Identity Crisis - Was The Draft Indicative Of A Larger Problem With Grier And The Dolphins? | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Identity Crisis - Was The Draft Indicative Of A Larger Problem With Grier And The Dolphins?

phinsforlife

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This thread is not about the pro's and con's of the individual players they drafted. It is about the mosaic of what the team has done under Grier's stewardship.

This draft, they went with the fatties. I think people were generally pleased the team added some bulk in the trenches, disregarding the notion of whether or not they handled it in the most optimal fashion.

The bigger picture problems the draft illustrates are several things:

-The team has no identity and we flip flop all the time. The team was obviously too soft. Everyone knew it. But it was intentionally soft. These were the players they had built the team around. The prior years draft and FA was all quick, finesse players, for the most part. Chop, Jaylen Wright (fast), Malik, Tahj, Aaron Brewer, Jonnu Smith, etc. All in the smaller, quicker, finesse mode. WRs already on the team, Tyreek and Waddle, small and quick. Tua, small and quick to throw the ball. Achane, etc. Then this draft, we need to go to the other end of the guardrail, and do the exact opposite, because we went too much in one direction for too many years. The goal is to build a team, not just a collection of players. Grier seems to blame this on the notion that he accomodates what the head coach wants. Well, then why do you even have a job? Further, when the head coach changes all the time, there is no single strong vision the team is built around. If the head coach changes every 3 to 4 years, the type of team you want changes every 3 to 4 years, and you can never build anything, because all you are doing is tearing down what was there before and you end up with a jumbled mess.

-We never seem to build toward anything. We just drafted to replace what was here, and was let go two years ago, because we decided to put the money in other places, and those are all seemingly turning out to be poor decisions. It seems at best, we run in place to stand still. Always plugging holes and trying to cover for other mistakes, as opposed to adding to a solid foundation and growing. I think there is now a fair bit less talent on the team than we had two years ago. It appears we have gone backwards - the current NFL power rankings and Vegas odds are telling you that too. We seem to be viewed as team #20-#21 in the NFL.

-We were also drafting to cover mistakes from prior drafts. We needed Jonah, because we got Eichenberg wrong (and let Rob Hunt go). We had to trade up for both of those players too.

Wayne Gretzky said something akin to "don't skate to where the puck is, skate to where the puck is going to be." We seem to have little strategy, vision, or foresight with regard to the team we are building. There is no vision or identity. I have no idea what this team it, it seems like a mish mash of stuff. It is like the Island of Misfit Toys. Howie Roseman is a great GM because he is good at both the tactics (which players you pick for your team at the player level) and the strategy of the type of team he wants to build. The Eagles have an identity. That is clear. He was also smart, because he zigged when the rest of the league zagged. He saw the league getting too small and fast, and realized he could take advantage of that by building a team that could just run everyone else over.

In addition to doing better at a tactical level, we need more vision, and need to build a team with an identity. This draft showed the team has been all over the map, and also constantly puts themselves in a position where they spend too much in the way of resource trying to correct prior mistakes.

Also if anybody thinks this team has an identity, what exactly do you think it is? What can they hang their hat on every Sunday and say, this is what we will do to the opponent on each side of the ball, and this is how we are going to win the game?
 
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Until both Grier and McDaniel go we won't change.
3rd and 4th and short we will try to deceive with a pass.
We will still get the plays in late.
Grier drafts the type of players that the coaches he has had wanted.
We blame Ross Grier and McDaniel and for me it's all of them.
We play in our division cold weather teams and in November and December we get exposed.
McDaniel can mask our faults on offence but will he change in 25 I doubt it.
Grier has been here far too long and we are on the verge of another rebuild
 
Until both Grier and McDaniel go we won't change.
3rd and 4th and short we will try to deceive with a pass.
We will still get the plays in late.
Grier drafts the type of players that the coaches he has had wanted.
We blame Ross Grier and McDaniel and for me it's all of them.
We play in our division cold weather teams and in November and December we get exposed.
McDaniel can mask our faults on offence but will he change in 25 I doubt it.
Grier has been here far too long and we are on the verge of another rebuild
well said!
 
In your post you say we used to have a clear identity then go on to say we never have a clear identity. Having an identity isn't enough. We used to have one and it got figured out and nullified.

This time next year Chubb, Ramsey and Hill will not be on the Roster and they'll have had $60m+ to spend in free agency,

This season is a transition year rather than an all out rebuild leading into a 2027 D-Day on Tua. The reason you can't see the clear identity is they're re-loading it for 2026 and 2027 in a different image.
 
In your post you say we used to have a clear identity then go on to say we never have a clear identity. Having an identity isn't enough. We used to have one and it got figured out and nullified.

This time next year Chubb, Ramsey and Hill will not be on the Roster and they'll have had $60m+ to spend in free agency,

This season is a transition year rather than an all out rebuild leading into a 2027 D-Day on Tua. The reason you can't see the clear identity is they're re-loading it for 2026 and 2027 in a different image.
where in my post did i say we used to have a clear identity? if i did, it is a typo, and i need to fix it. the team did have an identity, but that was a long time ago, and cannot remember when. for all of grier's tenure, it seems to have been absent. what i did say is there was more talent on the roster two years ago, than we have now. if i said we had more of an identity, it was a mistake!
 
This thread is not about the pro's and con's of the individual players they drafted. It is about the mosaic of what the team has done under Grier's stewardship.

This draft, they went with the fatties. I think people were generally pleased the team added some bulk in the trenches, disregarding the notion of whether or not they handled it in the most optimal fashion.

The bigger picture problems the draft illustrates are several things:

-The team has no identity and we flip flop all the time. The team was obviously too soft. Everyone knew it. But it was intentionally soft. These were the players they had built the team around. The prior years draft and FA was all quick, finesse players, for the most part. Chop, Jaylen Wright (fast), Malik, Tahj, Aaron Brewer, Jonnu Smith, etc. All in the smaller, quicker, finesse mode. WRs already on the team, Tyreek and Waddle, small and quick. Tua, small and quick to throw the ball. Achane, etc. Then this draft, we need to go to the other end of the guardrail, and do the exact opposite, because we went too much in one direction for too many years. The goal is to build a team, not just a collection of players. Grier seems to blame this on the notion that he accomodates what the head coach wants. Well, then why do you even have a job? Further, when the head coach changes all the time, there is no single strong vision the team is built around. If the head coach changes every 3 to 4 years, the type of team you want changes every 3 to 4 years, and you can never build anything, because all you are doing is tearing down what was there before and you end up with a jumbled mess.

-We never seem to build toward anything. We just drafted to replace what was here, and was let go two years ago, because we decided to put the money in other places, and those are all seemingly turning out to be poor decisions. It seems at best, we run in place to stand still. Always plugging holes and trying to cover for other mistakes, as opposed to adding to a solid foundation and growing. I think there is now a fair bit less talent on the team than we had two years ago. It appears we have gone backwards - the current NFL power rankings and Vegas odds are telling you that too. We seem to be viewed as team #20-#21 in the NFL.

-We were also drafting to cover mistakes from prior drafts. We needed Jonah, because we got Eichenberg wrong (and let Rob Hunt go). We had to trade up for both of those players too.

Wayne Gretzky said something akin to "don't skate to where the puck is, skate to where the puck is going to be." We seem to have little strategy, vision, or foresight with regard to the team we are building. There is no vision or identity. I have no idea what this team it, it seems like a mish mash of stuff. It is like the Island of Misfit Toys. Howie Roseman is a great GM because he is good at both the tactics (which players you pick for your team at the player level) and the strategy of the type of team he wants to build. The Eagles have an identity. That is clear. He was also smart, because he zigged when the rest of the league zagged. He saw the league getting too small and fast, and realized he could take advantage of that by building a team that could just run everyone else over.

In addition to doing better at a tactical level, we need more vision, and need to build a team with an identity. This draft showed the team has been all over the map, and also constantly puts themselves in a position where they spend too much in the way of resource trying to correct prior mistakes.

Also if anybody thinks this team has an identity, what exactly do you think it is? What can they hang their hat on every Sunday and say, this is what we will do to the opponent on each side of the ball, and this is how we are going to win the game?
Been saying this for years, this team doesn't have an identity (perhaps finesse), hasn't had one since Shula. The one thing that is clear to me is finesse does not win superbowls.
 
I think speed is still a priority, Grant and Savaiinaea are both huge and considered tough, yet very light on their feet. Phillips, Trader and Marshall are more quick than fast but I don’t think it’s a change in philosophy
 
I've always been a proponent of a bigger more physical team. Especially in the trenches. Time and time again those teams seemingly challenge for a playoff spot and beyond.

In today's game teams like Philadelphia and Baltimore who can run the football, protect the QB and play a physical brand of defense, seem to always be in the mix. While others, like Kansas City and San Francisco have a solid philosophy headed up by outstanding coaches. And Buffalo always seems to find a way with Allen leading the way.

It be nice to have those types of identities as an organization and a team. This weak, afraid of the cold, and severely unaccountable McDaniel lead team, has no identity other than those first 4 games of the 2023 season, one of which the team scored 70 points. The high flying circus offense wasn't complete and lacked balance. McDaniel still hasnt figured things out or improved his in game adjustment capabilities to counter the opposition.

It certainly appears Miami or perhaps even Grier himself finally figured out the team needed to get more physical. Perhaps taking the advice of some of the F/A's who've played for the team; giving insight as to how others viewed the overall weaknesses of the Dolphins. Let's hope the switch up continues into the foreseeable future?
 
In your post you say we used to have a clear identity then go on to say we never have a clear identity. Having an identity isn't enough. We used to have one and it got figured out and nullified.

This time next year Chubb, Ramsey and Hill will not be on the Roster and they'll have had $60m+ to spend in free agency,

This season is a transition year rather than an all out rebuild leading into a 2027 D-Day on Tua. The reason you can't see the clear identity is they're re-loading it for 2026 and 2027 in a different image.
you can’t rebuild something that hasn’t been built in the first place
 
McDaniel's initial success may have clouded things a little bit. Give McDaniel credit with his vision as to what Tyreek Hill would add to the offense. For a short time, the Dolphins offense was nearly unstoppable.

Remember, year two, the Dolphins jumped out to 8-3 and some well respected experts were talking super bowl.

Teams figured out how to stop Hill and Waddle and then the physical limitations were exposed.

Maybe this offseason shows that Grier and McDaniel, in fact, do get it?
 
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I think speed is still a priority, Grant and Savaiinaea are both huge and considered tough, yet very light on their feet. Phillips, Trader and Marshall are more quick than fast but I don’t think it’s a change in philosophy
that was one of my concerns about jonah. still unclear to me if he is a tough guy, or a finesse guy. we shall see. it would be nice if we could run the ball straight ahead on 3rd and 1, that is for sure!
 
McDaniel's initial success may have clouded things a little bit. Give McDaniel credit with his vision as to what Tyreek Hill would add to the offense. For a short time, tge Dolphins offense was nearly unstoppable.

Remember, year two, the Dolphins jumped out to 8-3 and some well respected experts were talking super bowl.

Teams figured out how to stop Hill and Waddle and then the physical limitations were exposed.

Maybe this offseason shows that Grier and McDaniel, in fact, do get it?
if they do finally get it, a little late. maybe an excuse for mcdaniel, that is the downside of a first time inexperienced head coach. but no excuse for grier, to let it get so far in the finesse direction. if he just lets the hc build the roster he wants, there is no point to grier being here. my view, the buck stops with him. his whole tenure, the team has seemingly had no vision, and no identity. just one thing to the next, one bandaid to the next.
 
Our OL assistant coach was at the senior bowl this year and one of the OL we had talked to was asked about some of the things he was being coached at and he said our coach told him to work on blocking in an angle. To me that's what we've been doing here since Mike got here. It's all about the zone blocking, double blocking and cross blocking at the second level but that's not being physical. I'm not sure we'll play a physical type of football regardless of how many OL guys we draft.

I'm very interested in seeing how we do on 3rd/4th and short. Being that physical teams will just push the defense back instead of trying to finesse them. One thing that can lift a team up is when your OL is pushing the other team around. We'll see if our style changes or not.
 
Maybe this offseason shows that Grier and McDaniel, in fact, do get it?

Grier did nothing all last season to fix the Guard position when it was obvious to anyone with sight that it was crippling the offense.

Then he re-signs Eich, signs one guy recovering from a torn achilles in FA and drafts one guard and calls it a day.

Grier does not get it. Grier needs to be gone from this organization.
 
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