Have the Dolphin once again traded back and missed getting a special player? | Page 33 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Have the Dolphin once again traded back and missed getting a special player?

Interesting take. It seems you're defining a "choker" vs. a "gamer?" Mental tuffness and playing to WIN with confidence vs. playing scared and not really believing in yourself. In terms of that dynamic being critical @QB (in the positive sense) I 100% agree. Your take reminds me a tad of handicapping a horse race -- of which I know very little about tho I've been shown some things and told some things by folks that did it professionally. Anyway not to sidetrack but the analysis of the mental side is pretty rare around here and you are 100% correct --- it's a huge factor.

Guys that fold under pressure rarely completely solve that problem. As far as Herbert -- you may be correct about him and time will definitely tell. Apparently this deal of playing QB in the NFL is vastly more difficult than we really understand. And for sure --- a lot of it is in the head.

Reminds me again why Marino was so transcendent at his best ----- dude was a ruthless tuff competitor and had the physical skills to destroy a defense. I'm sure the fact he never played on a championship team really burns him inside and in so many ways undercuts his absolute greatness. But it's impossible to win championships in the NFL when the supporting cast is lacking and incomplete.

Marino not winning a championship does not undercut his greatness in any way except through the eyes of some fans (who generally don't know what they are talking about). It's a rather lazy argument to make and neglects to look at the whole picture (just as somebody who makes the flipside argument by suggesting multiple championships makes somebody greater). This isn't true in football. Guys have their responsibilities. Because of the nature of the game, any faults in football are harder to overcome than other sports. In basketball, just two guys can make a big difference and players always play both sides of the floor. In baseball, poor pitching can be difficult to overcome. But, poor pitchers get pulled frequently and players play both sides of the plate. In football, offensive lineman must block. Backs must block, receive (depending on the type of ffense), and run with effectiveness (which goes back to blocking). Receivers must get open and run correct routes (and catch the ball) in addition to blocking when necesary. Tight ends must block and catch effectively when called on. Quarterbacks must mitigate defenses by correctly reading them, audibling when necessary (and when allowed...Jimmy Johnson never seemed to get this), delivering the ball effectively and on time in a tight windows. Defensive players all have responsibilities from reading offenses, making tackles, making plays on the football, forming effective pass rushes, etc. Guys aren't playing both sides of the ball. There is leadership, which can take many forms. Good, even great, leadership cannot overcome everything. If you look at the 2007 Dolphins, Jason Taylor and Zach Thomas had very good leadership qualities and played great. Miami was in several one-score games. But no matter how good the defense played at times, it could not overcome an offense that desperately needed life support. In many ways it was the exact opposite of almost the entire Marino era. The Defense got old and fell apart quickly after 1982. Even Bill walsh remakred after Super Bowl 19 how great of a job Shula did with with the team given it's limitations on defense (Walsh said a lot of Miami defense even holding together that year was done with smoke and mirrors...his words, not mine). walsh wa sconfident after pre-game warmups that the 49ers could score and score often. He only worried about Marino.

The Dolphins defenses gave up an average of 44 PPG in 10 Miami playoff losses with Marino. Your argument about it being impossible to win championships without a total team effort is spot on. But I don't hold it against Marino given the circumstances in Miami. During his career, the only HOF players Marino played with were Stephenson (until 1987) and Jason Taylor. Taylor came to Miami very late in Marino's career and didn't turn into a major force until after Marino retired (Taylor was good early but then he exploded) . Thomas will likely get in one day. Even many Miami's "good" players were second-tier compared to a lot of other "good" players on other teams (guys who were standouts but will not get HOF consideration). Frank Gifford once said that he "equates stupidity to anyone who says Marino not winning a Super Bowl takes away from his record". By "record" he meant career and accomplishments.
 
Right, in one year Pitts crushed it

but otherwise, similar.

pitts is a far superior prospect but you’d think this wouldn’t be such a debate lol similar athletes
I agree but people don't understand that last year is when it counts, not when he was a freshman playing 3 games. Last year was when he showed you that he was a big boy and was a beast. He only got better in college, a lot better. Some people just don't get it. And they fail to realize no matter how many times it has been said. Pitts played only 7.5 games to have those numbers.

I also see the argument that Florida passed more than Penn state did so that is why he had better numbers than MG. Have you ever though that maybe they threw more because they had Pitts to throw to? Over 100 yards per game. If Penn state would have had Pitts on the team and Florida had MG maybe the production from the offenses would have been different. For both teams.
 
I agree but people don't understand that last year is when it counts, not when he was a freshman playing 3 games. Last year was when he showed you that he was a big boy and was a beast. He only got better in college, a lot better. Some people just don't get it. And they fail to realize no matter how many times it has been said. Pitts played only 7.5 games to have those numbers.

I also see the argument that Florida passed more than Penn state did so that is why he had better numbers than MG. Have you ever though that maybe they threw more because they had Pitts to throw to? Over 100 yards per game. If Penn state would have had Pitts on the team and not MG maybe the production from the offenses would have been different. For both teams.
It's like you guys think I'm saying Pitts sucks lol

Did Flordia have a rb as talented as Barkley to run the ball?
 
