Fitz is fun to watch but its time for Tua

[Sirspud]

Everything said about Fitzpatrick's command of the playbook and his extraordinary intangibles are true. But anyone who is watching closely - as I was - last night and previously this season can see that Fitz really doesn't go downfield, like barely at all, and virtually all his throws are line drives. They are good line drives within 20 yards of the line of scrimmage and those lasers are good on slants and crosses in the end zone, but they are still just basically one type of throw.

I can't help but think how much better a gifted quarterback like Tagovailoa would be, should he have command of the playbook and timing with his receivers, in attacking downfield.

Still, having said that, three games isn't exactly a large sample size and I'm okay with waiting a while longer till DVP is 100%, Preston is a bit more physically recovered (midseason?) and we get a really good slot threat established (Bowden, Calloway?). All this might come together in just a few weeks from now. So, unless 'FitzTragic' pops up before then, I'm okay with waiting a little while longer.

Just who do you imagine going downfield on this team? A gimpy Parker? Preston who can barely keep his feet? Grant who QB's can't even see, and who has never shown ability to corral a deep ball? Ford who doesn't have deep threat skills? Gesicki who doesn't really get open even on intermediate routes, he just has freakish hands and works well with Fitz'a ball placement?

BTW, it's actually silly to say Fitz doesn't go downfield. He lives on going downfield. But last night this team had no ability or need to go downfield. We won in a blowout with our QB throwing two incompletions.

 

[AMakados10]

Same bar for Tua as for Rosen. He needs to earn it.

Then again, Rosen didn't earn it and Flores put him in...

 

[Digital]

Well I get what you're saying and I agree is hard for NFL players to be 100% all the time. What I'm saying is if Tua is healthy enough for this staff to decide that he's one play away from getting in there then that means he's ready to go from a being healthy standpoint. He might not be game ready to start with no OTA's and no per season games so I can understand the logic of not playing him. I was not on the start Tua from week one group. But I'd like for him to start at least 8 games this year if possible. We all know that we're going nowhere with Fitz or with Tua for that matter this year but getting him out there in real games would help him a lot next year and beyond.

We're in agreement that we want him to get some time this year. I'm more interested in not having a Jake Long 2.0 scenario and destroying the player because he's not ready. I'm also not interested in duplicating what we did with Josh Rosen ... the guy who the entire board was pushing to start from day 1 of last year. I'd like Tua to start when he is physically ready (no Jake Long 2.0 scenario), and prepared to succeed (avoiding the Josh Rosen 2.0 scenario). Just a different take.

Teams don't get enough players to have a spot for guys who aren't ready but might become ready before the 6 week mark. Either they keep him on the roster or they don't. If they short term IR him, that may kill his motivation and definitely kills his chemistry with the receiving corps. I don't know how healthy he is or isn't. I don't know whether he'll be risking injury. All I know is that his arm is a noodle at the moment, and it wasn't at Alabama. That tells me he's not 100%. I'd love for him to play and have success, but if he's going to struggle, regress as a player and lose confidence, I'm not in favor of it. If he's going to get re-injured or slow his healing process, I'm not for it. I think he needs to play WHEN he's ready, not before.

We disagree that because he is listed as the #2 QB that necessarily means he's ready. I just think the coaching staff needs to wait until he is ready ... whenever that may be. If he misses the entire year, that would be unfortunate, but if we get a Patrick Mahomes type player in year 2, none of us would argue.

Not sure I can tell you why he's the #2. I think it's clear he's not fully recovered, but hey, if you disagree that's perfectly OK. That's part of the cordial discourse of this board. :)

 

[Danny]

We're in agreement that we want him to get some time this year. I'm more interested in not having a Jake Long 2.0 scenario and destroying the player because he's not ready. I'm also not interested in duplicating what we did with Josh Rosen ... the guy who the entire board was pushing to start from day 1 of last year. I'd like Tua to start when he is physically ready (no Jake Long 2.0 scenario), and prepared to succeed (avoiding the Josh Rosen 2.0 scenario). Just a different take.

Teams don't get enough players to have a spot for guys who aren't ready but might become ready before the 6 week mark. Either they keep him on the roster or they don't. If they short term IR him, that may kill his motivation and definitely kills his chemistry with the receiving corps. I don't know how healthy he is or isn't. I don't know whether he'll be risking injury. All I know is that his arm is a noodle at the moment, and it wasn't at Alabama. That tells me he's not 100%. I'd love for him to play and have success, but if he's going to struggle, regress as a player and lose confidence, I'm not in favor of it. If he's going to get re-injured or slow his healing process, I'm not for it. I think he needs to play WHEN he's ready, not before.

We disagree that because he is listed as the #2 QB that necessarily means he's ready. I just think the coaching staff needs to wait until he is ready ... whenever that may be. If he misses the entire year, that would be unfortunate, but if we get a Patrick Mahomes type player in year 2, none of us would argue.

Not sure I can tell you why he's the #2. I think it's clear he's not fully recovered, but hey, if you disagree that's perfectly OK. That's part of the cordial discourse of this board. :)

We might not agree on everything but we're closing the gap....lol

 

[LoneyROY7]

It’s funny because I keep reading about Fitz’s “dead arm” and I kind of chuckle. Ryan Fitzpatrick has never been a big armed QB and has looked like he’s putting everything into every pass for as long as I can remember. Point is sure he’s older and probably lost a little but from what I see it’s overblown. People act like he was Jeff George before and now what he is, that’s not the case.

