We’d be crazy to go into next season without 2 competent QB’s | Page 3 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

We’d be crazy to go into next season without 2 competent QB’s

The entire QB pool needs to be scouted. From the top tier prospects to day 2 and 3 guys. All options should be on the table and if the best case scenario means we have a fully healthy Ryan Tannehill and a future young franchise type of QB backing him up . . . .well then so be it. With the way QBs are dropping in the NFL u are likely going to see a backup get extended action eventually.

Dude, I would give you two thumbs up on this one if I could. We probably wont' do it, but I would love it if we used a 1st or 2nd rounder on a QB. Not taking anything away from Tannehill, but we need to protect our team and also create trade opportunities down the road. If someone decent falls take him in the 1st and then address the interior of our OL. Other positions I would like us to address are TE, Safety, and RB.
 
No interest in FAs?

I don't to be honest. I think its hard to do much better than Matt Moore at the position (considering he is as successful as anybody in a backup role, yet has a salary that is amongst the lowest in the NFL for a backup veteran QB). Cheap veteran with a proven track record of being able to win games when the starter goes down. I think people soured on him after the Bmore game but that truly is unfair considering the circumstances. Road playoff game at Pittsburgh in sub zero temperatures and a road game on a short week at Baltimore, playing those physical fronts with substandard offensive line play and just an overall lack of reps isn't a proper barometer. He has more than done his job, and he has done a good job.

I am actually not opposed to bringing him back and running with 3 quarterbacks, but with Ryan coming off back to back knee injuries and will be away from football game action for 20 months or so . . . We need to finally protect ourselves at the QB position. No the idea of drafting a projected backup QB in round 1 isn't a sexy one considering the issues we have, but it certainly should be on the table.

It is not a position you bargain bin shop for, take the best guy within reason that you want to develop and he either becomes an option as a future starter for your team or you can trade him down the road and get compensation back.
 
I gave you a list of 23 QB's taken in the mid-rounds the last 5 years. Only one is a good starter. Add in the 17 QB's taken in the 6th and 7th round the last five years and you still only have one good starter out of a pool of 40 draft picks. Sure, it is POSSIBLE to get a starting QB after round 2. Cousins and Russell Wilson are examples. But it's not a high percentage gamble at all. Personally, I'd rather use these mid-round picks to solidify my roster at positions that aren't as much of a gamble at that point of the draft and sign a different vet backup if we decide to move on from Moore.

Keep in mind the title of the thread contains "competent QB" - not starter. Miami has one. That said, every QB drafted is seen as a 'potential' starter who can be groomed, so, yeah, in that sense, a starter. But trying to find someone who can 'challenge' Tannehill? Not going to find that guy in mid rounds, and I doubt Miami will spend a third on QB.
 
Dude, I would give you two thumbs up on this one if I could. We probably wont' do it, but I would love it if we used a 1st or 2nd rounder on a QB. Not taking anything away from Tannehill, but we need to protect our team and also create trade opportunities down the road. If someone decent falls take him in the 1st and then address the interior of our OL. Other positions I would like us to address are TE, Safety, and RB.

Safety is essentially locked up. TJ and Reshad are expected to man the position for the next 3 years minimum. I know people want a centerfield type at FS, I think TJ will give us some of that Lou Delmas we have been missing and have had success in previous years. He has got better range and coverage ability than given credit for.

I think we need 8 more games before setting a priority level on RB and TE. Certainly BPA options, even in the first round.

Personally I think Tunsil, James, Larsen and Pouncey, yes Pouncey, are going nowhere next year. I do think interior offensive lineman will be high on the list. Likely the "top need" depending on FA.

I still think BPA on defense is always a priority. DT, DE, LB and CB always an option in a BPA scenario.

And QB of course.
 
Tannehill has never been pushed for his job. It was given to him and everything else didn't seem to matter.

That is not what happened. Tannehill wasn't supposed to start his rookie season. Garrard was signed to a one year deal and was supposed to start. Once he had surgery, Tannehill won the starting spot by beating out Matt Moore.
 
I'd resign Cutler to an equivalent contract of Tannehills' and see if real competition can make Tannehill improve. The loser takes a salary cut or is cut.
 
LOL @ anyone who thinks ANY rookie would come close to "challenging" or "pushing" Tannehill.

He would destroy anyone in camp, even a 1st rounder.

Be realistic.

I'll start with this... I am a Tannehill fan. So I want him to comeback next year and play at a high level and lead this team into a bright future. I don't want to see us move on from him. However, it is not impossible for a first round rookie to challenge or push Tannehill.

