Russ Lande's top ten at each position

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by MrClean, Apr 17, 2005.

  1. MrClean

    MrClean The one and only

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    For those who don't know about him, Russ is a former scout for the Browns, who has put out a huge draft book prior to that, and did again this year.
    I'm sure some will vehemently disagree with parts of his rankings, but do remember and take into consideration that he studies multiple game films of every player he ranks, learned about scouting from Bucko Kilroy and worked three years for the Browns.
    Here is how he ranks the players at each position:
    QB
    1. Alex Smith Utah
    2. Stefan LaFlors Louisville
    3. Jason Campbell Auburn
    4. Aaron Rodgers Cal
    5. Lang Campbell William&Mary
    6. Charlie Frye Akron
    7. Andrew Walter Az State
    8. Charlie Friehauf Colorado School of Mines
    9. David Greene Georgia
    10. Ryan Fitzpatrick Harvard

    RB
    1. Carnell Williams Auburn
    2. Ronnie Brown Auburn
    3. Cedric Benson Texas
    4. Ryan Moats La Tech
    5. Frank Gore Miami
    6. Ciatrick Fason Florida
    7. Marion Barber III Minnesota
    8. Maurice Clarett Ohio St
    9. Manuel White UCLA
    10. Vernand Mornency Okla St

    FB
    1. Keith Joseph Texas A&M
    2. Manuel White UCLA
    3. Matthew Tant Vanderbilt
    4. Nehemiah Broughton The Citadel
    5. Jeremy Thomas Georgia
    6. Will Matthews Texas
    7. Jon Goldsberry Purdue
    8. Madison Hedgecock North Carolina
    9. Kyle Eckel Navy
    10. Talib Humphrey Miami

    WR
    1. Braylon Edwards Michigan
    2. Mark Clayton Oklahoma
    3. Mike Williams USC
    4. Vincent Jackson N.Colorado
    5. Reggie Brown Georgia
    6. Jerome Mathis Hampton
    7. Troy Williamson South Carolina
    8. Mark Bradley Oklahoma
    9. Airese Currie Clemson
    10. Terrence Murphy Texas A&M

    TE
    1. Heath Miller Virginia
    2. Alex Smith Stanford
    3. Kevin Everett Miami
    4. Joel Dressen Colorado St
    5. Victor Sesay Missouri
    6. Jerome Collins Notre Dame
    7. Adam Bergen Lehigh
    8. Neal Philpot Pittsburg State
    9. Cody McCarty TCU
    10. Willie Walden Montana

    OT
    1. Alex Barron FSU
    2. Richie Incognito Nebraska
    3. Khalif Barnes Washington
    4. Jamaal Brown Oklahoma
    5. Marcus Johnson Ole Miss
    6. Nick Kaczur Toledo
    7. Todd Herremans Saginaw Valley State
    8. Trai Essex Northwestern
    9. Jeremy Parquet Southern Miss
    10. Michael Roos Eastern Washington

    OG
    1. Richie Incognito Nebraska
    2. David Baas Michigan
    3. Jamaal Brown Oklahoma
    4. Elton Brown Virginia
    5. Dan Buenning Wisconsin
    6. Marcus Johnson Ole Miss
    7. Claude Terrell New Mexico
    8. Nick Kaczur Toldeo
    9. Chris Kemoeatu Utah
    10. Evan Mathis Alabama

    OC
    1. Richie Incognito Nebraska
    2. Chris Spencer Ole Miss
    3. Nick Kaczur Toledo
    4. Jason Brown North Carolina
    5. Blake Lingruen Wake Forest
    6. Dylan Gandy Texas Tech
    7. Scott Mruczkowski Bowling Green
    8. Eric Ghiaciuc Central Michigan
    9. Robert Hunt North Dakota State
    10. Ben Wilkerson LSU

    DE
    1. Erasmus James Wisconsin
    2. Shawne Merriman Maryland
    3. Chris Canty Virginia
    4. Justin Tuck Notre Dame
    5. David Pollack Georgia
    6. Matt Roth Iowa
    7. Dan Cody Oklahoma
    8. Jovan Haye Vanderbilt
    9. Trent Cole Cincinnati
    10. Demarcus Ware Troy State

