Greenberg says Manning to SEA, Edwards says MIA

[nyjunc]

lol... The Jets were in that race last season too. The Jets were 2 worthless games better than both the Phins and Bills. Something to brag about?

Don't worry, the Jets will finish last in 2012.

No they weren't, even w/ 3 straight losses to end the season we still fnished 2 games ahead of both Miami and Buffalo.

I thought you were talking about head to head. Isnt that more of a barometer whos the better team?

If it is then the Jets are historically the better team since we have the head to head edge.

its a lost cause you will never win with him, its the same thing every time, AFC title games, its literally included in 99% of his posts

We should ignore them right and focus on a meaningless week 17 game in 2011, that tells us everything!

 

[sm0kinfins]

The same amount as the dolphins, why do you ask?

I ask because of your smart ass comment. I woulda thought that woulda been obvious. Of Course, it's obvious that Snacheeze is a limp wristed pillow biting back up QB and you can't see that either soooo....

 

[nyjunc]

I ask because of your smart ass comment. I woulda thought that woulda been obvious. Of Course, it's obvious that Snacheeze is a limp wristed pillow biting back up QB and you can't see that either soooo....

it sounds like someone is trying to knock down a closet door.

 

[The New Guy]

I didn't say we didn't lose, we didn't have a consistent pattern of getting blown out in certain games. We lost 5 of 6, we had chances to win all but 1.

The Cardinals did get blown out in 3 games, but they always bounced back the next game and never lost more than 2 in a row. The 09 Jets lost to the Saints by 14 and NE by 17 in the midst of losing 6 out of 7. Those 2 losses are not as bad as the Cardinals 3 EC trips, but they are still big losses and when you add in losing 6 out of 7, the 09 Jets had a worse regular season than the 08 Cardinals.

They played the 9-7 Jets not the 11-5 dolphins, they beat up the dolphins at home. They were awful coming east which is the point. That is not a win to crow over, Philly crushed them at home in the reg season then lost at Ari in the title game.

I'm not sure why I put the Dolphins in that list. I meant the Jets. A win against the Cardinals in 08 isn't a win to crow about, but it is just as good (if not better) as a win against the 09 Jets. Neither were very good regular season teams.

The D did hold Oak down but it was a blizzard that hurt both offenses. How does he not get creit for putting them in FG range to tie and win? Obivously AV gets huge credit as well- he made an incredible kick to tie it but Brady put him in position.

Did the Giants D blow a 14 pt 4th qtr lead? Did Eli lead a drive w/ just over a min left, NO timeouts inside their 20? I give Eli plenty of credit, I just don't give him all the credit like some on here do.

I guess you could refer to the Pats 01 D performance as blowing a 14 point 4th quarter lead, but I would call Brady's O out for only putting up 3 more points than what the D had at that point. The Rams were averaging 37 PPG in the playoffs and the D held them to 17 the whole game and put up 7 points for the O. It only took 13 points from the O to beat the Rams. The question isn't about who gets credit. I already said Brady deserves credit for putting them in range. The question is, who deserves more credit? Putting a kicker in a situation where he has to make a 45 yard FG in those conditions, is not great. Vinatieri made a kick that most kickers would not have been able to make. A 7 and 13 yard pass is all it took from Brady to get them in that range. He also fumbled on that drive, but got bailed out by the tuck rule. He put up 0 points in the AFCC game while the D and ST scored 14 points (while holding the Steelers to 17)

The D and special teams are the main reason why the Pats won the Super Bowl that year.

We We played Ari who was awufl on the EC, 8-8 SD(who destroyed us) and Miami who was a decent team and nothing more. In 2002 we faced a Miami type team in Cleveland, the AFC Champs in Oakland and 12-3 GB playing for homefield in week 17.

So, in 08 they faced 3 playoff bound teams. 1 team made the NFCC game, the other made it to the divisional round and the 3rd got blown out in the WC round.

In 02, they faced 3 playoff bound teams as well. 1 team made it to the AFCC game, the other got beat in the WC round, and the 3rd got blown out in the WC round.

The 08 teams advanced further than the 02 teams. :up:

Whether we agree or not(we rarely do) I appreciate you always coming after my arguments. People too often forget this stuff is fun.

That what the forum is supposed to be about to me. It is all in fun. We would agree more if you were right more often.

 

[nyjunc]

The Cardinals did get blown out in 3 games, but they always bounced back the next game and never lost more than 2 in a row. The 09 Jets lost to the Saints by 14 and NE by 17 in the midst of losing 6 out of 7. Those 2 losses are not as bad as the Cardinals 3 EC trips, but they are still big losses and when you add in losing 6 out of 7, the 09 Jets had a worse regular season than the 08 Cardinals.



I'm not sure why I put the Dolphins in that list. I meant the Jets. A win against the Cardinals in 08 isn't a win to crow about, but it is just as good (if not better) as a win against the 09 Jets. Neither were very good regular season teams.