Let's rewind to the beginning of last season. We started the season 1-4 and during the game against the Titans some fans were calling for him to be benched and Matt Moore to come in. Through the first five games last season Tannehill had 6 TDs and 7 INTs, a pass completion percentage above 60 and a QB rating above 80. Now thankfully Gase backed Tannehill and we went on a run. During that run he had only one bad game against the Ravens, the rest of those games he played well to very well. But here's the thing about that situation, Matt Moore is a backup quarterback and fill in starter, he's not a first round pick. So would Gase have backed Tannehill if we had a first round quarterback holding the clipboard?

I don't think he would. It is one thing to brush off benching your starting quarterback for a career backup, but a totally different thing to do that when you've got a highly touted rookie on the books. This year Chicago benched Glennon ($15 million, multiple year deal free agent) for Trubisky (2nd overall pick). Last year the Rams benched Keenum for Goff (1st overall pick). A few years back Jacksonville benched Henne for Bortles. When your starter struggles and you've got a highly touted rookie quarterback on the sidelines, it is rare to see a team stick it out with the guy that is struggling. So obviously if we draft someone in the first round and Tannehill struggles early doors, a quarterback change is likely.

As for what a rookie can bring to training camp, well, I would tend to agree that it would be difficult for a rookie to outperform Ryan Tannehill, but it is not impossible for a rookie to challenge or push the starter. Last year Dak Prescott outperformed every other quarterback on the Dallas Cowboys - that included Tony Romo. This year the Chiefs drafted Patrick Mahomes tenth overall and he had a strong camp and some Chiefs fans actually wanted him to start over Alex Smith. Now admittedly, Prescott would not have been the starter had Romo not got hurt, and Mahomes is still the backup with the Chiefs, but both rookies left their mark and made a strong impression. One could argue that Mahomes' addition has brought out the best in Alex Smith because he knows he's got to play lights out otherwise Mahomes will take his place. Perhaps the same can happen with Ryan Tannehill if we add a highly priced rookie quarterback, but at the same time if Ryan Tannehill struggles with injury or performance on the field, then that could see Tannehill benched in favor of a rookie quarterback in year one.

So yes, rookie quarterbacks have come into this league and put immediate pressure on their team's starting quarterback, and while Tannehill has had a solid career to date, he has never been a top tier quarterback. What I mean by that is he's never gone on to join the likes of Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, and Drew Brees in that top tier. He's stayed in the same good, not great, category. I still believe he is someone you can win with, but when you are only a good quarterback your position is not as secure when your team brings someone in that can challenge and push you. For instance, Jimmy Garoppolo was never going to oust Tom Brady, however there is a very good chance that Jimmy Garoppolo could have ousted a number of other starting quarterbacks in this league had he been drafted by them. So while I am a Tannehill fan, I am also more than willing to admit that if our front office drafts someone early in the draft, he could end up being replaced if he doesn't play lights out football because he's not irreplaceable.
 
When Bradford was traded to Minnesota he was very close in age as Tannehill now, similar cap number, had previous knee surgery too...the Eagles were content going into the season with him as the starter but that didn't stop them from drafting the QB they loved in Carson Wentz, then they got lucky with the Bridgewater injury getting a great deal for him out of desperation a week before the season, which cleared the way for Wentz and his 16 starts as a rookie went a long way in the development and improvement he's shown in year 2. Can you really say Tannehill has shown that much more than Bradford had at the time he was traded?

We need to take a QB within the 1st two rounds, it's imperative. My dream scenario is Lamar Jackson in the 2nd. After that any team offering a 1st for Tannehill can have him. I'd strongly consider two 2nds as well, especially from a team like Cleveland that picks 3 times that round next year. But I highly doubt we get a 1, I don't think Tannehill is that highly thought of around the league.
 
Pretty sure Tannehill's $20 million cap number next year is the main reason why he wouldn't get beat out in camp lol, I mean it's not like he's a great practice player. Tom Savage "beat out" Deshaun Watson.
 
I'll start with this... I am a Tannehill fan. So I want him to comeback next year and play at a high level and lead this team into a bright future. I don't want to see us move on from him. However, it is not impossible for a first round rookie to challenge or push Tannehill.

Let's rewind to the beginning of last season. We started the season 1-4 and during the game against the Titans some fans were calling for him to be benched and Matt Moore to come in. Through the first five games last season Tannehill had 6 TDs and 7 INTs, a pass completion percentage above 60 and a QB rating above 80. Now thankfully Gase backed Tannehill and we went on a run. During that run he had only one bad game against the Ravens, the rest of those games he played well to very well. But here's the thing about that situation, Matt Moore is a backup quarterback and fill in starter, he's not a first round pick. So would Gase have backed Tannehill if we had a first round quarterback holding the clipboard?

