Ginn Trade: Addition by Subtraction at KR | Page 8 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Ginn Trade: Addition by Subtraction at KR

Where are you getting your cap numbers from?

They are correct. I do a cap page elsewhere.
I posted a current salary page in this forum a couple weeks ago and I can't find it.
title was 2010 Miami Dolphins spending (atogwe?)
 
They are correct. I do a cap page elsewhere.
I posted a current salary page in this forum a couple weeks ago and I can't find it.
title was 2010 Miami Dolphins spending (atogwe?)

You can go to your profile and reference "Find all posts" to the left of the screen.
 
thx alot
somehow the thread title changed lol!!!
here are my numbers going into the season with a few additions

http://www.finheaven.com/forums/showthread.php?277676-ESPN-Insiders-Dolphins-and-Atogwe

this is MY work, not ESPN
it is the only current chart anywhere
Miami Dolphins spending chart 2010 (Atogwe tonight?) was the title

So basicly then, we're supposed to simply take your word for it.

Jason Allen's contract seems to be pretty similar to Ginn's, and he's contributed far less than Ginn. It doesn't appear Allen is ever going to either. Why keep a scrub DB and trade a WR that at least has contributed something to the team because of salary reasons. I think your reasoning is flawed.

Now if you are saying all he's worth is a returner? Ok. That I'll grant you might be a salary concern.
 
So basicly then, we're supposed to simply take your word for it.

Jason Allen's contract seems to be pretty similar to Ginn's, and he's contributed far less than Ginn. It doesn't appear Allen is ever going to either. Why keep a scrub DB and trade a WR that at least has contributed something to the team because of salary reasons. I think your reasoning is flawed.

Now if you are saying all he's worth is a returner? Ok. That I'll grant you might be a salary concern.

All I know is that we got the wrong end of the deal when we traded Ginn for a 5th. Thats utter BS that Ginn played the X spot, the same spot Marshall plays. We can move Ginn to the Z spot and keep him as a returner. He made no money and to trade it for a 5th is absurd. Lets all hope Nolan Carrol pans out.
 
Jason Allen's contract seems to be pretty similar to Ginn's, and he's contributed far less than Ginn. It doesn't appear Allen is ever going to either. Why keep a scrub DB and trade a WR that at least has contributed something to the team because of salary reasons. I think your reasoning is flawed.
Now if you are saying all he's worth is a returner? Ok. That I'll grant you might be a salary concern.

My reasoning is not flawed. Ted Ginn has a much larger carryover bonus.
I am also not sure Jason Allen does make the team this season.
If he does though, the future cap (as well as dead cap hits) are much less.

2009 salary bonus total salary cap hit
Ted Ginn $ 677,917 $ 0 $ 50,000 $ 727,917 $ 2,694,323 WR

Ted Ginn $1,966,406 remaining per year bonus paid x 3 years= $5,899,218 dead cap Ginn (if salary cap this year)

Jason Allen, on the other hand, only has $920,000 remaining per year bonus paid x 2 years= would be $1,840,000 dead cap (if salary cap this year)
2010: $1,270,000 salary + $920,000= $2,190,000 would be cap# this year (without incentives)
2011: $980,000 salary + $920,000=$1,900,00 Cap # next season or $920,000 dead cap hit next season if cut, traded next season.

Take next 2 seasons
1. 2011 Ted Ginn- salary $1.4 million, cap hit total $3.4 million
2011 if we cut or trade him dead cap hit of $4 million

2. 2012 Ted Ginn- salary $1.8 million, cap hit total $3.8 million
2012 if we cut or trade him dead cap hit of $2 million

3. 2011 Jason Allen- salary $1 million, cap hit total $1.9 million
2011 if we cut or trade him dead cap hit of $920,000

4. 2012 Jason Allen- free agent

These numbers tell me Ginn would probably be here through 2011 and Jason Allen could either go or stay at a small cost.
IMO there are HUGE differences with future contracts and cap hits between Allen and Ginn.
 
So basicly then, we're supposed to simply take your word for it.