I guess you could refer to the Pats 01 D performance as blowing a 14 point 4th quarter lead, but I would call Brady's O out for only putting up 3 more points than what the D had at that point. The Rams were averaging 37 PPG in the playoffs and the D held them to 17 the whole game and put up 7 points for the O. It only took 13 points from the O to beat the Rams. The question isn't about who gets credit. I already said Brady deserves credit for putting them in range. The question is, who deserves more credit? Putting a kicker in a situation where he has to make a 45 yard FG in those conditions, is not great. Vinatieri made a kick that most kickers would not have been able to make. A 7 and 13 yard pass is all it took from Brady to get them in that range. He also fumbled on that drive, but got bailed out by the tuck rule. He put up 0 points in the AFCC game while the D and ST scored 14 points (while holding the Steelers to 17)

The D and special teams are the main reason why the Pats won the Super Bowl that year.



So, in 08 they faced 3 playoff bound teams. 1 team made the NFCC game, the other made it to the divisional round and the 3rd got blown out in the WC round.

In 02, they faced 3 playoff bound teams as well. 1 team made it to the AFCC game, the other got beat in the WC round, and the 3rd got blown out in the WC round.

The 08 teams advanced further than the 02 teams. :up:



That what the forum is supposed to be about to me. It is all in fun. We would agree more if you were right more often.

The Crads also play in the NFC West and had an easy sched in 2008.

After we humiliated them they faced Buffalo at home
After Philly humiliated them they faced SL at home
After NE humiliated them they faced Seattle at home

Those are nice cushions to land on.

We lost 6 of 7 in '09 where we were outscored by 45 pts in those 6 losses, Ari lost by an average of 30 in those 3 blowout losses. The Cards beat ONE playoff bound team, at home against the Dolphins.

The Jets were competitive in pretty much every game in 2009, you cannot say the same of the 2008 Cards.

2009 avg. margin of defeat: 6.9 PPG
2009 Jets avg. margin of victory: 17.8 PPG

2008 Cards avg. margin of defeat: 18.4 PPG
2008 Cards avg. margin of victory: 14.4 PPG


I could refer to it as blowing a 14 pt 4th qtr lead b/c that is exactly what they did.

The Rams were "averaging" 37 PPg b/c of the blowout thanks to Brett Favre and his 6 INTs. SL had 3 INT returns against GB so the O actually averaged 27 PPG so they weren't too far off their playoff average.

From your own 17 w/ NO timeputs w/ just over a minute to play leading a FG to win the SB is one of the greatest drives in SB history. Plenty of folks and units deserve credit for that but the QB led that drive staying cool under the most intense pressure maybe in SB history.

a 45 yarder in a dome on turf is tough conditions? The pressure was tough but the kick itself was almost a chip shot.


a 9-7 team reached the SB in the NFC, an 8-8 team the div rd in the AFC. The postseason teams in 2002 were better and Oak made the SB not just the AFC Championship Game.



:up:

 

[sm0kinfins]

it sounds like someone is trying to knock down a closet door.

Riiiight... Cause everyone who can spot one, must be one themselves.

This isn't exactly a "he who smelt it, dealt it" scenario. Try again... Try harder.

 

[The New Guy]

The Crads also play in the NFC West and had an easy sched in 2008.

After we humiliated them they faced Buffalo at home
After Philly humiliated them they faced SL at home
After NE humiliated them they faced Seattle at home

Those are nice cushions to land on.

Those were bad teams, but they won all of those games by a wide margin. The Jets were facing bad teams as well, but they were losing to teams like 7-9 Mia, 6-10 Buff, and 7-9 Jax. Philly was the worst team (record wise) the Cardinals lost to and they made it to the NFCC game.

We lost 6 of 7 in '09 where we were outscored by 45 pts in those 6 losses, Ari lost by an average of 30 in those 3 blowout losses. The Cards beat ONE playoff bound team, at home against the Dolphins.

The Cards got blown out 3 times, the Jets got blown out 2 times. Who cares if they got beat by 20 or 40? Bad losses are bad losses. The difference is the Cards bounced back every time they got blown out while the Jets were still losing to bad teams. Both had poor regular seasons, but I stand by the Cards having the better of the 2.

I could refer to it as blowing a 14 pt 4th qtr lead b/c that is exactly what they did.
The Rams were "averaging" 37 PPg b/c of the blowout thanks to Brett Favre and his 6 INTs. SL had 3 INT returns against GB so the O actually averaged 27 PPG so they weren't too far off their playoff average.

