Why defend Gus

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by les dauphins, Nov 7, 2005.

  1. les dauphins

    les dauphins jesus of suburbia

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    Why are people defending Gus, bad play calling dropped balls I don't care he's not bad he's terrible let's just start sage or lemon (it's like a recipe) I know their probably worse than Gus but at least we''ll know there worse
     
  2. Dolfan4life!

    Dolfan4life! A True Fan

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    I have no earthly idea why, at this point, any person that is a fan of the Dolphins, would defend Gus Frerotten.
     
  3. les dauphins

    les dauphins jesus of suburbia

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    I know it's a joke
     
  4. DeathStar

    DeathStar Hall Of Famer

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    yep i agree. its sage's turn to start. i was one of those people that never wanted Gus brought down here. I knew he sucked before wearing a fin uniform and still sucks.

    I can't believe people that were on the gus bus haven't gotten off?
     
  5. phinz8202

    phinz8202 Well-Known Member Donator

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    well when folks start saying "maybe Jay wasnt so bad after all", its darn near impossible to defend Gus.
     
  6. les dauphins

    les dauphins jesus of suburbia

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    Some people don't realize that this is a team not a hershey bar change is good
     
  7. rafael

    rafael Hall Of Famer

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    Personally, it's not that I believe Gus is playing well, it's that I have no reason to believe we have anybody that can do better. The "let's give Sage (or Lemon) a shot b/c he can't do any worse" crowd just seems ignorant to me. It is the lamest argument anyone can provide. It amounts to "I don't know". I believe the coaches would put the best players in. To believe otherwise would mean that I think they are either incompetent or don't want to win.
     
  8. Wildbill3

    Wildbill3 Misery Loves Company Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    personally, I would trade gus for a Hershey bar. :evil:
     
  9. les dauphins

    les dauphins jesus of suburbia

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    Lemon or Sage can do worse and probably will but going into the off-season we have to know that not just assume it
     
  10. les dauphins

    les dauphins jesus of suburbia

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    personally, I would trade gus for a Hershey bar.

    we'll throw in reggie howard for a glass of milk
     
  11. Dolfan4life!

    Dolfan4life! A True Fan

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    At this point I would like to see what Sage can do in Linehan's offense. We aren't going to the playoffs with Gus behind center, I don't think you'll find many that will argue that point. We know what Gus brings to the table. We don't completely know what Sage brings, why not find out? I don't look at is as throwing in the towel, I look at it as trying to improve the play from the QB position.
     
  12. phinz8202

    phinz8202 Well-Known Member Donator

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    the only thing i can say is that we all know what Gus is. We are seeing it first hand and the rest of the NFL has seen it for 9 years i think. at best he is a backup QB. We dont know what we have in the others. They may be worse...but they may also be better. But we wont know until we get them in there and see how they handle it.
     
  13. islandah

    islandah FinHeaven VIP

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    Thank you. A voice of reason. Nobody is saying that Gus is good, but the reality is that for this year, he's probably the best option we have. Just because we haven't given Sage or Lemon the chance to fail doesn't mean they are any better. You have to trust the coaches ability to judge talent, leadership, etc.

    Also, remember that a big part of the reason Gus was brought here was because he knows Lineham's system. Installing a new system for the entire offense to learn is much easier when the qb knows it, even if he doesn't have the talent to really use it to it's full potential. Then next year,our new qb can learn it with Gus as a mentor and the rest of the O already familiar with it.

    We simply don't have a good qb on the roster. Wishing won't make it so. Saban is going to use what he's got this year with the long term success of the team in mind. Panicking and going to Sage/Lemon is something Wanny would do.
     
  14. ccphinfan

    ccphinfan Pro Bowler

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    It just sux...I mean, what a let down. I know thier was probably a better play to call at the end of the game, but to force a bad pass like that, i can't take it anymore.:fire:
     
  15. islandah

    islandah FinHeaven VIP

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    It's not our job to know what we have in the others, it's the coaches', and apparently they feel they do know. Putting them in to prove it to the fans is not something Nick will feel compelled to do, nor should he.
     
