Could you link that? I didn’t see it though, not being sassy, I earnestly want to see this commentary.
Flores not sure Xavien Howard will be at camp.
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ANUFan
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If you've learned anything about the Belicheat coaching tree it should be outside of the QB no player needs to be GREAT for there to be team success.
How many playoffs have we been in and won since the GREAT Howard have been a Miami Dolphins?
Hell how many times has he played the 2nd half of a season?
Feverdream
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I ask these questions because so far... none of the "we have to keep X" people have been willing to really put a number on 'how much'?No but to be fair none of us know the specifics. We are all speculating at this point and we all may be making this out to be a bigger thing than it is…or not
1M extra? 6M? All guaranteed years?
No one will really say what they would find appropriate. There seems to be a lot of 'to Hell with the consequences' going on here. Nor will any of them really confront the idea that the cap exists and that every dollar that X gets is less dollars left for everyone else, less dollars for FA help in future years, and a weakened stance against all of our future grasping players.
I sense that this is because some of them recognize all of this, but are so in love with keeping one player that they wish to ignore the rather substantial risks.
Let's hope, whichever way this situation gets resolved, it's in the best interest for both. Whether it be trading, Howard or fixing his contractual situation to stay in Miami. I think he's being undervalued by those who believe Miami won't get at least a 1st round pick for him. But that's just my opinion. Howard has a sixth sense regarding the ball in the air. You can't teach that.
No it's OK. Lol, I know people tend to read an article and assume it was the players saying it, not media speculation.
I hope I didn't just do that haha. I will look for it though
Ok I can't find it. What I remember reading was an article referencing he wasn't requesting a trade, however, if that's what happens he would be "fine" with that.
Since I can't find it right now, I will retract that part from my posts. Until I find it, I will assume I was reading speculation not a confirmed position.
Sorry for posting something I can't immediately find the material for referral
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Could literally turn this around to you - the guy who is loudest about X being a cancer, a liar, toxic, selfish…
Are you unwilling to give the player even an inch? If he’s asking for just $2mil more guaranteed in his next year, no additional new money, are you playing hardball and saying “absolutely not”?
If you say “no, of course I would try to do something within reason” then how much? What’s the number?
I certainly hope you stand by your stance of ZERO NEGOTIATION - even though I think it’s super foolish and amateur. Only because that’s the only way I can justify how much name calling and trashing you’ve done on the player up to this point.
I’d be willing to wager everyone actually involved in the situation wants to find a reasonable middle ground, both sides have treated as such by not saying ****.
it’s fans and media speculating left and right.
Many of us live this example every day. It doesn't make us happy but we deal with it and continue to do our jobs the best we can in hopes of our companies realizing our value down the line and either promoting us or doing a salary adjustment if we continue to exceed in our role.
That's what some on here are asking from X. He plays lights out and injury-free again and i have no doubts the team would redo something in his contract and move some money to guarantees. But he's had 2 seasons of injuries before his career year in 2020, as well as the domestic thing, so even if you don't agree with the current stance of some fans, you should be able to see where they are coming from.
Feverdream
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Actually... I've put forward what I'd be comfortable with.
Guarantee his salary in 2022. No raise, but one more year of guarantee.
There have been many posts, so you may have missed that.
So the old “we can lose just as many games without him” argument that’s kept us adrift in mediocrity for too long. He’s led the league in picks 2 of the last 3 seasons. If he was going to miss significant time (which was only once) 2019 was the season to do it. And following Beliccheat, besides Brady, the other position his SB teams ALWAYS had was an ELITE CB. In fact, if he lost one to FA, the first thing he would do is roll out the red carpet for the next all world guy. See Ty Law, Asante Samuel, Darrell Revis, Aquib Talib, Brandon Browner, Stephon Gilmore - and I may be missing a guy or two whether drafted or acquired. That player has been the “Tom Brady” of their defense allowing them to do creative things (like we do because of X and Jones - and oh by the way the last time we could do such things was when we had Surtain and Madison) that have enabled them to have an excellent defense throughout the supreme chancellor’s rein. In fact, I submit that BB would never allow his team to be WITHOUT an elite CB because he knows it ****s up everything they want to do on D. Look at their no 1 CB over the last 21 years.
PS - also, cmon ANU - you are a smart / knowledgeable fan of the game. You know the reason we haven’t won a playoff game since 2001 is because we haven’t had QB play. Tua is going to give us a chance.
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My issue w trading him is what Feverdream points out - that do to his salary, we won’t get a fair return for his on field play.
For me, he’s just too good - HOF trajectory is not out of the question - to trade as we enter a window where we can compete for a championship.
Fair enough. Do we know how much more he wants? What if it’s about guaranteed money vs non? Or what if he’s ok getting a huge bonus if he leads the league in picks again? Or whatever- I think he signed a 5-$75 contract, correct? I’d pay him $18 mil a year vs $15 mil in a heartbeat. Cap going up. Also, we don’t have to pay our QB for awhile. If Flores is molding his D in the NE style, the one position you pay is that no 1 CB. They’ve been doing it for 20 years w Ty Law, Darrell Revis, Aquib Talib, Asante Samuel, Stephon Gilmour. That position is the absolute key to their defensive success. And it was for ours last year as well.
People keep saying “2 seasons of injuries” - one of those “injured” seasons he played 12 games and led the league in INTs w 7. I’ll take that every year. What if the 3-4 games being dinged up happen at the beginning or middle of the season? What if he’s 100% and injury is no more of a concern than it is for any other player?
Feverdream
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Well... the new money that he has coming is currently 12M in 21, 13M in 22, 12M in 23, and 12M in 24, so you are suggesting a rather large increase. 18M? An extra 6M per year? Are you going to guarantee more years as well?
This is a SUBSTANTIAL increase, certainly not the 'why could give him a couple million more' or the 'He just wants more guaranteed years' that we've heard out of the X defenders... and that's one of the things I've been trying to explain here... this is likely not a 'minor' fix, he's likely looking for another huge bunch of money. I don't blame him for asking for it... but by holding out, he's trashed any good will that he'd accumulated. To me, if he'd been looking for a minor fix, then likely... he wouldn't have held out. I suspect... just suspect that he's looking for a LOT more money and wants to reset the market again.
If we do that, we need to have our heads examined.
12 games or not, he didn't finish back to back seasons. You can paint it however you want but he didn't make it through those seasons.....both of which ended prematurely with knee surgeries. First it was a meniscus, then total reconstruction. That's not "dinged" like soft tissue injuries, tweaked hammy, ankle sprain, etc. That's surgery both times on a knee at a speed position. During that period, he played 53% of the games.
If he's fully healthy now, great! We don't know that as fans. Only he and the doctors do. They would know about any arthritic condition or degeneration. We can only speculate. But if he puts in back to back 16 game seasons (or close to it) without any missed time for issues with the knee, then health questions could be minimized.
I'm not going to look 4 it, but I think the story was his agent might have "leaked" words to that effect.