    DT
    1. Travis Johnson FSU
    2. Jonathan Babineaux Iowa
    3. Marcus Spears LSU
    4. Luis Castillo Northwestern
    5. Antajj Hawthorne Wisconsin
    6. Mike Patterson USC
    7. Shaun Cody USC
    8. Lynn McGruder Oklahoma
    9. Ronald Fields Miss State
    10. Anthony Bryant Alabama

    OLB
    1. Shawne Merriman Maryland
    2. Derrick Johnson Texas
    3. Ryan Claridge UNLV
    4. Rian Wallace Temple
    5. Matt McCoy San Diego St
    6. Darryl Blackstock Virginia
    7. Bryant Brown Houston
    8. Kevin Burnett Tennessee
    9. Jordan Beck Cal Poly
    10. Ernest Shazor Michigan

    ILB
    1. Odell Thurman Georgia
    2. Lofa Tatupu USC
    3. Channing Crowder Florida
    4. Barrett Ruud Nebraska
    5. Albert Fincher Connecticut
    6. Nigel Eldridge UAB
    7. Lance Mitchell Oklahoma
    8. Adam Seward UNLV
    9. Marcus Lawrence South Carolina
    10. Robert McCune Louisville

    S
    1. Josh Bullocks Nebraska
    2. Thomas Davis Georgia
    3. Vincent Fuller Va Tech
    4. Nick Collins Bethune-Cookman
    5. Marlon Jackson Michigan
    6. Jim Leonhard Wisconsin
    7. O.J. Atogwe Stanford
    8. James Butler Georgia Tech
    9. James Sanders Fresno St
    10. Matt Pusateri Miami (Ohio)

    CB
    1. Antrel Rolle Miami
    2. Carlos Rogers Auburn
    3. Adam "Pac-Man" Jones West Va
    4. Justin Miller Clemson
    5. Darrant Williams Okla State
    6. Eric Green Va Tech
    7. Bryant McFadden FSU
    8. Fabian Washington Nebraska
    9. Ronald Bartell Howard
    10. Karl Paymah Washington St

    If anyone wants to order a copy of his draft guide,
    go to: www.gmjr.com
     
  2. Jaj

    Jaj What you say?

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    Wait this is in order of how he likes them and the success they'll have? Or is it in actual draft worth.
     
  3. BocaHighQB

    BocaHighQB Well-Known Member

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    lol thats funny sorry
     
  4. Surferosa

    Surferosa Run to Daylight

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    He really likes Richie Incognito, eh?
     
  5. MrClean

    MrClean The one and only

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    I'd say it is how he thinks they rank ability wise, not how they'll go in the draft. Remember, back in the Couch draft, he went against everyone and ranked Couch about 36th overall. Now it appears even he was generous.
     
  6. wyo

    wyo vice ceo

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    I saw J J Arington was not in the top 10 RB and stopped reading. I do not agree with much of what this guy says.
     
  7. BocaHighQB

    BocaHighQB Well-Known Member

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    oo ok So it is based on talent it isnt all that bad then I thought it was his draft board.
     
  8. Jaj

    Jaj What you say?

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    If it was I'd say the guy needs to taken to a ward :shakeno:
     
  9. TeeMoney

    TeeMoney Penny Wise and Dollar Dumb Finheaven VIP

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    He has a very detailed rating system for each position and for a players athletic ability. I would recommend the book to anyone interested in the draft. Just don't make it (or anything else for that matter) your only source of draft information.
     
  10. BocaHighQB

    BocaHighQB Well-Known Member

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    It all depends, Lefors was one of the top QBs last year but he wont have success in the NFL I don't know how this Lande guy works. Is he a college guy or an NFL guy?
     
  11. MrClean

    MrClean The one and only

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    Yup, nobody goes into more depth and explains how and why he arrived at his rankings than Russ does.
     
  12. jnewmant

    jnewmant Hit folks and like it!

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    how do you know Lefors won't have success in the NFL for all you know every QB taken before him could fail and he could be the next Marino
     
  13. DonShula84

    DonShula84 Sporty Don

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    All I had to see was that he had Lefors as the #2 QB to know the guy was insane
     
  14. BocaHighQB

    BocaHighQB Well-Known Member

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    Sorry nothing is for sure obviously the way I made it sound I said he will definately suck in the NFL I don't know that obviously. He just wouldn't be #2 on my board right now.
     
