Some CFB thoughts

Discussion in 'NFL Draft Forum' started by j-off-her-doll, Nov 12, 2013.

  1. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    I've been posting brief rundowns of my first impressions on a forum that's just comprised of a few of my buddies. With a new work schedule, this has been the first time I've been able to regularly catch CFB live in years. Anyway, it's been a little slow around these parts, and this is my favorite board on FH, so maybe we can drum up some conversation.

     
  2. Pat-London

    Pat-London A True Fan

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    Completely agree with you on this one, I am most intrigued... I see him as a blend between James Jones and Jordy Nelson. A dynamic playmaker with the ball in his hand both as a wr and in the return game, but he's got a 'thickness' to him physically that I like. Would be a nice blend with Matthews who I've been very high on for a while now, just hope he gets more playing time.

    I have a feeling though he could sneak up into the 2nd rd.


    Coaches wise...

    David Shaw - yep, agree with this.

    Malzahn - wouldn't have considered this but it is intriguing. I would be ok with this if he could entice Kirby Smart away from Bama to run a 30 front with the personnel we have on D.
     
  3. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    I'd love Smart as a DC.
     
  4. hoops

    hoops exited stage left

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    i like landry more than beckham as a pro...landrys a more polished route runner physical and plays smart...beckhams got a limited route runner pro future to me...a guy that can't run a route tree...beckhams more explosive but i think landrys your more well rounded dependent consistent pro wr...

    for our system landry would be my guy
     
  5. Namor

    Namor Pro Bowler Finheaven VIP

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    Hoops..How do you feel about C.J. Mosley?
     
  6. Mudder1310

    Mudder1310 A True Fan

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    Agree on everything but Shaw. He enjoys accepting entirely too much credit for the work done by Harbaugh.
     
  7. Dogbone34

    Dogbone34 cowboy surfer

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    CJ Mosley is very good. He's an impact player. I would take him over the Tackles.

    I like the two safeties Hillary Clinton-Dix and Ed Reynolds.

    Beckham is clutch with attitude. He makes everyone around him better. I like Lee and Landry too.
     
  8. Fin Thirteen

    Fin Thirteen FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Given our LB woes, I've been looking at guys, focusing a lot on instincts. I wouldn't shut up about Kiko Alonso all last season and cant believe we didn't take that total no-brainer. But that ship has sailed so I'm trying to see who of this years crop can improve that unit.

    Not at Alonso's level, but UConn's Yawin Smallwood intrigues. Great instincts, good mobility, his tackling form needs a little work (not unlike the entire Dolphins roster). But he makes a lot of tackles he has no right to make with instinct and effort. If not the most polished LB out there, he has the highest ceiling of those i've looked at.
     
  9. TedSlimmJr

    TedSlimmJr Hartselle Tigers (15-0) 5-A State Champ

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    Bama's has only given up more than 20 points 4 times in the past 36 games. Johnny Manziel has two of those. Other was to Georgia in the SEC championship game last year, and gave up 21 points to Georgia Southern's option attack in 2011 as the team napped through that game with some starters on defense out with injury.

    Texas A&M with Johnny Manziel, and Georgia in the SEC title game last year are the only two ranked teams to score more than 17 points against Bama in 3 years.
     
  10. TedSlimmJr

    TedSlimmJr Hartselle Tigers (15-0) 5-A State Champ

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    Manziel continues to amaze on the field. I've never seen a kid who can run full speed to his left, and throw all the way back across the field to the right, 25 yards downfield, and zip strikes inbetween two defenders the way he can. I've never seen it before. He does it over and over again. I don't subscribe to any questions regarding the strength of his arm....they're obviously just not paying attention.

    Mike Evans isn't quite Calvin Johnson, but he's the closest thing to it since Calvin Johnson. At minimum, Evans is Vincent Jackson. I think he falls somewhere inbetween Vincent Jackson and Calvin Johnson as a pro. That's worthy of a top 10 pick.

    Jarvis Landry and Odell Beckham are both incredible. Both have unusually large hands for receivers they're size. Landry has the strongest pair of hands in the country. Every single game he makes at least one catch that is nearly impossible...going back to last year. He's better at reading coverages than Beckham, which is why Landry is used in the slot more. Beckham creates more seperation against man coverage. Gets open easily. Both translate extremely well to the NFL.
     
  11. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    I could well be undervaluing Landry. I've watched most of the LSU games this season, and I've liked him a lot. He kind of reminds me of a bigger Troy Brown. Based on the other WR's available, though, I think it'll be hard for him to go earlier than the 2nd. I know Beckham isn't as polished, but watching him on the perimeter, you'd swear he's 6'3. Chris Chambers was like that, and sometimes Beckham reminds me of him, but I think he's a better WR than Chambers was. Been a while since a draft had this many explosive WR's (assuming the expected underclassmen do leave).
     
  12. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    Now that is a WOW stat.
     
  13. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    Slimm, have you seen many drafts that have this much WR talent (again, assuming the underclassmen leave) toward the top? There are recent drafts where I can easily see Landry as a 1st RD pick; I think he compares favorably to K. Wright. Not that they're the same player, but both can play slot or on the perimeter. This year, I think he'll have a hard time going that early - though I can see a team like New England coveting him because of his football IQ combined with his versatility.

    I think you're spot on in saying that Evans projects between Johnson and VJax. As a talent, I think he's pretty much VJax, but, probably because of his time playing basketball, he plays with better balance and change of direction. How's your WR board looking these days? I've heard more than one announcer (Andre Ware immediately comes to mind) say that Evans has made Manziel this season, and I can't jive with that. Obviously, a talented WR will help a QB, but on many of Evans spectacular catches, there aren't any other QB's in the nation who could have given him the opportunity - whether it be due to ball placement, Manziel buying time with his feet, or some combination of the two. To me, it's clearly a mutually beneficial partnership.
     
  14. Fin Thirteen

    Fin Thirteen FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Given it's so loaded, I wonder if some of the underclassmen WRs will wait till next year to come out...
     
  15. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    I would agree, but Stanford hasn't seen any drop off - even with a vastly inferior QB. It's not like a Barry Switzer in Dallas situation, where the team was in decline the second he stepped into the role of HC.

    The only concern for Shaw - as I see it - would be whether or not he can build a program. With the right GM, I think Shaw would succeed.
     
  16. TedSlimmJr

    TedSlimmJr Hartselle Tigers (15-0) 5-A State Champ

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    This is certainly one of the better WR classes in terms of talent and depth if the underclassman declare. The thing about Landry is that Mettenberger will throw to him even when he's covered. He knows Landry is going to come down with it one way or another. I get the Kendall Wright comparison, except Landry is bigger. I don't think people realize that Landry was one of the most feared special teams players in the country as a freshman for LSU. He hit like a safety. Go back and watch the SEC Championship Game between LSU and Georgia that year... Georgia was literally afraid to return kickoffs out of the endzone because of Jarvis Landry. He's a special player. Bama wanted him bad coming out of highschool.... he was a 5-Star for a reason.

    I think both Evans and Manziel benefit from one another. Andre Ware has always had a particular distaste for Manziel. I remember in the spring before Manziel won the job over Jamiell Showers, Ware was comparing Showers to Warren Moon. I like Andre Ware and think he's one of the better commentators out there, although I think he's embellishing his point of view here a little.

    Also, L'Damian Washington is probably one of the most underrated Senior WR's in the country in my estimation. LSU wanted him really bad coming out of high school, but just didn't have room (schollies).
     
  17. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    I would say that'd make sense, but then I'd wonder which ones?

    Marquis Lee isn't coming back to USC; Sammy Watkins isn't coming back to Clemson; I can't imagine Evans returning without Manziel; Moncrief might, but it'd be dependent on a couple factors (is he more optimistic about the QB situation next year? Does he feel NFL teams will knock him for not having the same level of production as some of the other top guys?); can't imagine either of the LSU guys returning to a new QB. Does Allen Robinson come back?
     
  18. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    Washington gets good separation for a guy his size, and he uses his size well with the ball in the air. It'll be interesting to see where he comes off the board. I like him better than I did Jon Baldwin, who went in the late 1st.
     
  19. TedSlimmJr

    TedSlimmJr Hartselle Tigers (15-0) 5-A State Champ

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    I'd agree with that. To me it always seemed like Baldwin made most of his big plays at Pitt due to blown coverages. He had no run-after-the-catch ability. Washington has a little Sidney Rice in him.
     
  20. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    I like that comparison. Neither looks especially fast or explosive, but they glide and find space.
     
  21. TedSlimmJr

    TedSlimmJr Hartselle Tigers (15-0) 5-A State Champ

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    From what I understand Donte Moncrief, Mike Evans, Sammy Watkins, Jarvis Landry, and Odell Beckham are all headed to the NFL.

    I don't know about Marqise Lee, but I would imagine he's gone too.
     
  22. LouPhinFan

    LouPhinFan It's ok to say "I don't know". Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Slimm,

    What are your thoughts on DeVante Parker? As of yet I haven't heard one way or the other if he is leaving U of L early for the draft but it seems to me he's a second round talent. Big red zone threat with some RAC ability.
     
  23. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    Slimm and hoops, you guys are right on Landry. I was underrating his athleticism. Plays with great balance. Hines Ward?
     
  24. finsfanjay13

    finsfanjay13 Rookie Donator

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    My guess would be the insurance policy that Marqise Lee took out this year is indicative of him coming out. Definitely a stacked WR class if they all declare. One of the best in a while.
     
  25. Awsi Dooger

    Awsi Dooger A True Fan

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    Oh please. Don't fall for the simplistic knocks on Barry Switzer. That's the fool's route. In Las Vegas that was one of the most dependable litmus test questions we asked of sportsbook newcomers, their opinion of Barry Switzer. Anyone with a negative opinion flunked.

    Do you really think Jimmy Johnson would have won Super Bowls every season running? Jerry Jones likely did Jimmy a big favor by letting him go. Now fans can carry on the nonsense that Jimmy would have held up that trophy every year, just like Canes fans hold onto the garbage that Schnellenberger would have won 7 or 10 titles if he had stayed. Don't worry about probability, just project to the moon.

    Barry Switzer was a terrific coach. He was 5-0 combined against Joe Paterno, Tom Osborne and Bobby Bowden in bowl games. In the NFL, Switzer pulled off a remarkable feat by winning a championship one year after the team was dethroned as champ. Historically that is a terrible, terrible spot. Only three times in NFL history has that been done. It never happened in the AFL. The only two coaches besides Switzer to pull off the accomplishment are George Halas and Bill Belichick.

    Otherwise, I do have some questions about Manziel's arm. It's good but not special. It's fine until his mechanics suffer. He can't generate enough power with his arm alone. Manziel, for example, couldn't make the falling down 55+ yard heave that Tannehill threw on the final play against the Bills. The reason I don't list it as a concern is that young quarterbacks invariably see an uptick in arm strength once they enter the league. That is already true of Andrew Luck. Matt Ryan had as close to borderline arm strength as anyone I've ever seen at Boston College. It's still hardly ideal and gets him in trouble all the time. Many of his interceptions are cross field throws in which the defensive back laughs while cutting in front. But Ryan's arm is superior now than it was in college. It's questionable how long it will remain that way. He can't afford even a 5% drop to remain viable in this league.
     
  26. Awsi Dooger

    Awsi Dooger A True Fan

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    I forgot to mention that David Shaw has recruited even better than Harbaugh so far, particularly with linemen. He's stolen many premier recruits from USC. But it's true that the bulk of his starters have been holdovers from Harbaugh's tenure.

    If Oregon is ever going to overcome their frailties and play for the title it's next year, when they catch a young Stanford team at home, and Oregon's non conference schedule is incredibly favorable, with home games against South Dakota, Wyoming and Michigan State. Some analysts will try to liken the Spartans style to Stanford but Stanford is smarter and does everything better, not to mention familiarity with Oregon's personnel and tendencies.
     
  27. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    Barry Switzer is a bad example. I was about 10 years old when he started in Dallas.
     
  28. ChambersWI

    ChambersWI Owner of the Palace of Wisdom Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Shaw has been an incredible recruiter for sure. Andrus Peat is a monter of a LT.

    The more I think about it, the more I really want to take one of these WRs early because most of them have what we lack; big body WRs that can win balls in the air but can also get the tough YAC. Having seen most of him this year, I love the thought of Allen Robinson with our team (he's 50/50 but from a reliable source as of right now he's leaning towards declaring)

    Also, Johnny Manziel reportedly only goes to College Station anymore for practice or games and hasn't been in class for weeks.
     
  29. j-off-her-doll

    j-off-her-doll FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    I wouldn't complain at all about Miami going WR in RD 1 (depending on the WR obviously). There's a good chance a borderline 1st RD OT falls to RD 2 anyway - given the talent that will be there in the 1st RD.
     
  30. Pat-London

    Pat-London A True Fan

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    Im with you on this one and if available I'd love to have Sammy Watkins in this offense.
     
  31. hoops

    hoops exited stage left

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    Landrys strength stands out to me...he's a tough guy that will go get the football and not shy from contact...has a great body for a wr...built thick

    Mike Evans lacks Vincent Jackson's long speed other than that I get the comparison...still if he runs in the 4.5s at least like I think he will mid to late 4.5s I don't think he comes off in the top 10 although that win ability on the outside and in the red against smaller DBS cannot be ignored...I wouldn't be shocked if he ran low 4.6 he's not a burst athlete

    Cj Mosley looked a little undersized and light in the pants for me early at Bama...he looks about 240 to me now...I like him in coverage I like him vs the run I don't think he's great at getting off blocks or running thru trash needs to be clean to the ball as much as possible but his instincts are very good..he reads keys and shoots gaps well...this isn't Luke kuechly but it may be another lavonte David IMO weak side may be his best position as a pro...

    If I was rating him against David as a prospect coming out I'd prefer David I think...he seems like more the striker to me in college...but I loved David coming out despite being undersized...

    above all else I want or covet instincts at lb and I think Mosleys are very good...mike or weak side backer pro future and I think now he's an every down player...last thing I will say though is Bama guys haven't been lighting it up of late as pros so for me at Least there's some hesitation I guess...but not much

    Finally instincts wise he'd walk in the door with by far the best of our no instincts having lb core and the lack of instincts is what's killing us right now
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 16, 2013
  32. Tiger

    Tiger Well-Known Member

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    Storm Johnson is looking pretty good, anyone have any thoughts on him ?
     
  33. Tiger

    Tiger Well-Known Member

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    I've never seen P.J. Walker(freshman) play before today but he's been impressive so far vs UCF.
     
  34. Mudder1310

    Mudder1310 A True Fan

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    When would have ever seen a Temple player?
     
  35. Mudder1310

    Mudder1310 A True Fan

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    And if we're talking draft strategery then I'd like to see some combo of Lewan and Jace Amaro in the first couple rounds.
     
  36. dolfan91

    dolfan91 Starter Donator

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    Any Thoughts on Pitt's WR Street?
     
  37. Phinatic8u

    Phinatic8u Adam ****ing Gase

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    Miami's offense needs Evans.

    Big win option on the outside.
     
  38. SF Dolphin Fan

    SF Dolphin Fan Seasoned Veteran

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    I absolutely love CJ Mosley and the Patrick Willis comparison isn't too far off. If Miami can upgrade the offensive line in free agency, Mosley would be nice to have.
     
  39. ProStyle

    ProStyle Banned Hammered

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    Hundley looks terrible.
     
  40. ChambersWI

    ChambersWI Owner of the Palace of Wisdom Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I actually interviewed Devin Street for a radio show back in college. Nice kid. Big bodied WR that has put up solid numbers the last few years with horrible QB play (Savage has given them solid numbers this year though). Still a bit raw but worth a look in the mid rounds
     

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