Gus or Chambers as the problem? Stats tell the story. | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Gus or Chambers as the problem? Stats tell the story.

F

Frank B

Starter
Joined
Aug 2, 2005
Messages
281
Reaction score
0
Interesting stats I found at snaps.stats.com. I have heard a lot of complaints from the fans about Chambers dropping passes and I wanted to look into the stats. As reported by this site, a "dropped pass" is "any incomplete pass which was catchable with normal effort." "STATS compares and reveiws the judgement of multiple reporters to determine if a pass was dropped." According to the stats, Chambers has been the target of 68 passes. He has caught 44.1% of those. Surprisingly, they only have Chambers with 1 drop! http://snap.stats.com/stats/nflinfo/playerstats.asp?id=5499&Submit=Go

There is a natural discrepancy between the 44.1% of passes Chambers caught and the 1 drop. What happened to the other passes? That's where Frerottes stats come into play. Out of Frerotte's 267 total attempts, STATS charted 47 "poor throws". A "poor throw" is defined as any forward pass deemed uncatchable. This includes underthrows, interceptions, passes thrown wide of the receiver, passes caught out of bounds, and passes thrown away intentionally." 37% of the time, an incomplete pass on our offense is due to a poor throw. 17.6% of all of Frerottes throws are poor throws. Only 7.9% of the incompletes are due to drops.
http://snap.stats.com/stats/nflinfo/playerstats.asp?id=2869&Submit=Go

This is only a snapshot, but hopefully it will slow the "Chambers Sucks" threads. Yes, he needs to improve certain aspects of his game...ball security, aggression, ball awareness...but I haven't yet heard the criticism that he's not getting open, because he IS getting open. I think these stats debunk the myth that he's dropping passes.
 
I'm not sure how accurate those stats are because I remember more than one drop. But I think it shows the general trend of what's going on. Gus is our problem. Yes, Chambers has to play better but Randy hasn't had a great year statwise either. Now I know some people will point that he has had to stay in and block on a number of passing plays, but don't you think his stats would be much better with a half decent QB. I think both guys are getting frustrated and it's likely affecting their play.
 
I wonder how many of his completions are poor throws also.. just because it was caught doesn't mean it was good.
 
I don't care what anyone says about Chambers anymore... I know what he's capable of with a good passer. Hopefully we can see that 1 day.:D
 
I've seen the ball go through Chambers hands more than once this season. I would call those drops.
 
dolphan98 said:
I'm not sure how accurate those stats are because I remember more than one drop. But I think it shows the general trend of what's going on. Gus is our problem. Yes, Chambers has to play better but Randy hasn't had a great year statwise either. Now I know some people will point that he has had to stay in and block on a number of passing plays, but don't you think his stats would be much better with a half decent QB. I think both guys are getting frustrated and it's likely affecting their play.
Click to expand...


Frank B I agree with you 100%. I have posted the information from Stats, Inc many times showing Chambers drops, but people disbelieve and "know" he's had more drops.

dolphin98, would it help you if you knew CC isn't even amoung the leaders in passes dropped in the AFC? Unless this unbiased site used by the NFL & media has some reason to give CC preferential treatment, CC is not having as bad a year as many "know".

Booker is amoung the AFC leaders unfortunately.
 
rafael said:
I've seen the ball go through Chambers hands more than once this season. I would call those drops.
Click to expand...

one went right through his mits yesterday. I think he is afraid of getting hit. Just keep him running end arounds. that will solve the problem. :(
 
Drop stats are very inaccurate. Chris has dropped more than 1 ball this year.
 
Those of you who say that Chambers has more than one drop are incorrect. A dropped pass is one that is considered to be a good throw and, as was already defined here, catchable with normal effort.

If Chambers gets his hands on a ball, it isn't automatically a drop. If he has to alter his route, jump prematurely, or dive for a ball, it's not going to be a drop regardless of whether he gets his hands on it. Those are passes which are considered fortunate if you catch them, but otherwise incomplete and rightly so.

Look at it this way - in baseball, pitchers can have wild pitches and catchers can have passed balls. Passed balls are balls the catcher should have caught. Wild pitches are really bad pitches that a catcher can't reasonably expect to catch - even if they get their glove or body on it in some way. Official scorers make sense of this.

