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For GoonBoss... Last Year's WR Debate

SF Dolfan

SF Dolfan

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Well, if you really want to read em, here some favs. Had to move it from the Joey thread.... Poor Joey :(

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy James
I think it's time for the gloves to come off here.

Both Boston and Booker have been Pro Bowlers. Chambers has not.

Both Boston and Booker have been over the magic 1000 yard mark. Chambers has not.

I really don't buy that Boston is ever going to be anything other than a shadow of his former self, but if he does return to that form, why on Earth wouldn't he be #1 with Booker as #2 and Chambers headed out to the slot?

If it is no insult to Booker to suggest something like that, it certainly shouldn't be an insult to Chambers to put it that way, right?


I really wish I could agree, cuz it would mean we had 3 probowl caliber receivers on the roster. Alas, I just don't buy it.

Boston: In his prime, he was incredible. Better than Booker or Chambers could be. Unfortunately, he isn't playing at that level now. I wouldn't argue his potential because he may still have the tools, but he doesn't run the same now as he did in AZ. Whether its his leg trouble (certainly a factor) or that he's carrying too much weight in his upper body, he seems to labor out there. In AZ he was smooth. And big, and scarily fast. I hope for great things and expect him to contribute at minimum as a very good #3.

Booker: He had some great years in Chicago. Was an awesome possesion guy and a good runner after the catch. He has never returned to form since his injuries w/ the Bears. He must be completely healthy, its been several years, and is a very solid player, but not a superstar.

Chambers: Has never put up the career years of the other 2, but has easily been the best of the bunch for the last 3 seasons. Chambers is also still coming on. He's been very good (albeit not great) is a terrible offense with a terrible QB. His routes can improve, but his athleticsm is top notch and he's a playmaker. He doesn't drop passes and he makes spectacular plays regularly. If he wasn't such a talent, his numbers could have been really ugly. He's hands down our #1.

from:
http://www.finheaven.com/boardvb2/showthread.php?t=89554

it continues here and in other threads
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DBoston80
...Well atleast you guy's are showing your "true" color's...:shakeno: ..how many of you "doubter's" and "hater's"..were a little bit pleased to see he sat out ONE PRACTICE because of a sore knee?? How many couldnt wait to come on here with your "I told you so" remarks?? How many were embaressed and ashamed of there negative comments on Boston from before he was resigned until he was promoted to #3???

Way to make something out of nothing just to save face on the stupid comments many made prior to this....he's sitting out ONE practice?? No one's saying stuff about Seau who hasnt practiced hardly at all?? Now IF it's reported he may miss a week or a game because of this then start your ridiculous post's....but for one practice??? Get a life!! Stop being too critical of one guy for such a petty thing..it's a precautionary decision and a smart one....take it for what it IS and not for what you HOPE it is.:shakeno:


Clearly you're a big Boston. And I've been pulling for him to start opposite Chambers. But you need to remember, the man IS recovering from an injury. I was very excited to see him perform well in the preseason games, but I also noticed that he doesn't run nearly as smoothly as in his AZ days. I'm hoping that eventually, he can regain his old form, but realisticly he may or he may not. It would be foolish to expect him to a number one receiver at this point and unfair to place that burden on him. But if we limit his practice reps, which has been happening even before he got the day off, we can hopefully keep him healthy and getting stronger as the season moves along. I expect him to contribute early and play more and more of a role as the season goes on. Noone is hoping for him to fail, it's just being realistic with expectations and being worried when he suffers a setback, even a very minor one.

Also, it shouldn't have suprised anyone that Boston moved to #3. DT can't hold his jock. Neither could Booker if Boston can get back to peak form. I think we just need to be patient with him and it seems like Saban is doing exactly that. Smart move!

from:

http://www.finheaven.com/boardvb2/showthread.php?t=91208
 
here are some other winners...

Quote:
Originally Posted by shouright
All he had to do on the reverse was follow the cadre of blockers he had in front of him. Sure the play was great, but Wes Welker could've done the same thing at 5 million dollars less per year. Chambers's NUMBER ONE job is to haul in the longball in traffic. He doesn't do that too well.


I could just as easily say that all Booker had to do on his long TD was run past a cb with leg cramps when Denver was in the wrong coverage. Chambers made a great play, period.