  16. Dolfan4life!

    Dolfan4life! A True Fan

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    You made my point for me. If we are going to have a new QB next year, and we are obviously going no where fast this year with the QB we have, WHY CONTINUE TO START HIM???????
     
  17. MiamiD3003

    MiamiD3003 Member

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    gus frerotte is the worse QB (starting atleast) i have seen since Jay Fiedler, and that speaks volumns. stupid play calling + stupid QB decision making = losss! :fire:

    on a good note: Ronnie Brown is quite a running back. You fear for the defender everytime he lowers his head to gain those extra couple of yards. The man is absoultely fearless and one of the few bright spots on a team of has been duds. Im sorry but i have to say it: we are terrible.
     
  18. islandah

    islandah FinHeaven VIP

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    Frerotte was aked why he didn't audible out of it, and he said he wasn't allowed to. It's like asking Fiedler time and again to throw the deep out. Gus is obviously a limited talent, and the play call with the game on the line and your RB's being successful should have put the ball in someone else's hands. Once you tell Gus , No, this is what you have to do, he really had little choice but to try.
     
  19. islandah

    islandah FinHeaven VIP

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    Hate to use the cliche, but the coaches obviously feel he "gives us the best chance to win." Plus, as I stated, if you accept that we aren't contenders this year, he's being used to teach the rest of the O the system for next year.
     
  20. OneHondo

    OneHondo Lifetime Contract

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    Its irrelevant whether we should or shouldn't have gotten Gus or whether we supported him or not. Bottom line is he is a poor QB and is not getting the job done. He is an aged quarterback with skills that are obviously diminished. The arguement that he is a good field manager and doesn't make mistakes is no longer valid with his late game ending interception. Saban and Linehans continued support of Gus is distracting for many in that it brings back memories of another time when a former coach supported his choice of quarterback irregardless of the situation, circumstance or outcome. Of course this is just IMO.
     
  21. Dolfan4life!

    Dolfan4life! A True Fan

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    I don't buy it, teaching is done during training camp and practice. If we are using live games to teach our players the system we don't belong in this league (by the way Gus doesn't belong in this league).
     
  22. rafael

    rafael Hall Of Famer

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    Who says the coaches don't know? That's my point coaches are paid (in part) for their ability to assess from practice who gives the team the best chance to win. It's not just a crap shoot. If you don't think the coaches can do that then you should be calling for new coaches.
     
  23. phinz8202

    phinz8202 Well-Known Member Donator

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    the only problem with that point is that it assumes coaches are infallible and stubbornless. heck, we just got rid of a coach who was known to stick with his own guys even when change was warranted. Granted he has seen Sage in practice a whole hell of alot more than any of us.....but he has yet to see what he can do when put into the role of starter and given the reins for a stretch. none of us has. whats the harm in seeing?
     
  24. islandah

    islandah FinHeaven VIP

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    Teaching the system happens in camp, becoming familiar and comfortable in it takes constant repetition. It can take years for a team to get to the point where it's second nature. If Nick believed the outcome would be any different, I'm sure he'd start Sage or Lemon, but if (as it seems) he feels they would do no better, might as well use the time to get the team reps.

    Everybody is knee-jerk reacting to Gus' bad play, concluding that these other qbs must be better. Just because one QB is not doing well, that doesn't magically improve the abilities of your backups. That reasoning is how we went from Fiedler to AJ. The failure of AJ is how we ended up with Gus. All throughout these sub par qb performances, multiple coaching regimes have passed on even considering starting Sage. That should tell you something. We are working with far less info than the coaches. If doing well in a mop up role predicted success, every backup in the league should be a pro-bowler.
     
  25. islandah

    islandah FinHeaven VIP

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    He has yet to see what I could do, yet my phone remains silent.
     
  26. phinz8202

    phinz8202 Well-Known Member Donator

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    are you out there practicing day in and day out?!?!? Guess thats why your phone is silent.
     
  27. islandah

    islandah FinHeaven VIP

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    No, but Sage is and has been for years, and his phone is pretty quiet, too. Guess they've seen things we aren't privvy too, huh?
     