Gus is really just a wild pitcher.
 
flintsilver7 said:
Those of you who say that Chambers has more than one drop are incorrect. A dropped pass is one that is considered to be a good throw and, as was already defined here, catchable with normal effort.

If Chambers gets his hands on a ball, it isn't automatically a drop. If he has to alter his route, jump prematurely, or dive for a ball, it's not going to be a drop regardless of whether he gets his hands on it. Those are passes which are considered fortunate if you catch them, but otherwise incomplete and rightly so.

Look at it this way - in baseball, pitchers can have wild pitches and catchers can have passed balls. Passed balls are balls the catcher should have caught. Wild pitches are really bad pitches that a catcher can't reasonably expect to catch - even if they get their glove or body on it in some way. Official scorers make sense of this.

Gus is really just a wild pitcher.
Click to expand...

exactly, the key words here are "normal effort"
 
Omg this will be the last <removed> time I say this.Chambers needs a QB to throw him the ball not a hasbeen.

Mod Edit: It will be the last time if you bypass the profanity filter again.
 
I think this thread may obscure the major reasons Chambers's game needs to improve. His problem has never been drops in my opinion -- it's been the other stuff you mentioned. I can count the number of games Chambers has won us on one hand. That's not what should happen when you pay a guy like he's a top-5 receiver in the league.

How many games has Steve Smith won the Panthers? THAT's a top-5 WR.
 
shouright said:
I think this thread may obscure the major reasons Chambers's game needs to improve. His problem has never been drops in my opinion -- it's been the other stuff you mentioned. I can count the number of games Chambers has won us on one hand. That's not what should happen when you pay a guy like he's a top-5 receiver in the league.

How many games has Steve Smith won the Panthers? THAT's a top-5 WR.
Click to expand...

First, I don't even agree with your point. However, let's assume it was true.

How many games would Steve Smith have won with Feeley and Fiedler trying to throw the ball between getting leveled? How many games would Steve Smith be winning now with Bust Frerotte tossing to (or within 10 yards of) him?
 
Frank B said:
Interesting stats I found at snaps.stats.com. I have heard a lot of complaints from the fans about Chambers dropping passes and I wanted to look into the stats. As reported by this site, a "dropped pass" is "any incomplete pass which was catchable with normal effort." "STATS compares and reveiws the judgement of multiple reporters to determine if a pass was dropped." According to the stats, Chambers has been the target of 68 passes. He has caught 44.1% of those. Surprisingly, they only have Chambers with 1 drop! http://snap.stats.com/stats/nflinfo/playerstats.asp?id=5499&Submit=Go

There is a natural discrepancy between the 44.1% of passes Chambers caught and the 1 drop. What happened to the other passes? That's where Frerottes stats come into play. Out of Frerotte's 267 total attempts, STATS charted 47 "poor throws". A "poor throw" is defined as any forward pass deemed uncatchable. This includes underthrows, interceptions, passes thrown wide of the receiver, passes caught out of bounds, and passes thrown away intentionally." 37% of the time, an incomplete pass on our offense is due to a poor throw. 17.6% of all of Frerottes throws are poor throws. Only 7.9% of the incompletes are due to drops.
http://snap.stats.com/stats/nflinfo/playerstats.asp?id=2869&Submit=Go

This is only a snapshot, but hopefully it will slow the "Chambers Sucks" threads. Yes, he needs to improve certain aspects of his game...ball security, aggression, ball awareness...but I haven't yet heard the criticism that he's not getting open, because he IS getting open. I think these stats debunk the myth that he's dropping passes.
Click to expand...
all of our recievers have been getting open. Look at when Wes is on the field and goes out for deep outs or slants, or posts 30 yards down the field and Gus overthrows him or throws him wide. Same thing happens when Chmabers goes across the field and he has to stretch for the inaccurate ball. He's gonna get his head knocked off because of Gus's inaccuracies one of these days. Our recievers dont have a problem getting open, our QB "couldnt throw a ball into the ocean standing from the beach" in Marino's words.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom