touborg
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How has Spielman done so far?
- Thread starter touborg
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DolfanDaveInMI
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Better than Wannstedt, for sure.
Jimmy James
You sit on a throne of lies!
I voted Okay.
If RS had been upfront about feeling we had to draft for need, I don't think I would have been nearly as upset about Carey yesterday. Learning today that we probably could have shaken down Buffalo like Dallas did just adds insult to injury.
I like to think of that as rookie mistakes, though. I hope next year sees RS turn to pure value drafting, and I hope we see us not trading away picks for veterans so much.
All in all, I think it's a very nice first draft running the team. I have hope for the future.
If RS had been upfront about feeling we had to draft for need, I don't think I would have been nearly as upset about Carey yesterday. Learning today that we probably could have shaken down Buffalo like Dallas did just adds insult to injury.
I like to think of that as rookie mistakes, though. I hope next year sees RS turn to pure value drafting, and I hope we see us not trading away picks for veterans so much.
All in all, I think it's a very nice first draft running the team. I have hope for the future.
DevilInPgh
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I said OK because he did pick Vernon Carey, but he also traded away lots of picks. The only reasoning I can think of is that he's trying to stockpile picks for the next draft so that he can trade up for better spots (assuming we make the playoffs. Playoffs? PLAYOFFS? WE'RE JUST TRYING TO WIN A GAME! ANY GAME!!!)
finsnchips
2005 FinHeaven GM League Champion!!
Sorry Jimmy, I have to totally disagree with you.
I think Rick had the guys he wanted to draft. Andrews, Clayton and Carey.
He wanted Carey, and he probably didnt even think about the Buffalo trade that much.
Carey is a really good pick. WE are now set at the tackle positions for the next 10 years.
The Will Poole selection was great. CB wasn't a need but he went BPA and got a 1st round corner in r.4
I think Rick had the guys he wanted to draft. Andrews, Clayton and Carey.
He wanted Carey, and he probably didnt even think about the Buffalo trade that much.
Carey is a really good pick. WE are now set at the tackle positions for the next 10 years.
The Will Poole selection was great. CB wasn't a need but he went BPA and got a 1st round corner in r.4
Jimmy James
You sit on a throne of lies!
finsnchips,
I don't think you're wrong, but I think that the strategy in and of itself is wrong. Any time a team wants to do what Buffalo did, you trade down with them. That was a windfall too big to ignore.
As to the whole value/need issue, RS didn't have to say anything at all. He said BPA, though. I don't know if he felt he needed to mislead other teams, but it just doesn't make sense to me...
I don't think you're wrong, but I think that the strategy in and of itself is wrong. Any time a team wants to do what Buffalo did, you trade down with them. That was a windfall too big to ignore.
As to the whole value/need issue, RS didn't have to say anything at all. He said BPA, though. I don't know if he felt he needed to mislead other teams, but it just doesn't make sense to me...
finsnchips
2005 FinHeaven GM League Champion!!
I see your point. I think that although he said BPA, he always felt that Andrews and/or Carey would be at 20.
If we had this years second we may well have traded up to 16 and nabbed Andrews.
I hear what you say, but am delighted with Carey and Poole
If we had this years second we may well have traded up to 16 and nabbed Andrews.
I hear what you say, but am delighted with Carey and Poole
Noodle Arm
FinHeaven VIP
Maybe Rick should have just said "We'll take the BPA.....to fill our needs." :tongue: lol
Jimmy James
You sit on a throne of lies!
finsnchips,
Don't get me wrong -- I think RS did a solid job, and I'm getting more and more excited about Carey the more I learn about him. I will never hold anything about the draft against him -- I just want him to do the best he can.
Poole is robbery on almost the Buffalo trade level. I'm really happy about that pick and can accept the notion that the guys we got in the 5th/6th were value even if some sources had the S going at the end of the draft.
Don't get me wrong -- I think RS did a solid job, and I'm getting more and more excited about Carey the more I learn about him. I will never hold anything about the draft against him -- I just want him to do the best he can.
Poole is robbery on almost the Buffalo trade level. I'm really happy about that pick and can accept the notion that the guys we got in the 5th/6th were value even if some sources had the S going at the end of the draft.
DolFinatic718
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What did we get for trading our fifth away?
Jimmy James
You sit on a throne of lies!
A 7th. In a way, you could suggest that we took a move down a few in the 5th to move way up in the 6th.
PhinBeck
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Hey Jimmy James hindsight is 20/20 and when you have about a minute to decide you do what was best. It was reported that Minn was interested in Carey, it was also reported NE MAY have been interested. From things we can learn is that Rick liked Carey and Andrews which are not suprises and Clayton who had been reported the last week was Rick's pick. 2 of those guys were taken higher than anyone predicted, maybe earlier than Rick did. People that say he was wrong to do what he did would have been the first to moan had we lost out on Carey. And truth be told, do you really think that Buffalo would have given us what they gave Dallas when the could do teh deal with Dallas? Remember they moved up for Losman, so really they only had to get a head of GB so they had several choices and would you want to hand a divisional rival 4 picks or whatever it was to move up when you could accomplish your goal outside the division?
Jimmy James
You sit on a throne of lies!
The word is that Buffalo did contact us, so I think it is a possibility. For whatever reason, Buffalo, Miami, and New England seem willing to deal within the division based on recent trades. I don't agree with it, but it doesn't seem to bother them.
You seem to be supporting the panic theory based on what you say. My answer would be that I'd prefer to not have a GM who panics when he hears that guy 3 of 3 he likes might be a trade up target or go a pick before us, but I can't fault RS too much for not being the guy with ice water in his veins in his first real year as GM. You're right about hindsight, but let's face it -- we'd have nothing to talk about if we didn't take the opportunity to reflect on things done under time pressure. By that logic, we can't blame Pat or Sam for blowing a play, and we can't blame the coaches for what they do. That might be a better way to be, but it just defeats the purpose of a message board in my view.
You seem to be supporting the panic theory based on what you say. My answer would be that I'd prefer to not have a GM who panics when he hears that guy 3 of 3 he likes might be a trade up target or go a pick before us, but I can't fault RS too much for not being the guy with ice water in his veins in his first real year as GM. You're right about hindsight, but let's face it -- we'd have nothing to talk about if we didn't take the opportunity to reflect on things done under time pressure. By that logic, we can't blame Pat or Sam for blowing a play, and we can't blame the coaches for what they do. That might be a better way to be, but it just defeats the purpose of a message board in my view.
LIDOLFAN
Practice Squad
I FEEL WE GOT SOME EXCELLENT POTENTIAL PLAYERS IN THE LATER PICKS AND ACTUALLY FEEL THAT CAREY WILL BE BETTER FOR US THAN ANDREWS WOULD I THINK RICK DID A GREAT JOB :thewave: