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Buy or Sell...NFL Draft Version

SF Dolphin Fan

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Fair point, and I do agree that we may be being mislead.
I am curious to see, when the day comes, if we stay away from opt outs, at least that high at 6.
Now if Parsons would slide to 18...different argument I think- value is just too high.
In general, I do think Miami will avoid opt out unless, as you say, the value is just too high. Parsons at #18 would be a dream scenario.
 

KingHydra

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Oweh is a quintessential, "Test like Tarzan, plays like Jane"; type of player. Don't get caught up in the measurables. He needs an Awful lot of Seasoning!!! And that still doesn't guarantee he becomes a solid contributor.
Totally agree on Oweh. He is a serious project that could go either way.
I wish Miami had more draft capital later in the draft. After round 2 our options fall off a cliff.
I'm hoping we do amazing things with 6, 18, 36 and 50.
 

Digital

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Fair point, and I do agree that we may be being mislead.
I am curious to see, when the day comes, if we stay away from opt outs, at least that high at 6.
Now if Parsons would slide to 18...different argument I think- value is just too high.
I don't rate Parsons as high as most, and even if he's there at #18 I'd still take Jaelan Phillips over him, because Phillips squarely meets our need and is the superior pass rusher. Parsons is less of a fit in Coach Flo's defense, especially given our roster at the moment. If we were to draft Parsons I think it would signal moving on from both Jerome Baker and Bernardrick McKinney.
 

Digital

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Yep, that's the risk now. Not just will the player develop but if the light goes on, will he sign with someone else.

I think Oweh would absolutely have been a Miami target last year when the team was clearly building. But, now I think the philosophy shifts just a little bit. The Dolphins need players who will come in and help right away.

On a side not, what is your feeling on Barmore? I personally doubt he gets past Minnesota, but if he's sitting there at #18 will Miami pass?
I like Barmore, and before we nuked our OLB/DE position I had him penciled in as a target for the #18 and #36 picks. Now, it's worth mentioning that those Alabama DL also are part of a group that sometimes look far better than they become in the NFL. I was/am a huge fan of Quinnen Williams for example, and he hasn't really lived up to his billing yet either. But, we did have limited success with Raekwon Davis ... so maybe our scouts have figured out which prospects we can get value from? To me, Barmore has a huge upside and the strength to dominate a DL in both phases of the game. He could seamlessly play all across our DL giving us an element of versatility that we require. If he refines his pass rush, the kid can really be exceptional.

But, then we brought in the DL from the Patriots to cover/upgrade from Godxhaux, so I don't really see the need any more ... and I'm less interested in Barmore as a luxury pick. Once we cut Kyle Van Noy AND traded away Shaq Lawson, we instantly created a crater in our starting lineup that Andrew Van Ginkel can not completely fill. If AVG starts in the Lawson spot, fine, but we still need a 3 down starter in the Van Noy spot AND a 3rd edge to pick up the snaps AVG had last year. We absolutely need to draft an elite edge OLB/DE and there are only 2 or 3 of them in this draft ... and 100% come with significant red flags, so we're going to have to "pick your poison" when we draft one high.

I think somewhere in the #18 to #36 range we should be able to get one, but when he's available, we need to pull the trigger, because they'll all be gone if we wait past #36. I think our plays are:
A) pick him at #18 and cross your fins
B) trade back from #18 or up from #36 to select one somewhere in between when the run starts
C) trade up from #18 and get your first choice
D) have our defense collapse in 2021 and regress back to an 8-8 or below .500 team and just hope we can fix it next year

Obviously, I'm not in favor of option D.
 

SF Dolphin Fan

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I like Barmore, and before we nuked our OLB/DE position I had him penciled in as a target for the #18 and #36 picks. Now, it's worth mentioning that those Alabama DL also are part of a group that sometimes look far better than they become in the NFL. I was/am a huge fan of Quinnen Williams for example, and he hasn't really lived up to his billing yet either. But, we did have limited success with Raekwon Davis ... so maybe our scouts have figured out which prospects we can get value from? To me, Barmore has a huge upside and the strength to dominate a DL in both phases of the game. He could seamlessly play all across our DL giving us an element of versatility that we require. If he refines his pass rush, the kid can really be exceptional.

But, then we brought in the DL from the Patriots to cover/upgrade from Godxhaux, so I don't really see the need any more ... and I'm less interested in Barmore as a luxury pick. Once we cut Kyle Van Noy AND traded away Shaq Lawson, we instantly created a crater in our starting lineup that Andrew Van Ginkel can not completely fill. If AVG starts in the Lawson spot, fine, but we still need a 3 down starter in the Van Noy spot AND a 3rd edge to pick up the snaps AVG had last year. We absolutely need to draft an elite edge OLB/DE and there are only 2 or 3 of them in this draft ... and 100% come with significant red flags, so we're going to have to "pick your poison" when we draft one high.

I think somewhere in the #18 to #36 range we should be able to get one, but when he's available, we need to pull the trigger, because they'll all be gone if we wait past #36. I think our plays are:
A) pick him at #18 and cross your fins
B) trade back from #18 or up from #36 to select one somewhere in between when the run starts
C) trade up from #18 and get your first choice
D) have our defense collapse in 2021 and regress back to an 8-8 or below .500 team and just hope we can fix it next year

Obviously, I'm not in favor of option D.
Honestly, after the trade of Lawson, I really expected Miami to sign one of the top DE's in free agency. Having a void there kind of limits the draft a little bit.

Now, I think Miami is in a spot where they have to draft for need with less draft flexibility. I suppose Grier could take Barmore at #18 and trade up, or see whose available at #36. Joe Tryon is usually mocked in that range. Perhaps Phillips drops due to concussion issues.

Watching Barmore late in the year, he played extremely well. He could give Miami a pass rush in the middle with Wilkins moving over to DE. I do think he's a little inconsistent still, but that would be hard for me to pass up.

If we're talking a needs draft, DE or RT at #18 would make a lot of sense. Maybe coming back at #36 for the position you didn't take at #18.
 
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gregorygrant83

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Can you imagine the nuclear meltdown on here if that happens!?
Now if someone offered me a 1st, 2nd and 3rd round pick for Howard in this year's draft I might bite. Use the first on Surtain and then still have two 1st, three 2nd, and 2 3rd round picks to address a need at linebacker, edge rusher, wr, rb ad c. Hell you would fill those need and still have two addition high picks to play with.
 

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Now if someone offered me a 1st, 2nd and 3rd round pick for Howard in this year's draft I might bite. Use the first on Surtain and then still have two 1st, three 2nd, and 2 3rd round picks to address a need at linebacker, edge rusher, wr, rb ad c. Hell you would fill those need and still have two addition high picks to play with.
Sounds like a Raiders kind of trade.
 

Digital

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Honestly, after the trade of Lawson, I really expected Miami to sign one of the top DE's in free agency. Having a void there kind of limits the draft a little bit.

Now, I think Miami is in a spot where they have to draft for need with less draft flexibility. I suppose Grier could take Barmore at #18 and trade up, or see whose available at #36. Joe Tryon is usually mocked in that range. Perhaps Phillips drops due to concussion issues.

Watching Barmore late in the year, he played extremely well. He could give Miami a pass rush in the middle with Wilkins moving over to DE. I do think he's a little inconsistent still, but that would be hard for me to pass up.

If we're talking a needs draft, DE or RT at #18 would make a lot of sense. Maybe coming back at #36 for the position you didn't take at #18.
If you don't get an OLB/DE edge who can play this system ... the entire system fails. Without that flexibility, you're a simple traditional 335 defense and we don't have the talent to make that special outside of our starting CB's. We pass on OLB/DE at 18 we're gambling one falls to #36. If you go Barmore + OT at those two spots ... be prepared to have a 7-9 season and be facing questions about replacing everyone.

No, I'll be shocked if we don't take a OLB/DE guy at #18 and gamble on one sliding to #36. If we don't take it at either spot ... everyone's head is on the chopping block.
 

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So many rumors flying during April in regards to the NFL draft. Do you buy or sell these?

SF takes Jones over Fields.

Atlanta takes a quarterback.

Miami takes Chase.

Miami pulls a big surprise and takes Surtain.

Jets get Etienne at #23.

Miami takes Phillips at #18.

Both Elijah Moore and Bateman go in 1st.

Four quarterbacks go in top 5.
Buy. SF didn’t even send anyone to fields pro day. Past history, Schneider wanted Rg3 when Shanahan was at Washington. They never wanted that type of a Qb so they drafted cousins. That’s the type of qb shanahan likes for his system. They will likely pick Matt Jones here.

Buy. If Atlanta isn’t able to trade they pick the best available qb on the board. No telling when they will be able to draft this high again and they need to think about Ryan’s replacement, also I hope so because then we are assured of getting either Pitts or chase.

Buy if Pitts isn’t available. Either way I’m sure we’d all be thrilled.

Sell. FO needs to set Tua up to succeed as their number one priority after passing on Herbert for Tua last year. Also you don’t trade back up into first round for a corner back especially with the depth at that position we have on our team. Iggy will likely develop nicely this year and we already burned a 1st rounder in him last year.

Buy. Wouldn’t be surprised to se Jets pick a RB here although I also wouldn’t be surprised to see them grab Harris here who would be my preference over Etienne.

Sell. Only because I doubt he’d be available at 18.

Sell probably not both.

Buy. This seems very plausible especially if the 49ers draft Jones as expected. Fields would be quite an attractive prospect at 4 and definitely worth trading up for by maybe the Broncos if the falcons didn’t draft him themselves.
 

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This team needs offense, to keep pace with the Bills and a edge rusher, RB is important but not terribly a must have early.
 

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If we hadn't so blatantly painted ourselves into a corner by jettisoning BOTH Kyle van Noy and Shaq Lawson, maybe, but now, no way we find a hybrid edge at #36 if any other teams want them. It's too easy to move ahead of us in the 2nd round and there are really only 2 or 3 real options for us. The more I think about it ... we're really tied into getting Jaelan Phillips or Zaven Collins, and only Phillips has that athleticism that Grier loves.
Zaven Collins also has the athleticism Grier/Flo want. Swiss army knife type player he covets. Waddle has this as WR as well. Does more than one thing really well. I can see them drafting both if they are there at 6 and 18.
 

Digital

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Zaven Collins also has the athleticism Grier/Flo want. Swiss army knife type player he covets. Waddle has this as WR as well. Does more than one thing really well. I can see them drafting both if they are there at 6 and 18.
Actually Collins is a player I love. But, I think he is above average athleticism, but not a freak athlete like Jaelan Phillips. Collins lacks both an elite burst and an elite top gear. I can see the argument that he is athletic, and he is deceptively fast because he covers ground in a hurry with his long strides, and just being 6'4 and massive (wide shoulders and wide hips) makes him look slower than he really is. But, at the end of the day, the NFL is a game of inches, and he's not quite quick enough or fast enough for me to categorize him as having elite athleticism.

I agree, it is a subjective approach, because where one draws that line and how it is evaluated relative to size (weight, height) is also subjective. But Phillips showed exceptional quickness drill numbers which back up what we see on film. At a weight of 267 lbs, those are extraordinary numbers. Running a 4.56 at that weight and 6'5.5 height is also exceptionally impressive. Now that's a Pro Day number, so it translates more likely to around 4.66 forty, but it's still very impressive. Judging by the type of eye-popping physical freaks we see Grier drafting (Noah Igbinoghene, Andrew Van Ginkel, Austin Jackson, Robert Hunt) and otherwise acquiring (Will Fuller, Byron Jones, Emmanuel Ogbah, Kyle Van Noy, Vince Beigel) it seems clear that Grier looks for elite physical traits in his position players. IMHO, Zaven Collins falls just below my cutoff for that elite athleticism, but is one of the best players in this draft because of his productivity, versatility, physical size, and all around football skills. If he posted Micah Parson's quickness/speed numbers, Collins would be by far the highest rated LB in this draft and probably a top 10 draft pick.
 

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Yup, lots of Smokescreens out there. One other rumor is Miami's interest in Sewell. I don't believe that one either, unless he drops to #18.
Wouldn't doubt that Flores was drooling over Holland. Really like him.
 

Jssanto

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So many rumors flying during April in regards to the NFL draft. Do you buy or sell these?

SF takes Jones over Fields.

Atlanta takes a quarterback.

Miami takes Chase.

Miami pulls a big surprise and takes Surtain.

Jets get Etienne at #23.

Miami takes Phillips at #18.

Both Elijah Moore and Bateman go in 1st.

Four quarterbacks go in top 5.
I think all of your stuff could happen. I do not want Phillips at 18 due to his injury history.
 
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