  28. Dolfan4life!

    Dolfan4life! A True Fan

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    So Sage is not the answer, this coaching staff knows it, the previous staff knew it, you seem to know it too. Why is he still on our roster? Why didn't we make a move for Rattay a few weeks ago? He could have been had for a 7th rounder. If Sage is no better than Frerotten, he belongs in the Arena league. If he is as bad as you assume he is, I don't believe he would have been re-signed in the off season. I've got to believe Nick would have signed another servicable veteran while they were available.
     
  29. R_t_Kraken

    R_t_Kraken A True Fan

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    Why does everybody keep saying that Sage is probably worse than Gus Frerotte? What in the hell makes you think that? Because he hasn't gotten a real opportunity yet? The reason he hasn't gotten a real shot is because Gus is Linehan's boy from Minnesota. Although Sage heavily out performed both Frerotte and Feeley in preseason, he never got to play with the first team, and he never got a chance to earn the right to start for this team.
     
  30. phinz8202

    phinz8202 Well-Known Member Donator

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    and if that is true and you are Saban why not kill the QB debate by throwing Sage out there for a couple of games and let him bomb? at this point what is there to lose??? We arent contenders right???
     
  31. islandah

    islandah FinHeaven VIP

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    There are an awful lot of cheap backup qbs around the league that nobody except the very desperate think will ever be a legitimate starter. Sage is still on the team because he's cheap and Nick was concentrating on Gus and AJ at the time. Sage appears to be an afterthought to every NFL coach who's ever had him on the roster. Only desperate fans seem to think every professional coach and scout have been mistaken, sort of how they felt about AJ. I'm thankful to finally have a coach who assesses and evaluates objectively and doesn't sway with public sentiment. Almost every bad move made by the last regime was in response to public pressure. So we reached for a qb, we reached for an o-lineman, we reached for a RB. Those moves used a 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th round picks. 2 out of 3 of those players are gone. We got nothing for one, and it cost us a 6th to get rid of the other. I think I'm over letting the fans make the calls; I'll trust Nick.
     
  32. islandah

    islandah FinHeaven VIP

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    Because there is no qb debate as far as he's concerned and he's not here to indulge every fans' armchair coaching suggestions.
     
  33. Dolfan4life!

    Dolfan4life! A True Fan

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    At this point I'm not looking for a legitimite starter (in Sage or another veteran QB as mentioned earlier), I'm only looking for a better stop-gap than Gus. I can't or won't believe that the putrid play of Gus is the best we got.
     
  34. islandah

    islandah FinHeaven VIP

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    And that, my friend, is the true essence of this argument. Unfortunately, our coaches seem to believe it, and between posters on a fan website and professional coaches, scouts and talent evaluators, I've got a little more confidence in the pros.
     
  35. Dolfan4life!

    Dolfan4life! A True Fan

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    So the entire staff knew that Frerotten was going to be the 2nd worst QB in the league (thanks to Grossmans injury-insert Orton) by your logic. Yet not bright enough to realize we needed more new blood at the position than Gus during the off season. That, my friend is the essence of my arguement.
     
  36. phinz8202

    phinz8202 Well-Known Member Donator

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    just because he doesnt think one exists doesnt mean its not there. He will be hounded about this ad nauseum. smart thing would be to show everyone what you have in your cupboard so to speak. if its that bad, so be it. but just because Sage was passed up by others to start does not mean he isnt worthy to start over Gus. right now Gus is as bad as it gets.
     
  37. rafael

    rafael Hall Of Famer

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    Everybody is fallible. Do you trust the the guy with more info or the one with less? As to what it hurts, we are installing a new offensive system. Does it make sense to take the guy out of the lineup that knows it best?
     
  38. Dolfan4life!

    Dolfan4life! A True Fan

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    If he can't make the plays? Yea. If knowledge of the system is everything, put a helmet on Linehan and let's start winning some games.:D
     
  39. Superself

    Superself If you want to, we can supply you.

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    :lol:
     
  40. phinz8202

    phinz8202 Well-Known Member Donator

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    when you are as bad as Gus....no question. He may KNOW the offense the best but he sure as hell cant EXECUTE it.
     

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