I don't think he would. It is one thing to brush off benching your starting quarterback for a career backup, but a totally different thing to do that when you've got a highly touted rookie on the books. This year Chicago benched Glennon ($15 million, multiple year deal free agent) for Trubisky (2nd overall pick). Last year the Rams benched Keenum for Goff (1st overall pick). A few years back Jacksonville benched Henne for Bortles. When your starter struggles and you've got a highly touted rookie quarterback on the sidelines, it is rare to see a team stick it out with the guy that is struggling. So obviously if we draft someone in the first round and Tannehill struggles early doors, a quarterback change is likely.

As for what a rookie can bring to training camp, well, I would tend to agree that it would be difficult for a rookie to outperform Ryan Tannehill, but it is not impossible for a rookie to challenge or push the starter. Last year Dak Prescott outperformed every other quarterback on the Dallas Cowboys - that included Tony Romo. This year the Chiefs drafted Patrick Mahomes tenth overall and he had a strong camp and some Chiefs fans actually wanted him to start over Alex Smith. Now admittedly, Prescott would not have been the starter had Romo not got hurt, and Mahomes is still the backup with the Chiefs, but both rookies left their mark and made a strong impression. One could argue that Mahomes' addition has brought out the best in Alex Smith because he knows he's got to play lights out otherwise Mahomes will take his place. Perhaps the same can happen with Ryan Tannehill if we add a highly priced rookie quarterback, but at the same time if Ryan Tannehill struggles with injury or performance on the field, then that could see Tannehill benched in favor of a rookie quarterback in year one.

So yes, rookie quarterbacks have come into this league and put immediate pressure on their team's starting quarterback, and while Tannehill has had a solid career to date, he has never been a top tier quarterback. What I mean by that is he's never gone on to join the likes of Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, and Drew Brees in that top tier. He's stayed in the same good, not great, category. I still believe he is someone you can win with, but when you are only a good quarterback your position is not as secure when your team brings someone in that can challenge and push you. For instance, Jimmy Garoppolo was never going to oust Tom Brady, however there is a very good chance that Jimmy Garoppolo could have ousted a number of other starting quarterbacks in this league had he been drafted by them. So while I am a Tannehill fan, I am also more than willing to admit that if our front office drafts someone early in the draft, he could end up being replaced if he doesn't play lights out football because he's not irreplaceable.

Forget about these guys, he isn't even Kirk Cousins or Matt Stafford. He's basically on the level of a Dalton, and even Dalton a couple years ago performed at a level that Tannehill has never reached.

The rest of your points are dead on.
 
Pretty sure Tannehill's $20 million cap number next year is the main reason why he wouldn't get beat out in camp lol, I mean it's not like he's a great practice player. Tom Savage "beat out" Deshaun Watson.

Not necessarily. There is a potential out on Tannehill's contract in 2018:

- pre-6/1 release or trade: $4.6 million in dead cap, $15.2 million in cap savings
- post-6/1 release or trade: $2.3 million in dead cap in 2018 and 2019, $17.5 million in cap savings

Essentially we can move on from Tannehill next year and it isn't a huge hit to take. So if we did draft a first or second round quarterback and they showed they have the goods to play day one, we can move on from Tannehill without having to worry about the cap hits. We could also trade him elsewhere and likely get a return for him. It wouldn't be multiple first round picks, but I suspect there would be a quarterback needy team willing to send some picks our way for someone proven to be able to play at a good level in this league.

Forget about these guys, he isn't even Kirk Cousins or Matt Stafford. He's basically on the level of a Dalton, and even Dalton a couple years ago performed at a level that Tannehill has never reached.

The rest of your points are dead on.

My point with Tannehill was not so much aimed at putting him with the guys we mentioned, rather my point was to say that he is never become one of those quarterbacks that can walk into camp as the undisputed starting quarterback based on their success and production in the league. The only reason he has held that status here is because we've never brought in legitimate competition for him, nor have we encouraged competition for his spot. So if we did draft someone on day one or two in 2018, then Tannehill has to go out there and prove he's this team's starting quarterback because he would finally have legitimate competition for his spot. In a sense I think that would actually be a good thing, but at the same time I am still pulling for Tannehill to be the guy.
 
LOL @ anyone who thinks ANY rookie would come close to "challenging" or "pushing" Tannehill.

He would destroy anyone in camp, even a 1st rounder.

Be realistic.

Assuming he comes back fully physically and has no mental setbacks from having back to back knee injuries, he certainly is the "undisputed" starter.

But gambling that Tannehill reverts to form with no setbacks and not addressing the QB position behind him would be extremely foolish.

And I have to laugh at your air of confidence that Tannehill has been and has played like some untouchable piece during his career. A clear case of "battered Dolfan Syndrome" where you have seen so much bad QB play, one guy comes in and performs halfway decent and you assume he should be undisputed at the position at all times.

Tannehill has shown average throughout his career, hell a little below average at times, but clearly those last 8 games he was playing at an above average level and playing the best ball of his career.

I wish him well in his recovery, we miss his ability on the read option and his accuracy and ball placement on longer throws.
 
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