It's like you guys think I'm saying Pitts sucks lol

Did Flordia have a rb as talented as Barkley to run the ball?
I dont think you think he sucks just like by my post I hope that you don't think that I think MG sucks, because I know he doesn't. Not only you but a lot of people feel that they have to try to disprove how good he is. Argue against people who are saying how good he is and how he could help us.
 
I dont think you think he sucks just like by my post I hope that you don't think that I think MG sucks, because I know he doesn't. Not only you but a lot of people feel that they have to try to disprove how good he is. Argue against people who are saying how good he is and how he could help us.
I'm mostly just playing devils advocate here to try to temper some of the hype
 
I'm mostly just playing devils advocate here to try to temper some of the hype
That makes sense. The hype is real. I'm with most about how good Pitts is and I feel that with him in the offense, it will bring something that we have never had before. The problems that it can cause on a defense. I'm not by any means saying that it will be as good but we could be better than what New England had. Could you imagine if we got what New England had with Gronk and Hernandez? I feel that Pitts is the player that could put us there.

Maybe I am wrong, but that is how I feel about it. I'm not the GM. I'm just a fan who loves the Miami Dolphins!
 
That makes sense. The hype is real. I'm with most about how good Pitts is and I feel that with him in the offense, it will bring something that we have never had before. The problems that it can cause on a defense. I'm not by any means saying that it will be as good but we could be better than what New England had. Could you imagine if we got what New England had with Gronk and Hernandez? I feel that Pitts is the player that could put us there.

Maybe I am wrong, but that is how I feel about it. I'm not the GM. I'm just a fan who loves the Miami Dolphins!
Oh I feel ya man. Plus with Pitts we have other options- continue the 2TE tandem with MG, at the very least give Pitts a year to season up, then MG could sign a new contract somewhere else and possibly yield us a comp pick

Also- I think Pitts is a way better blocker than Gesicki at their respective times in their college careers for sure
 
Yes...he has the speed and athleticism to be a 1” taller...10 pound heavier...larger wingspan wideout. But the effective way to use him is moving him around ...nightmares for defenses!
So what is it. I can't remember the term they use when a wr or cb can make quick cuts or change of direction. Something with the hips. So he has that better than what other athletic tightends don't have? Crazy lateral or fluid movements for a man his size that even other athletic tight ends don't have which makes him so versatile and able to be good at WR and everywhere? Because remember vernon davis was very fast but vernon didn't have that quickness or that athletic ability overall that makes a guy like pitts able to cut and run routes well like a WR with the size he is? thanks
 
How is there 33 pages about missing a player in the draft before we draft anybody?
 
So what is it. I can't remember the term they use when a wr or cb can make quick cuts or change of direction. Something with the hips. So he has that better than what other athletic tightends don't have? Crazy lateral or fluid movements for a man his size that even other athletic tight ends don't have which makes him so versatile and able to be good at WR and everywhere? Because remember vernon davis was very fast but vernon didn't have that quickness or that athletic ability overall that makes a guy like pitts able to cut and run routes well like a WR with the size he is? thanks
Quick twitch?
 
So what is it. I can't remember the term they use when a wr or cb can make quick cuts or change of direction. Something with the hips. So he has that better than what other athletic tightends don't have? Crazy lateral or fluid movements for a man his size that even other athletic tight ends don't have which makes him so versatile and able to be good at WR and everywhere? Because remember vernon davis was very fast but vernon didn't have that quickness or that athletic ability overall that makes a guy like pitts able to cut and run routes well like a WR with the size he is? thanks
Pitts is very fluid and on another level than other tight ends...he is a capable of playing anywhere. He beat Surtain JR...who is a top pick in this draft.
 
Quick twitch?
yeah that and I remember scouts saying something whether it's wrs or cbs. They'd knock those types of players if they had "stiff hips" and it had something to do, with corners their transition of back peddle to quickly transition to a burst run or something like that. Can drop his hips well and seemed to suggest a player that can change directions and like shift into the next gear fast. Something about the hips that helps the player have that fluid movement to also make quick cuts and get out of breaks also. And does it more seamlessly than the player that doesn't have that. It seems like positions where the player has to do that is important which is why it seems like WRs and dbs have had negative and positive grades based on that. So if Pitts is fluid with his route running like a WR, he must have fluid movements or something especially for a big guy to do that or better than other athletic tight ends
 
Pitts is very fluid and on another level than other tight ends...he is a capable of playing anywhere. He beat Surtain JR...who is a top pick in this draft.
Preach! I keep telling ppl that when I saw film on pitts I asked myself wtf was I looking at because I’ve never seen this before. Pitts @ 6’6 245 can stop on a dime , change directions, never drops anything, out jump you etc... smh . This kid hooks up w a good Qb , lights out. Defenses would have to double team him or he’ll dominate.
 
Preach! I keep telling ppl that when I saw film on pitts I asked myself wtf was I looking at because I’ve never seen this before. Pitts @ 6’6 245 can stop on a dime , change directions, never drops anything, out jump you etc... smh . This kid hooks up w a good Qb , lights out. Defenses would have to double team him or he’ll dominate.
We’ll be extremely lucky if he falls to 6...Not overly optimistic about it right now!
 
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