I'm so tired of people bashing him. MArty had some good seasons in chicago, but his last few have not been up to par. I hope he regains his form, but Chambers has easily outplayed him the last 2 seasons. He's easily outplayed Boston the last 2 years as well.

I hope CC, Marty, and Boston all play at their top form. That way teams won't be able to lock coverage onto any of them.

Against Denver, CHris opened things up for Marty by running almost all of the long routes early in the game. We took our shots, didn't connect, but it kept the D honest. CHambers also should've had a td on that great dive in the endzone. HAd his man beat but the pass was off.

CHris is a very good player. I'm glad we locked him up w/ a long deal. He's far more of a sure thing as our go-to guy than anyone else on our roster, whether he is "great" or not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by normaldude
Marty Booker: Pro Bowler. Has gone over 1000 yds (twice).

David Boston: Pro Bowler. Has gone over 1000 yds (twice).

Chris Chambers: Never made it to the Pro Bowl. Never gone over 1000 yds, ever.

Every year, people say "this is going to be Chris Chambers' breakout year". Never seems to happen.


Last 2 seasons

Chambers- 1881 yds 18 tds
Booker- 1353 yds 5 tds
Boston- I won't even bother cuz he didn't play 04, had 800 and 7 in 03 and only played 8 games in 02. He was great, but what he gives us this year is bonus. We can't count on it.

To me what seperates the elite receivers is td catches. If you look at end of seasom stats, tons of guys every year have 600-900 receiving yards. Far less get in the neighborhood of 10 recieving tds. To me that is where Chambers is a difference maker.

I hope they both play great and I could really care less about who ends up with better numbers if we win. People need to give CHris some credit though. He's done a hell of alot more for THIS team than Booker or Boston. They may still, but it hasn't happened yet. Hopefully week 1 is a sign of good things to come.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy James
:rolleyes2

Marty had a high ankle sprain in 2003 that was along the lines of the one that Owens had in 1999. It's a terrible injury for receivers to have because it just screws up around 2/3 of the season. Marty came back at the end of that year and was his former self.

As to 2004, I don't know what the hell you people expect from Marty. The team had nobody to teach him the damned offense. For a new guy who had to just catch on to whatever he could glean from our JOKE of an OC who didn't even know the offense himself, he did pretty damned well.

It isn't about Marty regaining his form, as though he lost it somehow. :shakeno:


Well, aren't injuries a fact of life in the NFL? If you're hurt than you can't perform at a high level and do have to regain your form. If injuries didn't matter than Boston is hands down the best of the 3. But guess what, injurues do matter. And some guys never come back to be the same player. If MArty gets 1000 yards this year than I certainly would describe it as regaining his form.

And I hate to break it to you, but Chambers played in the same offense with the same awful coordinator in 2004. Randy Moss is playing in a new system this year and he looked pretty good last week. If you're that good you'll do well, even in a new offense. The system that held MArty back did the same for Chris. No one taught him the offense? I could have taught it to him in 5 minutes-- RUn, Run, Try to beat nickel and dime coverage, then punt.

All signs point to Marty doing well this year. I hope he does, and I think he'll have good numbers. What tells me he isn't a #1 WR is the way defenses single cover him and almost always have safety help on Chris. When that changes, then Booker's numbers will start to drop and CC's will uptick. They benefity from each other.
Prediction: Booker #1
http://www.finheaven.com/boardvb2/showthread.php?t=97509

this one is only semi related...
http://www.finheaven.com/boardvb2/showthread.php?t=95732
 
Hey, I was all over Chambers last year to no end...

I'm still not convinced personally. The guy had a good half year but still dropped too many passes.

If he plays ALL year llike he did for the last half of last year I'll call him elite...until then he is in the second teir.
 
unifiedtheory said:
Hey, I was all over Chambers last year to no end...

I'm still not convinced personally. The guy had a good half year but still dropped too many passes.

If he plays ALL year llike he did for the last half of last year I'll call him elite...until then he is in the second teir.
Click to expand...

Well said.

I concur.

That makes us "haters" acording to the homers.

Prove it this year.........I think he will but, I hear the excuses coming. Mark my words!

1- Well, new OC, new QB.....How can he adjust?
2- The way Daute thows the ball is so different, of course he'll drop some!
3- Dante's coming off injury! Give him a break!
4- (Provided Harrington sees the field.)- It's Harrington! It's Joey's fault!

I'm like...Psycic...Trust me.
 
Oh cmon now, I'm gonna get fired up again! LOL. Has Chambers ever really had a bad year? He may not be top 5 in the league, but he's at least close to top 10 or top 15 and certainly the best we've got. Not all #1 recievers can be Marvin Harrison or TO or Moss. He's a very good player and seemingly a very good guy, certianly not a TO-like headache at any rate. I would comfortably say he'd be the number 1 option on more than half of the teams in the NFL. We could certainly do worse for a #1 WR.

He did drop too many passes last year, especially early on, but he really came on in the second half. And he made plays despite getting lots of attention in coverage. I think its a matter of us all seeing that he has great ability and wanting him to be the very best at his position or close to it. That may or may not be realistic.

To be honest, Chambers is the offensive player I have the most confidence in on our current roster. I worry about Daunte's knee, if Ronnie will carry the load as well as I think he can, will McMike be consitent, will any of our linemen really excel, does Beasley have any gas left, etc, etc... He's the one guy that I feel like we can be pretty sure of what we're gonna get. Could he be better, elite even? Perhaps. Will he be very good as he has been-- Yeah, I'm pretty sure. He's pretty solid year in and year out.
 
SF Dolfan said:
Oh cmon now, I'm gonna get fired up again! LOL. Has Chambers ever really had a bad year? He may not be top 5 in the league, but he's at least close to top 10 or top 15 and certainly the best we've got. Not all #1 recievers can be Marvin Harrison or TO or Moss. He's a very good player and seemingly a very good guy, certianly not a TO-like headache at any rate. I would comfortably say he'd be the number 1 option on more than half of the teams in the NFL. We could certainly do worse for a #1 WR.

He did drop too many passes last year, especially early on, but he really came on in the second half. And he made plays despite getting lots of attention in coverage. I think its a matter of us all seeing that he has great ability and wanting him to be the very best at his position or close to it. That may or may not be realistic.

To be honest, Chambers is the offensive player I have the most confidence in on our current roster. I worry about Daunte's knee, if Ronnie will carry the load as well as I think he can, will McMike be consitent, will any of our linemen really excel, does Beasley have any gas left, etc, etc... He's the one guy that I feel like we can be pretty sure of what we're gonna get. Could he be better, elite even? Perhaps. Will he be very good as he has been-- Yeah, I'm pretty sure. He's pretty solid year in and year out.
Click to expand...

I'm not going to get into it.

Put up or shut up, as far as CC goes.

Prove the last half.

All I ask.
 
All my post did was ripp the many "Boston haters" who couldnt wait until something bad happened to him...

I have defend Boston to the extent that IF he is/was ever 100% again he would be a force..we never found out if I was right.....


..by the way U can go back on ANY one on this board with as many posts as me, and ecspecially JimmyJames...and find alot of posts like that and say "I told you so"

..but hey kep diggin'm up if it makes u feel better.
 
DBoston80 said:
All my post did was ripp the many "Boston haters" who couldnt wait until something bad happened to him...

I have defend Boston to the extent that IF he is/was ever 100% again he would be a force..we never found out if I was right.....


..by the way U can go back on ANY one on this board with as many posts as me, and ecspecially JimmyJames...and find alot of posts like that and say "I told you so"

..but hey kep diggin'm up if it makes u feel better.
Click to expand...

Sorry man, wasn't meant to knock you. I only referenced it because it was the same kind of circular debate going on about Harrington right now. Goon asked me to look it up so I did. Half of the stuff any of us say doesn't pan out. And sometimes it does. It's the sake of dialogue, not always being right. I don't doubt for a minute that Boston was a force. It's a shame about the injuries. He had freakish talent and I think any of us would have loved to see him return to form.
 
He was right in a sense... Cham,bers didn't really start to cook until we started playing him more into the slot position...
 
The only thing I am going to say is that in my previous postings (although not many) I expressed my opinions about 2 individuals I didnt want playing for the Dolphins. These 2 were Harrington and Vick. I HOPE someone comes back a year or 2 later and re-posts my whinings proving I was wrong. I honestly do wish (secretly) that they will benefit the team in someway.

Who says I am not a team player?!?:boohoo:
 
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