  15. jnewmant

    jnewmant Hit folks and like it!

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    he wouldn't be no. 2 on mine either i was just playing a little devil's advocate there, i would really like to see this guys ratings system because i can't say that i like how he has most of his players listed
     
  16. SWS84

    SWS84 A True Fan

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    I've bought his guide in the past and I think KB turned me on to him. It was $25 then, today it's $31 + $5.00 shipping and handling. I think it's a very good guide and has lots of information, even if you disagree with his rankings. Currently, I am not working or I would buy it today. If Saban has his way, we are going to have more than just a handful of new guys to read up on and the more info we can get the better, right?

    Steve
     
  17. TeeMoney

    TeeMoney Penny Wise and Dollar Dumb Finheaven VIP

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    Do you dislike LeFors because of his height? Or have you come to this conclusion based on in depth study of his play?
     
  18. cnc66

    cnc66 wiley veteran bad spelur

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    I saw that, and he doesn't like Wilkerson.
     
  19. Awsi Dooger

    Awsi Dooger A True Fan

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    I'm always extremely impressed by Russ Lande's ratings. He is annually unafraid to buck conventional wisdom instead of the "why be alone when I can be a clone?" robotic idiocy. It's symbolic of that mindset that so many here are already ranting at his lists when they see differences from typical order. Meanwhile, by next August 4th rounders all around the league will be outplaying guys drafted significantly higher.

    It's weird, every year I find myself in complete agreement with Lande at some positions and totally different at others. Alex Smith first and Stephan LeFors second is exactly how I would place the QBs, with a mechanical clod like Aaron Rodgers laboring in fourth. Brilliant! Likewise Caddy above Ronnie Brown at RB.

    But how he slates Mike Williams as the 3rd receiver and David Pollack at #5 at DE completely baffles me.

    As someone else mentioned, I first gained respect for Lande when he had the guts to properly assess "crank it up" Timmy Couch in '99. I said on a radio show I wouldn't take him in the 4th round. We were both overly generous.
     
  20. dolfan_101

    dolfan_101 A True Fan

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    Clarett #8????
     
  21. DonShula84

    DonShula84 Sporty Don

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    Height and a weak arm. He is accurate and athletic, but with his arm and his height I just dont see how he can be the 2nd rated QB, when every other scout/expert has Lefors rated around 8-10 or so and this guy has him 2nd? If you've done an in depth study of him Id love to see what you think of him.
     
  22. MrClean

    MrClean The one and only

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    VERY well said. So many here, just as I thought, would be quick to slam Russ for bucking conventional wisdom. I'm sure everyone who has done so, has watched way more game film that Russ has. ;) :shakeno:
     
  23. DonShula84

    DonShula84 Sporty Don

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    Has he watched more game film than all the other scouts, or experts like Kiper? Just because he has watched more film than us it doesnt make him right :shakeno:
     
  24. TeeMoney

    TeeMoney Penny Wise and Dollar Dumb Finheaven VIP

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    But you think he's a nut because he likes LeFors, yet you don't know why he does, and the only thing you know about LeFors is that other scouts don't like him- not because he is a bad QB but because he isn't the expected height for a NFL qb. If I'm wrong, tell me why you feel the way you do, so we can all learn something.
     
  25. jnewmant

    jnewmant Hit folks and like it!

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    well pretty much all i can say is according to him it looks like Incognito is the best lineman ever
     
  26. killswitch

    killswitch engage

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    well said. I couldn't have said it better myself.

    For those who are new at following the draft, I can understand why they're so appalled when they see "unconventional" rankings like this.

    But, for those who generally follow the draft yearly, I think it's just rash and narrow-minded to laugh at rankings like this. This guy is obviously a credible source. If he pulled this stuff out of his a$$ then u could laugh at it. But, if u look at his credentials, look at all other past drafts in comparison with the general public's rankings of prospects, and then compare them with how those prospects have actually turned out, then IMO u should see it's ridiculous to make fun of this guy's rankings - his rankings are unconventional, but then again, the way the draft prospects actually turn out are also always unconventional when compared with the general public's rankings.

    I'm not saying u should agree with his rankings. I'm just saying you should take it for what it is: a respectable, and experienced talent evaluator giving his opinion.

