The lawsuit will be against NFL not the Dolphins,hazing is a legal form of bullying. | Page 4 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

The lawsuit will be against NFL not the Dolphins,hazing is a legal form of bullying.

Spesh said:
Still worth discussing.

Its relatively simple, did Martin go through anything that could be construed as such:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hostile_work_environment

If yes, we lose. Period. And im not sure how anyone can look at what hes gone through and objectively say "yeah, we are totally fine, thats doesnt appear to be the case at all". All ive heard is people spinning this into a blame the victim routine and making wild, ridiculous excuses about how the NFL is "different".

And thats assuming Martin even takes this to court. I dont think he will...unless there is more information we dont know. The league is masterful at delaying cases or having them settled in their favor. The concussion settlement was for $765 million, which is supposed to cover everyone, including future players. Im not sure how anyone can think Martin stands a chance of a big payday by himself. Likely they would settle it for something like the veteran minimum($2 million). Martin could have made vastly more money just by keeping quiet and continuing his career.
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thats because you have a bunch of pseudo tough guys saying ridiculous things behind a computer screen. never argue with an idiot....they try to drag you down to their level and then they beat you with experience
 
butta247 said:
That is quite possibly the dumbest comment I've ever heard. Philbin and company did not direct RI to use racial slurs and threaten Martin. They ask him to toughen him up. You can't be emotionally soft and play in the NFL. You can't cry to momma when an opposing defensive tackle calls you a name or says he's gonna sh*t down your throat.

Dude if you were picked on as a kid...sorry about that. Look at this situation objectively and not about your own past experiences
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whats dumb about it? if the coaches directed incognito to "toughen him up" then they are responsible of directing him to implement whatever measures he implemented to get the desired results. it will be pretty easy to argue that if they did in fact direct incognito to do this then they should have been overseeing it to make sure it was kept within legal parameters. if they failed to do that then they will be found guilty by negligence. the courts aren't going to accept this type of abuse because its the supposed culture of the nfl. if it's illegal abuse then there will be punishements levied on the dolphins and the nfl. just by reading what has been circulating i'd guess the courts will find in favor of martina dn the nfl will very quickly implement rules against this sort of thing happening in the future.
 
jetsattack said:
thats because you have a bunch of pseudo tough guys saying ridiculous things behind a computer screen. never argue with an idiot....they try to drag you down to their level and then they beat you with experience
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which is why we wont argue with you...
 
jetsattack said:
whats dumb about it? if the coaches directed incognito to "toughen him up" then they are responsible of directing him to implement whatever measures he implemented to get the desired results. it will be pretty easy to argue that if they did in fact direct incognito to do this then they should have been overseeing it to make sure it was kept within legal parameters. if they failed to do that then they will be found guilty by negligence. the courts aren't going to accept this type of abuse because its the supposed culture of the nfl. if it's illegal abuse then there will be punishements levied on the dolphins and the nfl. just by reading what has been circulating i'd guess the courts will find in favor of martina dn the nfl will very quickly implement rules against this sort of thing happening in the future.
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Sometimes dumb doesnt see dumb....
 
WAKE oftheFlood said:
Yeah, it's not the fault of the coaches if someone takes things too far.
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That's why you don't send a Bozo to do a man's job.....they should have told Wake to toughen him up, ON THE FIELD....not by threatening his life and killing his family by voice mail lol you do it in the weight room, watching film, get nasty on the field, learn how to stop the speed rush, get stronger, learn your opponents tendency...not by being someone ATM machine....if Philbin can this order he is a fool
 
butta247 said:
Dude if you were picked on as a kid...sorry about that. Look at this situation objectively and not about your own past experiences
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I've seen others here say this as well. You're dividing the world into two groups: bullies and victims. You're wrong. It's true there are bullies and victims in the world, but there are also people who stand up to bullies when they see them taking advantage of others. And there are people who never experience either end of that dynamic and go their entire lives neither being bullies nor being victims.

For you and the others who are making this argument, if you really see the world as divided between bullies and victims, it's pretty clear what label you're putting on yourselves since none of you are claiming to be victims.
 
Fish-Head said:
I would GUARANTEE that there is some legal wordage in each team's charter about 'hazing' and or 'harassment'... From the NFL... That would hold them exempt (to an extent) from damages... Like colleges... Even when it is knowingly being practised...
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A team cannot exempt itself from the law. The employer is responsible for the workplace environment.
 
butta247 said:
That is quite possibly the dumbest comment I've ever heard. Philbin and company did not direct RI to use racial slurs and threaten Martin. They ask him to toughen him up. You can't be emotionally soft and play in the NFL. You can't cry to momma when an opposing defensive tackle calls you a name or says he's gonna sh*t down your throat.

