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Ereck Flowers

I LOVE the Flowers signing... very few Guards have his athletic profile. He struggled (badly) in space, but for a Guard he has better speed than most... and plenty of power.

If he'd been drafted as a Guard, he likely would have been a 2nd or 3rd round pick...

He was a legitimate bust at Tackle... just like Rowe sucked at corner, but thrived at Safety.

If Flowers hits... we'll call him a freaking bargain. If he sucks... we cut him after year two and move on.
 
Many may recall Robert Gallery---2004 2nd overall pick. Highly touted out of Iowa, graded incredibly high. Went to the Raiders, and almost busted out as a Tackle. Was then moved to LG, and played pretty well. Hoping the same here.
 
Which Redskins game were you least impressed with Flowers’ performance?

Bulaga? Dude is over 30 and never healthy. I would rather go for the younger guy who is just tapping his potential and I don't know, stay on the field to earn his money. This staff has deserved our patience at the moment.

Sorry was responding to Tom. How this happened I do not know.
 
Great college Tackle are moved to guard all the time, for one reason or another (not athletic enough, not as good in space, short wingspan), problem with Flowers, his athleticism and size was so good, the Giants did not want to move him inside.

It's very obvious that Flowers abilities in space in the NFL is just a weakness that should have been seen, but as a guard, his size and athleticism becomes a strength, so much that we might have still not seen the peak of him being better at guard compared to tackle.
 
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Bulaga? Dude is over 30 and never healthy. I would rather go for the younger guy who is just tapping his potential and I don't know, stay on the field to earn his money. This staff has deserved our patience at the moment.

Sorry was responding to Tom. How this happened I do not know.

No worries. When you choose Tom Olivadotti as username you expect to be taken seriously.
 
I'm in agreement, the typical stats for football are less informative than the stats in baseball. But as these things evolve so do the stats that track them. In years past a RB would have yards per carry ... but that is as much a reflection on the ability of the OL to open lanes and the deep threat of the passing game and the QB's ability in the short game to get the defense into pass-defense mode as it had to do with the RB's ability to earn yards. YPA isn't a useless stat, but it doesn't tell enough. Totally agree.

Today in the passing game we are seeing the Yard Per Attempt (YPA) used more frequently, and that's a step in the right direction. Unfortunately, stats don't take into account running yards into YPA, and as QB's get sacked or run as part of the RPO, those stats need to be factored into the YPA number as well, even if the QB decides not to attempt a pass, it was a potential passing situation. As it is now, the running QB's double-dip in the stats department not taking a 0 in the YPA if they decide to run, then getting their running yardage tacked on as if it is some sort of superlative. If their YPA is 7.5, then their RPA needs to be 7.5 to just average out. Most of the time, it isn't, but it is double-counted as some sort of wonderous thing ... when in fact it is not always a good football play. Similarly, we need to fix the INT metric, because as it exists now, it's simply not fair.

For instance, when a ground ball hits the 2nd baseman in the glove, and it bounces into right field, that's considered an error, as the fielder should have made the play. But if a QB bounces a ball off the hands/chest of a WR, and it bounces up into the air for an INT, we count that as the worst possible result for the QB ... which is ludicrous. We need to start assigning errors like they do in baseball. When it hits the WR's 2 hands or an area where both hands could reach it, that's clearly an INT on the WR. When the ball is uncatchable by the WR, then that's clearly an INT on the QB. We're never going to know for sure when the WR runs the wrong route, so keep giving those to the QB and just make due best we can. But another huge hole is that QB fumbles are not counted against him ... WTF?!?!!?? If a QB fumbles the ball, that should be counted against the QB exactly the same as an INT is counted against him. Who the hell cares if it was a running play or a passing play, the QB's poor play created a give-away! That's a bad play by the QB, and his rating needs to reflect that!

So yeah, our stats in football aren't as evolved as they are in baseball ... but those are just 3 easy ways to improve some of those stats. For OL, it would be more painstaking, but win % 1v1, pressures allowed % 1v1, stunt/handoff win %, etc., but yeah, we could much better quantify these things. Right now the far more general and less informative info are things like Sacks Allowed, Pressures Allowed, and Average Yards Per Carry over either hole the OL controls. Not useless, but they could be more effective. Quantifying things like chemistry would be harder to do, but they would show in the other stats I'd imagine.

Long story short, Ereck Flowers has good potential, but has never really lived up to it. He was ill-suited for LT, and I said that coming out, but he can definitely be a RT if he gets his mind focused and works on his game. As a LG or RG, maybe, but last season was merely good, and we're paying a lot for one year of merely good which is the best of what he's shown. These DT's in the AFC East are no joke, so it remains to be seen whether he can duplicate this, or whether it was a one year FA aberration. My fingers are crossed.

Fins up.
Could you be a little more specific with your thoughts? Lol. Totally awesome post Brother, it makes perfect sense to me and not much does! :up:
 
I LOVE the Flowers signing... very few Guards have his athletic profile. He struggled (badly) in space, but for a Guard he has better speed than most... and plenty of power.

If he'd been drafted as a Guard, he likely would have been a 2nd or 3rd round pick...

He was a legitimate bust at Tackle... just like Rowe sucked at corner, but thrived at Safety.

If Flowers hits... we'll call him a freaking bargain. If he sucks... we cut him after year two and move on.

Except testing says otherwise....

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Okay explosion grade, poor speed grade...excellent size though.

By Comparison..Glasgow who also was available for about a million more...

1584922718083.png

And here is Thuney...who we missed out on due to Franchise tagging..

1584922773774.png
 

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The Flowers and the Lawson signings were the ‘bad’ deals we made on paper. Both have been very mediocre football players in their respective careers thus far. Flowers sample size tape at guard didn’t warrant that type of money. And Lawson is a rotational guy paid like a starter. We’ll see if either has some more untapped potential, but I wouldn’t count on it.
 
Except testing says otherwise....

View attachment 42276

Okay explosion grade, poor speed grade...excellent size though.

By Comparison..Glasgow who also was available for about a million more...

View attachment 42278

And here is Thuney...who we missed out on due to Franchise tagging..

View attachment 42279

The thing about all of these stats that really stands out to me is that his weaknesses athletically are less of a detriment at Guard than they would be at Tackle. I agree that Flowers was overpaid, but he is pretty clearly someone Flores/Grier wanted. And the thing that isn't as trainable on an already large-framed guy is strength. Look at that bench as compared to the other two. As a long-armed guy, I can personally testify that the longer your arms are, the harder it is to bench well. If Flowers gets his hands on you in the space guards operate in off the snap, he's going to cause problems.

The Fins clearly saw something they liked here. Let's hope they're right.
 
The thing about all of these stats that really stands out to me is that his weaknesses athletically are less of a detriment at Guard than they would be at Tackle. I agree that Flowers was overpaid, but he is pretty clearly someone Flores/Grier wanted. And the thing that isn't as trainable on an already large-framed guy is strength. Look at that bench as compared to the other two. As a long-armed guy, I can personally testify that the longer your arms are, the harder it is to bench well. If Flowers gets his hands on you in the space guards operate in off the snap, he's going to cause problems.

The Fins clearly saw something they liked here. Let's hope they're right.

With the free access to NFL gamepass I have been taking a look at good old Flowers, particularly late season stuff, as he acclimated to the position. He is still slow-footed and pulls like ****. Which the RAS helps explain. Personally I think the team was all in on Thuney and wanted Flowers as well to compete for the other guard spot, once Thuney was tagged Glasgow was most likely already going to Denver and Miami was stuck with a Flowers being the key o-line signing.

It is complete **** once again where this team fails to address the o-line. A very mediocre center and an average guard. Good luck rookie QB.
 
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