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everson griffen

I think at 12, Miami's biggest need is SOLB. It is just such an important component of the defense, even moreso than ILB in my view. I think Sparano has even said that the OLB's make the whole D go. Miami just does not have a depth of talent at SOLB, let alone top drawer talent like Griffen.

I agree that Griffen has an Anthony Spencer visual look, but I would say more explosive. I think optimistically that Julius Peppers could be a comparison physically. Either way, Griffen certainly fits the trifecta's profile. The FO may see him as potentially having a DeMarcus Ware type impact athletically to this defense, which is sorely needed for us to run the type of defense we want. Interestingly, this is around the point in the draft where the Cowboys got Ware.

Our FO really does not like to compromise on certain measurables as a rule. I am talking things like arm length, hand size, height, etc. They also like "football players" and production. And Miami is not afraid to supposedly "reach." They are not in the draft like a miser trying to perfectly optimize value on everything they "buy." If the guy they want, with the right measurables, is there, they might just take the guy, no matter how blue Kiper, Jr. gets in the face talking about how the guy would have been there later. They want to make sure they get their guy, with the measurables they want. See, e.g., Kendall Langford, Patrick Turner, Brian Hartline et al.

If you look at the last two drafts, Miami has flat out drafted for the size they wanted across the board. Its actually uncanny when you even look at Davis and Smith etc. That makes me wonder about B. Graham and piques my interest on Griffen. The outlier of course is Pat White, and look where that got them.

Back to my thesis here. I am sure the FO likes Brandon Graham and Griffen, at least I hope so. Graham has had outstanding production. But I suspect that Griffen will have him beat on measurables. Isn't Graham closer to 6'1 and Griffen more like 6'3? The FO tends to stick to its guns on what it wants physically. Zach Thomas never would have had a chance with these guys philosophically. I admire that these guys stick to their guns. The reason is that when you put an entire squad together of guys that have the right measurables, you get a certain synergy where the pieces fit together better.

I think Griffen's sheer potential may give him the edge. I am not sure Miami would have the opportunity to get a specimen/athlete/"football player" like Griffen anytime soon, in this or any other draft or even realistically in free agency. If he's there and he interviews well, I would think he would be tough to pass. I am getting a tad nervous Griffen won't be there at 12. If he is not, I like Graham as well.

Well said. This is part of why I'm so curious to see what Merling could bring, or at least project to bring, as the SOLB. Because we're talking about a guy who's nearly 6'5", 270 (at one point), with 33+ inch arms who's been timed as fast as 4.63.

Sounds like a good prospect out there to me. The problem is I only remember him playing a little in a 2 point stance at Clemson, I don't know how well he was considered to have done out there in space.
 
Well said. This is part of why I'm so curious to see what Merling could bring, or at least project to bring, as the SOLB. Because we're talking about a guy who's nearly 6'5", 270 (at one point), with 33+ inch arms who's been timed as fast as 4.63.

Sounds like a good prospect out there to me. The problem is I only remember him playing a little in a 2 point stance at Clemson, I don't know how well he was considered to have done out there in space.

hmmm...i thought merling was still dealing with a hernia injury at the combine and couldn't run a 40 at his pro day workout...

if that is the case and that timed run was lets say at clemson i'd say it's anything but official...unless i'm mistaken about merling being unable to run prior to the draft...
 
hmmm...i thought merling was still dealing with a hernia injury at the combine and couldn't run a 40 at his pro day workout...

if that is the case and that timed run was lets say at clemson i'd say it's anything but official...unless i'm mistaken about merling being unable to run prior to the draft...



i remember him beign hurt, and thats why we got him where we did. I would love to see the 40 time in some sort of credible source. As I don't remember him running a 40 in any instance as well.

although, I am intrigued by the possibility of him moving to LB.
 
hmmm...i thought merling was still dealing with a hernia injury at the combine and couldn't run a 40 at his pro day workout...

if that is the case and that timed run was lets say at clemson i'd say it's anything but official...unless i'm mistaken about merling being unable to run prior to the draft...

Yeah, he didn't run at the combine because of that hernia injury. I'm not sure where/when the 4.63 was timed. I think the consensus though was that he was approximately a 4.7 kind of guy.
 