No, definitely not, but like I said there is no one source right now with finalized numbers.
You are welcome to dig online and come to your own conclusion. I have been doing salary (and cap #s) for along time.
It is something I really get into as it is a HUGE part of the NFL game.
 
Where are you getting your cap numbers from?

Ok sorry I should have linked some pages, but i had my sheet right in front of me already done.
Here are some links:

Ted Ginn contract
http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_contract.aspx?sport=NFL&id=4168

Here are all players 2009 salaries, bonuses and cap values
http://content.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/salaries/teamdetail.aspx?team=17&year=2009
(actually Jason Allen and Will Allen numbers are switched here, I have already emailed USA TODAY editor to notify him of this)

Here are Armando's Herald numbers last year:
http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolphins_in_depth/2009/12/player----cap-value--jason-allen--2280000--will-allen---5631240--charlie-anderson-2583333.html

You can look through the previous years contracts to figure out all the bonuses and future cap hits associated with each player. You have to do a little math, but it isn't too difficult to figure out.
A few players have complex contracts, then you just have to research deeper or know the right person to ask to figure out their totals. I myself do my own sheets annually, and they are, for the most part, accurate. Some stuff (ex. perf & incentive bonus) you can't figure out until season ends.

My numbers have also been verified matching other sources that cap as well (that is pretty much the best check that can be done this early in the season).
 
Here's the point.... Ginnger wasn't worth $6/hour in pads... she was traded for what amounts to a few stale issues of bathroom reading material because she sucks....

Bill Parcells didn't enjoy having this soft as drug-store cotton, waste of a perfectly good football jersey on his roster... they were lucky to recoup ANYTHING of value for her...

...make all of this perfectly clear to her the next time you run into her.... and if she has a problem with it... tell her she can take it up with Ireland's 9 year old niece...
 
Here's the point.... Ginnger wasn't worth $6/hour in pads... she was traded for what amounts to a few stale issues of bathroom reading material because she sucks....

Bill Parcells didn't enjoy having this soft as drug-store cotton, waste of a perfectly good football jersey on his roster... they were lucky to recoup ANYTHING of value for her...

...make all of this perfectly clear to her the next time you run into her.... and if she has a problem with it... tell her she can take it up with Ireland's 9 year old niece...

I'll tell him he has a fan.
 
Ginn was a bad WR.. A average-above average KR..

At some point, everyone has to take into account how bad our blocking truly was.Cobbs didn't do that good on KR either. Neither did Hartline when he got a chance. Everytime time we got a punt I could have sworn Bess was going to get drilled. Our PR was just as bad last year. As a group on special teams we need to improve

Everybody needs to shutup about Ginn already.. Hes gone..Now we need to figure out a way to improve special teams as a whole.

If you guys want to use football quotes.. What about last season is last season it only matters what we do this season.
 
So why do you start threads about players who are worse than Ginn wanted them to come to Miami? If you dont care about players on different teams that is..

Never thought you'd admit a player was worse than Ginn haha- we are making progress now, baby steps. I don't follow former Dolphins much, if there is a player on another team that I have heard rumors about becoming a Dolphin I might throw the name out there but if you'd notice I don't even do that all that often. I like to focus on the guys we have.
 
Why do you find it weird? He's the most recent departure, and failure from the team. Think if it like ex girlfreinds; The one you broke up with two weeks ago is still going to be on your mind, for better or worse, far more than the one you broke up with last year.

Make sense now?

Actually that'd be Reggie Torber. I just think it's really odd that people are stilling talking about him (Ginn) so much, and even going as far as to read other team's blogs (a team in the NFC West for that matter) just to see how he's doing. I don't follow guys like Joey Harrington after they left our team because I don't really care what they do for someone else. I'd rather just focus on the guys we have on our roster and anyone that may be linked to us via free agency or possible trade. Pretty simple I think. I think people just need to move on and stop making these speculative threads about Ginn using bad statistical analysis. We will never know what he would have done in the future for us, and to debate it is pretty silly. Go Phins.
 
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