I don’t even want to say this but somebody that was at camp said Fitz and Tua are on par with arm strength and obviously Rosen was better than both. Now to be clear I think you need an NFL arm but not a cannon, I’m not an it’s all about arm strength guy but if that’s true it may hurt some feelings around here. I also understand Tua’s biggest strengths are football instincts, ball placement and accuracy and not arm strength and think that is all more important. Just sick of hearing about Fitz’s “dead arm” when he never had a cannon to begin with.

Tua's arm strength on par with Fitzpatrick??



Here's a video of them throwing together before the Bills' game:




Yeah, it's not close. Tua changes the speeds on his throws a lot and it fools a lot of the casuals.

 

[Digital]

We might not agree on everything but we're closing the gap....lol

LOL, agreed! :D

 

[Digital]

Tua's arm strength on par with Fitzpatrick??



Here's a video of them throwing together before the Bills' game:




Yeah, it's not close. Tua changes the speeds on his throws a lot and it fools a lot of the casuals.

Thanks for that video. Honestly, it appears both are just going through the motions and neither of them is throwing at full strength. That's pretty normal for warmups, because the point is to warm up the throwing motion, not to unduly stress it. But, we know that it's not full speed at least for Fitz, because it's distinctly lower velocity than he was throwing in the game. I'm assuming that had Tua played, his velocity would have been better as well ... the only question is how much better? Not sure we know that answer yet.

 

[DolfanISS]

Thanks for that video. Honestly, it appears both are just going through the motions and neither of them is throwing at full strength. That's pretty normal for warmups, because the point is to warm up the throwing motion, not to unduly stress it. But, we know that it's not full speed at least for Fitz, because it's distinctly lower velocity than he was throwing in the game. I'm assuming that had Tua played, his velocity would have been better as well ... the only question is how much better? Not sure we know that answer yet.

Thanks! I don’t know myself just think I heard they were close form the 3 ypc guys. Bottom line is arm strength is overrated and Not something I care about anyway. As long as you have an NfL arm, and both do, that’s good enough. Like I said Tua has other strengths anyway that out weigh arm strength IMO.

 

[hoops]

Arm strength is overrated until you got penny’s arm against the Baltimore Ravens in the playoffs.

Then it’s exposed.

Clog the middle force him to throw outside the numbers and drive on those ducks.

We can’t even throw more than 35 air yards with the incumbent qb. All this waxing poetic about the jump balls yeah that’s because we can’t ever lead anyone over the shoulder vertical route concept on the damn boundary. We ain’t got the arm playing

 

[Geordie]

I think we are all impatient to see him take over, I wanted the switch to occur mid to late season or even red shirt the whole year if Fitz was performing before the season start, now with every game that ticks by I want him in there more, lol, it's hard to resist that temptation but in the long run the patience will pay dividends I suspect. I do think we missed a trick last night in not turning it over to him during garbage time, even just handing the ball off, would have been nice for the guy to get those jotters out of his system.

 

[39wildman]

Yes I agree w this because Fitzpatrick only going beat team w sorry qb that he is better than. I already watch fiz games. He is ok. Long term dolphins is screw if they dont play Tua now...Tua need games experience.. that jags games would been good one for him..

 

[Tailgun]

Just who do you imagine going downfield on this team? A gimpy Parker? Preston who can barely keep his feet? Grant who QB's can't even see, and who has never shown ability to corral a deep ball? Ford who doesn't have deep threat skills? Gesicki who doesn't really get open even on intermediate routes, he just has freakish hands and works well with Fitz'a ball placement?

BTW, it's actually silly to say Fitz doesn't go downfield. He lives on going downfield. But last night this team had no ability or need to go downfield. We won in a blowout with our QB throwing two incompletions.

Your reading comprehension is godawful.

 

[NBP81]

There's one thing no one seems to talk about and its the fact that in less than 2 months, Tua will not have seen a meaningful football snap for a full year. I get that you want to ease him in, but at the same time, you dont want him losing his edge.

Even NFL vets take some time to adjust after long absence from the game, not only will Tua need to adjust to live bullets football, he'll need to adjust going from college ball to NFL ball.

Im not saying I know what the anwser is, but its something to think about. One thing is for certain imo, if the Fins plan on having a rush heavy offensive plan like they did against the Jags, then I sure as hell would rather have Tua in there than Fitz.

 

[jazz015]

There's one thing no one seems to talk about and its the fact that in less than 2 months, Tua will not have seen a meaningful football snap for a full year. I get that you want to ease him in, but at the same time, you dont want him losing his edge.

Even NFL vets take some time to adjust after long absence from the game, not only will Tua need to adjust to live bullets football, he'll need to adjust going from college ball to NFL ball.

Im not saying I know what the anwser is, but its something to think about. One thing is for certain imo, if the Fins plan on having a rush heavy offensive plan like they did against the Jags, then I sure as hell would rather have Tua in there than Fitz.

I want a large sample size to determine if he is comfortable playing. He's a positive guy and all but in between the lines I need to see him get hit, get back up and play good football. I can't imagine practice is a good evaluator considering they don't get touched anyways. The quicker he gets hit during a game the quicker he can settles his nerves about it.

 

[fansinceGWilson]

There's one thing no one seems to talk about and its the fact that in less than 2 months, Tua will not have seen a meaningful football snap for a full year. I get that you want to ease him in, but at the same time, you dont want him losing his edge.

Even NFL vets take some time to adjust after long absence from the game, not only will Tua need to adjust to live bullets football, he'll need to adjust going from college ball to NFL ball.

Im not saying I know what the anwser is, but its something to think about. One thing is for certain imo, if the Fins plan on having a rush heavy offensive plan like they did against the Jags, then I sure as hell would rather have Tua in there than Fitz.

Yeah, that's one reason TT would get a series in Jax. Even a few snaps will help with the rust