I don't think Merling did anything at the combine if I remember correctly...(other than bench maybe?)....I know he didn't run...not even at his pro day..

Everson Griffen possesses so many of the things that I loved so much about Orakpo...and even some that Orakpo didn't have...

He's going nowhere but up as we get closer and closer to April in my opinion......STUD..
 
Honestly he doesn't look explosive at all to me. He has a great spin move but I don't see anything worth a pick in the first or second round
 
Merling didn't run until a private pro day on the eve of the draft, IIRC. I thought he ran in the low 4.7's. Someone with connections to the Dolphins D staff once told me that Merling is ridiculously athletic and easily the most athletic of the DLs.
 
Love Griffen. Not better than Graham, but it's very close. Wouldn't be upset with either at #12. Derrick Morgan won't last to #12 amd JPP is too much of a project to take that high. Griffen and Jason Worilds are two of my favorite OLB prospects in the draft.


I have waaaayy too many issues with JPP you suggest taking him in the top 20 as of right now.
 
So on Griffen, here is what I'm seeing:

Good effort, high motor, great attitude, plays tough, good at finishing plays, shown to over pursue plays, takes some questionable angles at times, better reaction times when standing up rather than in his stance. Reads the play then attacks.
 
So im leaning on #12 being griffin or Grahem now.. Barring a free fallng berry or Mcclain. Also would love to see merling lose some weight and play OLB
 
When I was watching Everson, what I saw was a guy whose legs and feet I wish I could cut off and transplant onto Derrick Morgan.

Everson's ability to drop his knees down and plant, then drive off is really unfair for such a big man. The problem is, I can think of a number of things right off the bat that Everson does not do as well as Morgan.

1. He's not at all consistent getting off the ball. He doesn't react that quickly to the snap most times, though he does it sometimes.

2. He is in no way consistent when it comes to bumping receivers and tight ends in his area. Just not aggressive enough this way.

3. He doesn't forcefully move the tight end in order to squeeze interior gaps.

4. He continues to show a lack of maturity even after learning from his sophomore year. Watch him have an exquisite play against Notre Dame re-directing a Tight End at the line, stunting inside to find the open gap, bursting through the hole, making a cut that only he among other big men can make, accelerating like an Aston Martin to catch Jimmy Clausen from behind for a sack...and then finishing off by stupidly posing in front of the cameras and giving a Mr. Universe pose for an extended period of time, even while a ref tries to pull his arms down to help him avoid the penalty...but he refuses to put his arms down and the same ref is forced to throw the flag for unsportsmanlike.

And another criticism, remembering that I really like him as a prospect and would probably forecast him to Miami right now as things stand, is that he basically played at a high level for half of a year. That's it. He showed flashes as a freshman and made freshman All America while only starting a few games. He lost his job as a sophomore. He re-claimed it and showed all the right things during the run up to the season. He was on an absolute tear when he injured his toe against Oregon State, which kept him out of the Arizona State game and affected him in the Stanford, UCLA and Arizona games. He was healthier by the Emerald Bowl but then a lineman cut blocked him and he injured his ankle, missed most of the game.
 
If you're a Canes fan but don't follow USC closely, Everson Griffen is a simple comparison: Allen Bailey. Both were legends coming out of high school, from a neighboring state and with freakish builds, although Griffen was rated higher. Bailey is thicker and not nearly as agile, a DT/DE combo while Griffen is DE/SOLB.

A guy like Griffen is going to destroy the combine. You can throw out any mock that doesn't appreciate that. He has very long arms and his torso photo will be the antithesis of that Terrence Cody disaster.

I'm a USC alum and post on a couple of their forums. Griffen draws plenty of reaction in both directions on those sites. Everyone knew he was a 3 and out guy. Supposedly he thrived in college atmosphere, once he got there, but USC insiders insist he never would have attended college in the first place if it weren't an NFL prerequisite. He always seemed passionate on the field, celebrating big plays almost like the late '80s Canes, and I loved it. The skeptics claimed it was a me-first enthusiasm. Many posters thought he coasted through college as an NFL stepping stone, and didn't pick up his game until he HAD to, early in 2009, when he knew it was his final season and his draft status was in jeopardy. The wag comparison is Joe McKnight, another 5 star early entry who teased more than delivered at USC but will tempt NFL teams with talent in reserve.

