Patrick Ramsey closing in on the Jets

BwanaZulia said:

Comparing Dante to Chad? Please. No self respecting Jet fan is going to take you up on that fight.


BZ

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So nyjunc isn't a self respecting Jet Fan? He said Chad healthy is better than Daunte in the other thread.

BwanaZulia said:

Comparing Dante to Chad? Please. No self respecting Jet fan is going to take you up on that fight.

But looking at the numbers... since they are on 4 games, 2 wins each.

- Dante had 5 INTs to Chad's 3
- Chad's Rating 69.9
- Dante's ratings 64.9

Not such a strong arguement.

But I agree with you, both QBs have not come up HUGE in the playoffs because both have not won the big game (championship).

BZ

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He never has strong arguments, he argues something that HELPS our argument and he also seems to ignore the fact that Chad a)played MUCH stronger competition and b) played his last 2 playoff games w/ a torn rotator cuff.

Comparing Dante to Chad? Please. No self respecting Jet fan is going to take you up on that fight.

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Don't fall prey to the fantasy #s, fantasy wise Culpepper is MUCH better than Chad but in real life Chad, when healthy, has been better than Daunte.

This should help:

Since 2002 Chad has been the starter for the Jets, in the 2 seasons he played at least 3/4 of games the Jets won the div in '02 and in both years made the div rd. In the 2 years he didn't play at least 3/4 of games the Jets won 10 games in 2 years combined. Since '02 w/ Chad the Jets are 21-16(2 losses occurred in very winnable games after he got hurt) and w/o him the Jets are 12-19.

-Since 2000 Daunte has been the starter in Minny and has guided them to the playoffs just twice(one time at 8-8) in a weak div and conf. In the games he has started Minny is 38-42, in the 16 games he has missed since 2001 the Vikings are 10-6.

Let's seperate those #s:

Jets w/ Chad: 21-16
Jets w/o Chad: 12-19

Vikes w/ daunte: 38-42
Vikes w/o Daunte: 10-6

let's also not forget that the Jets have played in the much tougher div and conference having not only a conf full of great teams but a dynasty team w/in it's division.

He is a fantasy QB, he is not a winner.

for the last time....I am not making ANY argument... when the argument to be shot down is so weak.

Now we are divining which teams are stronger than others in the playoffs?

Chad is a choker.

Section126 said:

So nyjunc isn't a self respecting Jet Fan? He said Chad healthy is better than Daunte in the other thread.

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A 100% healthy Chad? Yes, better than Dante (Smarter, better game management, less mistakes).

But will we ever see a 100% Chad on the Jets field? I don't know.

BZ

BwanaZulia said:

A 100% healthy Chad? Yes, better than Dante (Smarter, better game management, less mistakes).

But will we ever see a 100% Chad on the Jets field? I don't know.

BZ

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Stop being such a homer and think for one second.

What GM in their right mind would take Chad over Daunte?

Section126 said:

Stop being such a homer and think for one second.

What GM in their right mind would take Chad over Daunte?

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I am a HUGE Jets homer (voted biggest Jets Homer 2006 on JN) so that is not going to happen.

I know Dolphin fans are all excited with this new QB and all his regular season numbers, but before you start counting your Super Bowl wins, Dante has to turn those into post season wins and so far, so not-so-good.

Yes, I would take a 100% Chad over a 100% healthy Dante.

BZ

-Since 2000 Daunte has been the starter in Minny and has guided them to the playoffs just twice(one time at 8-8) in a weak div and conf. In the games he has started Minny is 38-42, in the 16 games he has missed since 2001 the Vikings are 10-6.

Let's seperate those #s:

Jets w/ Chad: 21-16
Jets w/o Chad: 12-19

Vikes w/ daunte: 38-42
Vikes w/o Daunte: 10-6

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I don’t want to start another debate on who is the better QB, but the win / loss records of Pennington and Culpepper are slightly skewed because of the contrasting seasons the Jets and Vikings had this past year.

The Jets had Brooks Bollinger as the QB and went 3-10 with him. The Vikings had Brad Johnson and went 7-2 with him. I wanted to go back from the time each QB first started and show you the win loss records of the team before the 2005 season.

Chad did not start his first game until the 5th game into the 2002 season. He started the rest of the games that season and the Jets went 8-4 with Chad. In 2003 the Jets were 2-4 without Chad and 4-6 with Chad. In 2004 the Jets were 2-1 without Chad and 8-5 with Chad. In 2005 Chad was 1-2 as the starter before he went down with the injury. Let’s be honest Brooks Bollinger is not the best backup. Before his knee injury in 05 Culpepper went down to injury in 2001 and 2003. In 2001 Culpepper missed 5 games to injury and the Vikings were 1-4 without him. He missed 2 games in 2003 and the Vikings were 2-0.

So, the records of each team without the starting QBs before the 2005 season looks like this:

From 2000 to 2004 the Vikings went 3-4 without Culpepper.
From 2002 to 2004 the Jets went 4-5 without Pennington.

Also, Chad has only been to the playoffs twice, just like Culpepper and both are 2-2. I am aware of the different divisions and other factors, so NYJUNC you don't have to reply about those factors. I already know your opinion, and have read all of your post. I am just stating the #'s before the 2005 season.

Section126 said:

for the last time....I am not making ANY argument... when the argument to be shot down is so weak.

Now we are divining which teams are stronger than others in the playoffs?

Chad is a choker.

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You are not making an arguiment b/c you DON'T have one!

Stop being such a homer and think for one second.