Dude if you were picked on as a kid...sorry about that. Look at this situation objectively and not about your own past experiences
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They directed Incognito to go after Martin. They left it up to Incognito on how to do that. This is on the team. They gave Incognito the motivation and he went nuts(as he was prone to). If i let my dog run around a park without a leash, im held responsible if he bites someone.

:sidelol: at the objectively claim. Im going by the laws of this nation and the NFL's own rules. You and others have been repeating variations of "this isnt the teams fault because i dont want it to be the teams fault!" Victim blaming, excuse making, laughable justifications, false accusations about motives, Ad Hominem tactics, peoples own imaginations of what a locker room is, etc, etc, etc.
Just like every other company in America, the NFL has a responsibility for making a safe work environment. The Dolphins failed to do that. Period. End of story. As much as it enrages people, Martin is protected under the same laws as every other American. Deal with it.
 
Phindog said:
In your opinion it was directing harassment,in football world it was the coaches wanting to harden the player.There are tons of players coming out that said it was done quite often to young players that were a little soft.Today on ESPN am ex raven player I forget who said he has done it a few times even as far back as college.

The problem with this is there's no exact way to toughen a player up.Players usually do what they think would work for them and in Martins case,Cogs was probably the worse person to do it.
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Ive sait it before: the NFL is not exempt from US laws.

There are a ton of players speaking out in their supporting Martin as well. Ryan Clark, Coby Fleener, David DeCastro, etc. Regardless, popularity contests are irrelevant. Again: The NFL is not exempt from the law.

You can instill toughness without abusing people. 31 other teams have figured it out. The military has figured it out. Other sports have figured it out. We screwed up.

But yes, we finally do agree: Incognito was a horrific person to turn to for this. It was a huge mistake. The man has demons and putting him in a leadership position was a hideous idea. Unfortunately, it was a mistake that had consequences. Now the team has to make this right, because it failed Martin when it let Incognito off their leash.
 
Phindog said:
Martin has no clue what he has done in his rocking the NFL with this non-sense.

Hazing is a legal form of bullying and the NFL allowed it to go on without any guidelines.This is a slippery slope but if there is a suit and the fact that Martin more than likely will never set foot on an NFL field again,will have no choice but to sue.

What team in their right mind would even consider a locker room cancer like Martin? So if you're going to sue,they say go after the biggest phish, no pun intended,

The NFL knows about the hazing and allows it to continue.They are at fault as much for not controlling or setting rules in place prior to this ever happening.

The NFL avoiding suit may have to step in and come up with a financial settlement for Martin and re-evaluate their policies.
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This has been what it's been about all along. I always had this thought I couldn't shake. Why did he save that voicemail? It was from back in April, why keep it? Unless of course you knew you were going to use it at a later date. Here is what I think happened and I could be completely wrong but this is my hypothesis. Martin doesn't want to play football anymore, for whatever reason but he's looking for a way out. He skips two days of practice and as a result Incognito is basically told to get this guy back in line. So Richie leaves the voicemail. Martin shares the message with his parents (conveniently both lawyers) and they tell him to save it. They basically coach him on what to do next, he can't just leave right then because it would be a one-time incident and they need to make it look like this is systematic abuse over a period of time. So they wait, let the incidents pile up (expensive dinners, trips to vegas etc) and then when Martin is pretty much done they tell him that the next time anybody does anything to him to freak out (smash a tray at lunch over a meaningless prank) run away, check into a hospital for emotional distress, go radio silent, let the media blow everything out of proportion, then Martin and Mom and Dad get a nice multi-million dollar payday and their son doesn't have to get hit by big men in pads anymore. This whole thing feels like a set up by the Martin family. It's just too perfect with all of the hot topic issues present. It stinks.
 
Hayden Fox said:
If Martin takes this to court to prove a point and garner money, he is exactly what is wrong with this country.

This is not what the court system is for.
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With all due respect, this is exactly what the court system is for. What would you have rather him do? Take an AK-47 into the locker room and go postal on the team? The court system is exactly the mechanism that our founding fathers in their wisdom put in place to deal with situations like this.
 
and it would also explain why Martin never went to any of his teammates or coaches to get this stuff to stop...he didn't want it to stop, he needed it to continue to bolster his harassment case he and his parents were always planning to file against the Dolphins and the NFL
 
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