I doubt any other college defense in modern history was talented enough to bench Everson Griffen. It was the right call for 2008 USC. Matthews was noticeably more relentless, with better short range burst and agile adjustments. Griffen is more fast than quick. You won't see the great burst off the ball but he tries to compensate by anticipating the snap count. And generally he has a good knack for that but occasionally is burned, like a critical offside call to keep a drive alive in the key possession of the Arizona game when bowl slotting was at stake.

The debacle at Oregon ruined USC's 2009 season and Griffen got hurt in that game. I think it was turf toe, which can linger, if anyone remembers examples like Jack Lambert. Griffen never regained the pre-Oregon form, leading the conference in sacks. No doubt he already would be slotted higher minus that toe injury.

I concede I dislike the 3-4 and generally ignore players who seem like an ideal fit. That being said, Griffen jumps out as a Patriots-type defender. I remember thinking that several times. You can slot him anywhere, up or down, and he'll make plays versus the run or pass. Very rare combo: Fluid in space while naturally tough at the point of attack. USC lined him up all over the place, although generally LDE. He gains weight every year, which is problematic toward SOLB. The 2009 Griffen was too thick for that position, IMO. But at the proper weight he'll make Merling's build look like a bottom heavy joke in terms of the same transition.

Griffen carries a bit of boom or bust concern: Is the long term NFL passion money driven, or will he thrive once he's where he feels he rightfully belongs? But I couldn't argue with the pick at #12. At some point you need to gamble on greatness and tip the field in terms of size and sheer athletic ability, like the Dolphins did with Richmond Webb and Keith Sims two decades ago. A Rolando McLain is a nice addition but it's merely checking off a need box, a tidy upgrade. No one in the league would be shaking if Miami suddenly has Rolando McLain. On the other hand, freak is a rarely summoned word and no one has ever questioned the legitimacy of attaching that label to Griffen. He's also a well spoken guy, and has never been an off field concern. The only exceptions were trivial.

Besides, we need USC guys. The avoidance has been preposterous for more than 4 decades; Roy Foster and virtually no one else.
 
Nice posts CK and Awsi. If Griffen really is 278 (he looks it), I'd like to see him get down to around 270 - not that he needs to.

Also, people tend to discount toe injuries, but they hinder athletes a great deal. It's not surprising that his production went down. Of course, you'd like to see him fight through it a little better, but it's difficult on the severity of the injury.
 
The problem is, I can think of a number of things right off the bat that Everson does not do as well as Morgan.

1. He's not at all consistent getting off the ball. He doesn't react that quickly to the snap most times, though he does it sometimes.

2. He is in no way consistent when it comes to bumping receivers and tight ends in his area. Just not aggressive enough this way.

3. He doesn't forcefully move the tight end in order to squeeze interior gaps.

4. He continues to show a lack of maturity even after learning from his sophomore year. Watch him have an exquisite play against Notre Dame re-directing a Tight End at the line, stunting inside to find the open gap, bursting through the hole, making a cut that only he among other big men can make, accelerating like an Aston Martin to catch Jimmy Clausen from behind for a sack...and then finishing off by stupidly posing in front of the cameras and giving a Mr. Universe pose for an extended period of time, even while a ref tries to pull his arms down to help him avoid the penalty...but he refuses to put his arms down and the same ref is forced to throw the flag for unsportsmanlike.

And another criticism, remembering that I really like him as a prospect and would probably forecast him to Miami right now as things stand, is that he basically played at a high level for half of a year. That's it. He showed flashes as a freshman and made freshman All America while only starting a few games. He lost his job as a sophomore. He re-claimed it and showed all the right things during the run up to the season. He was on an absolute tear when he injured his toe against Oregon State, which kept him out of the Arizona State game and affected him in the Stanford, UCLA and Arizona games. He was healthier by the Emerald Bowl but then a lineman cut blocked him and he injured his ankle, missed most of the game.


Interesting analysis. The nice thing is that every single thing you mentioned is correctable. This is a kid who started as a true Freshman and only had 3 years in college, with no redshirt season, and was a backup his soph season. I also read somewhere that he is reasonably bright and hopefully will have aptitude to learn. I think his interview will be critical in the FO's eyes.
 
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