The point is, the Rams were a high powered offense. They averaged around 31 PPG during the regular season. Even when you take away the defensive scores against GB, 27 PPG in the playoffs is still very good.
The Pats D not only held them to 10 points less than they were averaging on offense, the D scored 7 points. Because of the Pats D, the O only needed to score 13 points to beat a team that was averaging 27 in the playoffs. You can call that blowing a 4th quarter lead, but reality is that the O wasn't carring its own weight. That is why they had to get in FG range for the game winner at the end of the game. Do you really think it is reasonable to expect the Pats D to hold that O to only 3 points the whole game. That was the amount they had scored when the Pats were leading by 14 points in the 4th. 17-3, and the O had only scored 10 points themselves.

From your own 17 w/ NO timeputs w/ just over a minute to play leading a FG to win the SB is one of the greatest drives in SB history. Plenty of folks and units deserve credit for that but the QB led that drive staying cool under the most intense pressure maybe in SB history.

If not for the D holding the Rams to 17 points (and scoring 7 on top of that) that drive means nothing. There was no way that team was going to keep up with the Rams in scoring.

a 45 yarder in a dome on turf is tough conditions? The pressure was tough but the kick itself was almost a chip shot.

I was talking about the 45 yarder against Oak to tie it. Brady gets all the credit, but he didn't do much on that drive. (A 7 and 13 yard pass from Brady) Putting a kicker in that situation in those conditions is not ideal. The kicker deserves more credit for making that kick than the QB who completed 2 passes for 7 and 13 yards and scrambled for 5 yards.

a 9-7 team reached the SB in the NFC, an 8-8 team the div rd in the AFC. The postseason teams in 2002 were better and Oak made the SB not just the AFC Championship Game.

3 playoff teams in 2008:

Cardinals 9-7 (made the Super Bowl)
Chargers 8-8 (lost by 11 in the divisional round)
Dolphins 11-5(Lost by 18 in the WC round)

3 playoff teams in 2002:

Raiders 11-5 (Made it to the Super Bowl) Equal to 2008 playoff team
Cleveland 9-7 (lost in the WC round) Didn't make it as far as the Chargers in 08.
Green Bay 12-4 (Lost by 20 in the WC round) Lost by 2 more points than the Dolphins did in 08

In 2002 the #1 seed in the AFC was 11-5. 6 teams were 11-5 and better in 08. I'm not sure how you can say the playoff teams were better in 02. Everything points to the 08 teams being stronger.

 

[nyjunc]

Those were bad teams, but they won all of those games by a wide margin. The Jets were facing bad teams as well, but they were losing to teams like 7-9 Mia, 6-10 Buff, and 7-9 Jax. Philly was the worst team (record wise) the Cardinals lost to and they made it to the NFCC game.



The Cards got blown out 3 times, the Jets got blown out 2 times. Who cares if they got beat by 20 or 40? Bad losses are bad losses. The difference is the Cards bounced back every time they got blown out while the Jets were still losing to bad teams. Both had poor regular seasons, but I stand by the Cards having the better of the 2.



The point is, the Rams were a high powered offense. They averaged around 31 PPG during the regular season. Even when you take away the defensive scores against GB, 27 PPG in the playoffs is still very good.
The Pats D not only held them to 10 points less than they were averaging on offense, the D scored 7 points. Because of the Pats D, the O only needed to score 13 points to beat a team that was averaging 27 in the playoffs. You can call that blowing a 4th quarter lead, but reality is that the O wasn't carring its own weight. That is why they had to get in FG range for the game winner at the end of the game. Do you really think it is reasonable to expect the Pats D to hold that O to only 3 points the whole game. That was the amount they had scored when the Pats were leading by 14 points in the 4th. 17-3, and the O had only scored 10 points themselves.





If not for the D holding the Rams to 17 points (and scoring 7 on top of that) that drive means nothing. There was no way that team was going to keep up with the Rams in scoring.



I was talking about the 45 yarder against Oak to tie it. Brady gets all the credit, but he didn't do much on that drive. (A 7 and 13 yard pass from Brady) Putting a kicker in that situation in those conditions is not ideal. The kicker deserves more credit for making that kick than the QB who completed 2 passes for 7 and 13 yards and scrambled for 5 yards.




3 playoff teams in 2008:

Cardinals 9-7 (made the Super Bowl)
Chargers 8-8 (lost by 11 in the divisional round)
Dolphins 11-5(Lost by 18 in the WC round)

3 playoff teams in 2002:

Raiders 11-5 (Made it to the Super Bowl) Equal to 2008 playoff team
Cleveland 9-7 (lost in the WC round) Didn't make it as far as the Chargers in 08.
Green Bay 12-4 (Lost by 20 in the WC round) Lost by 2 more points than the Dolphins did in 08

In 2002 the #1 seed in the AFC was 11-5. 6 teams were 11-5 and better in 08. I'm not sure how you can say the playoff teams were better in 02. Everything points to the 08 teams being stronger.

Wash was the worst team record wise Ari faced(8-8), Ari didn't lose to any bad teams or beat any good teams, the Jets lost to one bad team and beat one good team in '09. The Jets also beat SD in '09 who was much better than any team Ari faced in the NFC in '08.

The Jets didn't get blown out once. The NO game was a 14 pt loss but we had the ball down 7 in the 4th, NE was a 17 pt loss but had the ball near midfield down 10 in the 4th. Ari was out of their blowouts in the first half- 34-0 to NYJ, 24-7 to Philly, 31-0 to NE

The Pats D was the first and only D to blow a 14 pt 4th qtr lead in the SB.

I don't care how good the '01 Rams O was the NE D blew a historic 4th qtr lead and were rescued by Brady.

If the D didn't blow a 14 pt lead then that drive means nothing too but they did and Brady rescued them.

The 45 yarder vs. oak was a tough kick but Brady set it up, after the tuck rule it was 2nd and 10 at the Oak 47- that 13 yd pass was huge. In OT NE got the ball and he led a 15 play drive to win it including going 8 for 8 passing to set up a chip shot FG.

You can't just look at records, the AFC was tougher top to bottom in 2002.

2002 had 4 under .500 teams
2008 had 6

2002 had 2 teams w/ 5 or less wins
2008 had 5

It was easier to fatten records in 2008 but the 2002 Jets would have mauled the 2008 Phins despite winning 2 less reg season games.

 

[Mrmiami]

Trust me, Manning is not going to play for any Cold weather Constantly damp enviroment...Seattle OUT JETS-OUT KC -OUT etc..... Watch out for Miami, Dallas, San Fran, Arizona, San Diego, Tampa and Washington......those are your players I believe and maybe Jacksonville Jets are gonna play ball just to keep him away form miami but Manning been around long enough to know what Kind of ship their running there.

 

[Mrmiami]

The Jets would of crushed the Dolphins in 08' isn't that the same year they demolished your pathetic team knocking them out of their playoff hopesand sent them packing along with your decrepit old man QB. So what, we lost our first wildcard game to a defensively strong team by running the same plays and throwing the same routes....we technically only had one receiver left in that game by the second quarter and rubber arm couldn't even reach him. They were just sitting back waiting and hoping for passes. Jet's ever came back to Miami for a 3rd shot I'm afraid to tell you it would have been more than your long faces they would have been hanging up.This is as good a statement as saying we should of been the team playing the previously undefeated Chicago Bears (85) beaten by only the dolphins but because of some BS Patcheatrot cute John Deere move we had to watch a pathectic Superbolw blowout 36-3 from a team that couldn't even compete against them...How Sad!!!

 

[nyjunc]

The Jets would of crushed the Dolphins in 08' isn't that the same year they demolished your pathetic team knocking them out of their playoff hopesand sent them packing along with your decrepit old man QB. So what, we lost our first wildcard game to a defensively strong team by running the same plays and throwing the same routes....we technically only had one receiver left in that game by the second quarter and rubber arm couldn't even reach him. They were just sitting back waiting and hoping for passes. Jet's ever came back to Miami for a 3rd shot I'm afraid to tell you it would have been more than your long faces they would have been hanging up.This is as good a statement as saying we should of been the team playing the previously undefeated Chicago Bears (85) beaten by only the dolphins but because of some BS Patcheatrot cute John Deere move we had to watch a pathectic Superbolw blowout 36-3 from a team that couldn't even compete against them...How Sad!!!

I said the '02 Jets would have crushed the '08 dolphins, as it was a completely dead '08 jets team gave Miami all they could handle even though they weren't into the game.

 

[nyjunc]

Trust me, Manning is not going to play for any Cold weather Constantly damp enviroment...Seattle OUT JETS-OUT KC -OUT etc..... Watch out for Miami, Dallas, San Fran, Arizona, San Diego, Tampa and Washington......those are your players I believe and maybe Jacksonville Jets are gonna play ball just to keep him away form miami but Manning been around long enough to know what Kind of ship their running there.

SF isn't exactly a beautiful climate but I agree, peyton is too soft to play in cold weather. look at his history in cold weather games.

 

[DuderinoN703]

When they win I'll tip my cap like I did in 2008.

But the Dolphins had only won b/c Brady was out. With him healthy, there's no chance they would've gone 11-5. - you

 

[DuderinoN703]

Miami hasnt won a sb in his lifetime. What about the jets? Haha. At least we won 2 and made it 5x. Jets won one and it was 42 hrs ago. Hahaha. Miami has also had a much better history. In the 70's we were one of 4 powerhouseteams in NFL. In 80's we made it to 2 sb's and won division after division thru Marino years. And rrecently Miami is 4-2 last 6 games vs jets.

Considering we're all in either our 20s or 30s, who cares about what happened in the 70s and 80s? That's such a long time ago (and some when we weren't on this earth) that it should be irrelevant.