    In looking at his past draft guides from his site, he did have Mark Bulger rated as a 1st-rd pick when the public had him as a late-rd pick. And, he was pretty much right on with Tom Brady.
     
  27. NathanHunt

    NathanHunt Fluff Girls are underpaid.

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    And exactly what has Kiper done to be called an "expert"? I don't recall many clubs knocking down his door when his future at ESPN was in jeapordy earlier this year.
     
  28. Phishstix

    Phishstix Finheaven's Fattest Pimp

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    this dude is dead on with caddy, though ;)
     
  29. finsnchips

    finsnchips 2005 FinHeaven GM League Champion!!

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    i lost interest way before i saw Williamson as the 7th rated WR, that kinda topped it off for me.

    brodney pool??
     
  30. Mitchy71

    Mitchy71 Saskatchewan PhinFan

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    This guy is an idiot. He won't take McPherson because of off season problems? Fine. Then he likes Iconginto who is insane, kicked out of two schools, and had a serious injury at the combine. While McPherson had a stellar combine and impressed all.

    I think I know why this guy is a FORMER scout anyways. And working for the Browns too, with all of their great drafts, we know why this guy isn't getting work anytime soon.
     
  31. duss12

    duss12 FinHeaven VIP

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    well draft incognito with your first pick he will play 3 positions at one

    I've always wanted to see a player start 3 positions at once
     
  32. Joneal7

    Joneal7 Heheheheheheheh

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    Chris Henry isnt even in the WR bunch
     
  33. byroan

    byroan Banned Hammered

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    Anyone who puts Clarett on their top 10 list for RB's in the draft, isn't very bright.
     
  34. silverloop13

    silverloop13 Dont shoot me Marcus

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    I have seen every one of his games in college and stood next to him twice, Ill post a pic if I can get it scanned. Im 5-11 and hes taller than me by a couple of inches. Hes about the same size as Drew Brees.

    He plays bigger than he is. He isnt John Elway but Id say he could make any throw Tom Brady could make. The thing that I like about him is he doesnt lock on to one WR like alot of college guys do. Look at Louisvilles stats. Hes also the fastest QB in the draft that will actually be drafted as a QB. Hes patient and tough. Hes faced adversisty his whole life ( family are all deaf) He doesnt force the ball and wont stare down his recievers. If he was 3 inches taller hed be in San Fransisco. He can make things happen on the run. He made blitzers pay for it.

    He also was recruited to Louisville by the current OC of the Dolphins and played the style of offense Miami will probably try to implement. He had Louisville beating Miami this year but took a concussion and left the game and Miami made a terrific comeback.

    I think in the right system he will be a decent QB and Id love to have him as a back up.
     
  35. byroan

    byroan Banned Hammered

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    That's all he's been his whole life.
    He's a nice player to have on your roster, but not the kind of quarterback that franchises are built upon.
     
  36. Oraclepz

    Oraclepz Seasoned Veteran

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    what the...

    all i did was take a look at QBs and that told me everything i need to know about this guy no wonder this guy sucks... what happened to mc pherson
     
  37. dolfanmark

    dolfanmark Seasoned Veteran

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    LeFors is 5'11" and 201 lbs. And he lacks a big time arm. Too small, and not enough arm. Not a good combination for a pro prospect.
     
  38. Fritz27

    Fritz27 Seasoned Veteran

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    How much crack did this dude smoke before he thought this chart up?

    :roflmao:
     
  39. TeeMoney

    TeeMoney Penny Wise and Dollar Dumb Finheaven VIP

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    LeFors is 6'0". He is incredibly efficient and extremely accurate (73.5% completion percentage, 20TD's 3INT's) . He is a very smart QB that can manage a game, makes good decisions, and can improvise when a play breaks down. He can't throw the deep pass consistently, but has a good arm and is very accurate with good velocity in the short to intermediate distances.

    He has been told he is too small to play QB since high school, yet he is still playing the position at a top level. In the immortal words of Mel Kiper Jr. "he's as good a college quarterback as there is". Twist it all you'd like, but I like the guy.
     
  40. dodge

    dodge Starter

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    i bought his book several years ago and was very impressed with how much info was in there. agree or not with his opinions, his book was very impressive compared to the stuff i have gotten from kiper, ourlads and others. last i heard he had went back to scouting, if i had known earlier he had a book out this year i would have bought one. actually i may order one tomorrow.
     

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