freshmaker. Finheaven VIP

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    we're all wondering the same thing :)
     
  38. finfan54

    finfan54 A True Fan Donator

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    i thought it was pretty funny. But the more i read about gettng a Gaurd at 20 the more i think we will end up with a Safety or a DT/DE.
    Dont go thinking that ogun will not be asked for. Even though the asking may have been a #2, they are just waiting to see what the market is. its a long time til april 23.

    another thing, i think the one poster had it right about getting a Smiley in the 3rd or somethin. they will search high and low to find a diamond in the rough G. will we have a third from boston trade? that is a question now.

    i think spielman is going to target people at all positions reguardless. he rarely ever brings up a name he will draft. keep that in mind! If you keep hearing we will draft andrews or this or that guy,im 90% sure that is the guy we wont draft.
     
  39. Show Me Your TDs

    Show Me Your TDs My head's on Fire!

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    I really feel that Miami's FO will draft according to NFL potential especially if and when the Boston trade is over. If the trade is for a 2005 pick then will still have:
    1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 7.
    I would trade down till to the 2nd round and pick up a 3rd.
    so we would have a 2, 3, 3, 4, 6, 7, 7.
    I've heard through various articles and posts about Vernon Carey that he has been looked at as a guard and tackle which Carey prefers to play tackle. If Miami plans on using Carey as their right tackle of the future than I'm all for picking Carey, but why would they do that when they signed McIntosh to a 6yr deal. I have a hard time picking a guard in the 1st round b/c there are great prospects in the mid rounds to be chosen. Like Chris Snee of BC, or Chris Leckey of Kansas who can play C/G.
    I would draft:
    2. OT Kelley Butler
    3. LB Demmario Williams
    3. G Chris Snee or DT Tommy Kelly
    on Day 1.
    I also like CENTER
    4. C Alex Stepanovih of Ohio State (which purely relies on who we pick on day one)
     

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