What GM in their right mind would take Chad over Daunte?

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If healthy? andy GM that wants to win and keep their job.

Also, Chad has only been to the playoffs twice, just like Culpepper and both are 2-2. I am aware of the different divisions and other factors, so NYJUNC you don't have to reply about those factors. I already know your opinion, and have read all of your post. I am just stating the #'s before the 2005 season

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The 2005 season does count though and regardless of that Chad has been a starter since 2002 and in the 2 seasons he started at lest 3/4 of ages we made the div rd each time while in the other 2 seasons where he did not we won 10 games total.

and we were 2-5 in games Chad did not start in '03 not 2-4 so w/ Chad starting we were 4-5 not 4-6.

nyjunc said:

If healthy? andy GM that wants to win and keep their job.

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Chad Pennington is no where near the QB that Culpepper is. Pennington will never be more than a system QB. He needs to be in a system that can hide his limited skills. Culpepper has a stronger arm, throws a better deep ball, is more accurate and is more mobile. Other than that, they are pretty close.

Pennington has never been asked to carry an offense. That's a good thing, because he can't.

nyjunc said:

If healthy? andy GM that wants to win and keep their job.
.

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That might be the dumbest statement you have ever made.

I am willing to bet that not ONE GM in the league would agree with you. NOT ONE.

The 2005 season does count though .

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I know the 2005 season counts, I was just pointing out that the Jets had Brooks Bollinger as the backup and went 3-10, and the Vikings had former Super Bowl winning QB (Brad Johnson) and went 7-2. To me that skews the #s a bit. The #'s are a lot different if you look at them before last season when both teams had comparable backups.

regardless of that Chad has been a starter since 2002 and in the 2 seasons he started at lest 3/4 of ages we made the div rd each time while in the other 2 seasons where he did not we won 10 games total.

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That's the thing with Chad though, since 2002 when he became the starter, he has played in only 39 regular season games out of 64 games. He has not proven he can stay healthy. That is one big reason why I, (and most people) rate him below Culpepper. It's not the only reason for me, but it is a big one.

and we were 2-5 in games Chad did not start in '03 not 2-4 so w/ Chad starting we were 4-5 not 4-6.

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You can't blame the loss against the Eagles on the backup just because Chad did not start. Chad played the majority of that game and attempted more passes than he did against the Colts, and Titans when he did start in that same season. So, it's not fair to say the Jets lost that game because Chad did not start.

Since you want to be accurate though, Chad is actually 22-17 as the starter.

FinfanInBuffalo said:

Chad Pennington is no where near the QB that Culpepper is. Pennington will never be more than a system QB. He needs to be in a system that can hide his limited skills. Culpepper has a stronger arm, throws a better deep ball, is more accurate and is more mobile. Other than that, they are pretty close.

Pennington has never been asked to carry an offense. That's a good thing, because he can't.

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and Daunte was asked to carry an offense last year- how did that work out?

Daunte has more physical gifts but Chad is smarter and more accurate and a LEADER.

I am willing to bet that not ONE GM in the league would agree with you. NOT ONE.

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IF both were healthy most would take Chad. A few would be tantalized by daunte's physical abilities and take a chance on him but most would be smart enough to want to win and keep their jobs and would take Chad.

That's the thing with Chad though, since 2002 when he became the starter, he has played in only 39 regular season games out of 64 games. He has not proven he can stay healthy. That is one big reason why I, (and most people) rate him below Culpepper. It's not the only reason for me, but it is a big one.

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Of course health plays a factor, I was saying IF HEALTHY. I know as of now anyone would take Daunte but if healthy(obviously he is rarely halthy) I think Chad is better and they aren't very close.

You can't blame the loss against the Eagles on the backup just because Chad did not start. Chad played the majority of that game and attempted more passes than he did against the Colts, and Titans when he did start in that same season. So, it's not fair to say the Jets lost that game because Chad did not start.

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He gets credit for the loss at Buf in '04 and Jax '05 when he left the game and the Jets were winning so why should he get credit for the loss in a similar situation where he came in?

He gets credit for the loss at Buf in '04 and Jax '05 when he left the game and the Jets were winning so why should he get credit for the loss in a similar situation where he came in?

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Because he played the majority of those games. The 04 game against Buff you are talking about the backup QB only attempted 3 passes, and one of those passes went for a TD. The backup also threw for 60 yards in those two completions. Regarding the 05 game against Jax, you will have to remind me who came in to replace Pennington.

The New Guy said:

Because he played the majority of those games. The 04 game against Buff you are talking about the backup QB only attempted 3 passes, and one of those passes went for a TD. The backup also threw for 60 yards in those two completions. Regarding the 05 game against Jax, you will have to remind me who came in to replace Pennington.

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He did get hurt w/ the Jets up and the Jets foolishly let him get cold at halftime then brought him back where he couldn't throw the ball 10 yards. I guess you are rigth an the Jax game last year I forgot Chad came back in after Fiedler got hurt. My mistakes.

nyjunc said:

IF both were healthy most would take Chad. A few would be tantalized by daunte's physical abilities and take a chance on him but most would be smart enough to want to win and keep their jobs and would take Chad.


Of course health plays a factor, I was saying IF HEALTHY. I know as of now anyone would take Daunte but if healthy(obviously he is rarely halthy) I think Chad is better and they aren't very close.

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Are you serious? How can you even believe that?

Not even close?

I think this thread should go to flippers finest for the comedic value.


Daunte isn't even close to Chad!
Priceless!