If the Dolphins drafted Lamar Jackson, would he still be successful?

Alex Trevelyan

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I’m sure New England will have it figured out come playoffs
I keep seeing this article of faith repeated as if it has any probability behind it. Belichick is 3-6 in the playoffs against teams that beat him during the regular season. They're far more likely to get the tires beat off them again because they have gaping weaknesses that are mismatched against Ravens' strengths. They got physically dominated.
 

Alex Trevelyan

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oh please... these “generational” comments are so ridiculous. there are so few of these, yet so many hand out those comments like mint candies.

Generational? MAYBE Peyton Manning or Tom Brady (thoigh latter i think is more a product of his organization).

Marino. Favre. Thats about it for recent history.
Jackson is doing things no other QB in history has ever done. His numbers are staggering. He is certainly a generational talent, a true prodigy like Marino was. Favre wasn't a generational talent at all. Jackson's physical gifts, combined with his football IQ and extraordinary leadership qualities are a perfect storm.
 

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Snoop

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Ironically you just revised history. There were plenty of people on this board and in the media who wanted a QB in 2018 after his asinine decision not to surgically repair his knee cost us 2017.

It's almost paradoxical we're seeing the Jeff Ireland defense applied to Grier's failures almost 10 years later.
This is true. Many people wanted to take a QB.
 

LoneStarPhin

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Jackson is doing things no other QB in history has ever done. His numbers are staggering. He is certainly a generational talent, a true prodigy like Marino was. Favre wasn't a generational talent at all. Jackson's physical gifts, combined with his football IQ and extraordinary leadership qualities are a perfect storm.
We’ll see. I think it’s dumb making those kind of statements after one or two seasons. There are plenty of people who put up crazy stats for a short duration.

A true “generational” talent I believe is someone who does amazing things like few ithers over an extended period. Or at least consistently so vastly above what others have done.


this society is so microwave now- always wanting to declare some the best ever.
 

CoryMatthews

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We’ll see. I think it’s dumb making those kind of statements after one or two seasons. There are plenty of people who put up crazy stats for a short duration.

A true “generational” talent I believe is someone who does amazing things like few ithers over an extended period. Or at least consistently so vastly above what others have done.


this society is so microwave now- always wanting to declare some the best ever.
It is as stupid as the graphic listed comparing Lamar jackson to other players. Comparing first 16 games vs other players who aren’t even the leaders in those specific categories. I guess whoever made that graphic didn’t want to put Lamar jackson interceptions vs Peyton Manning’s first 16 games as it would have made it easier to see what a farce it is.
 

j-off-her-doll

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That would also be my concern for Lamar. It’s difficult for a QB who runs as much as he does to stay healthy for a prolonged career. The only one with any kind of longevity that I can recall was Michael Vick.
Jackson could suffer an injury, but his mind and feet work so quick that he rarely takes direct hits. People will - and should - copy whay Baltimore is doing, but few QB's protect themselves as well as Jackson. His ability to use his quickness to avoid direct hits is reminiscent of Barry Sanders - though his running style is different. That's the thing that makes it tougher to project someone else doing it as well. Any team that thinks it might draft Jalen Hurts should be studying Baltimore's offense, but Hurts will be more likely to sustain an injury, because he'll take more direct hits. If a team is savvy, they'll use designed runs less often with Hurts - keeping the threat but sparing him some violence.

I was too low on Jackson - too hard on his shortcomings and too reserved about his special traits. Development is huge for any young QB, but I think Jackson would excel with any half-competent coach. Gase is incompetent, so it's hard to say whether Jackson could have overcome that handicap.

With regard to his passing, Baltimore's heavy sets make it much easier on him. Passing efficiency jumps in heavy sets, because they remove DB's and put LB's in position where they have to cover. Vs LA, Baltimore had a TD pass out of 03 personnel (3 TE 2 WR), where they ran 4 verts. It was an empty set, but the D still had to respect the threat of Jackson as a running threat (because you always have to - especially on 1st and 10). As a result, Hollywood Brown got a clean release from the slot, so he was running clean up the seam, and with the Rams in Cover 3, he was wide open (by NFL standards) in the EZ.

The one thing about Jackson I didn't see improving to this extent, and certainly not this quickly = he sees it and trusts it. He's shed his hesitation as a passer, and his QB instincts are catching up to his athletic instincts, which have always been elite. Baltimore is as fun as any team I've watched, and there isn't a QB who would run this offense better.
 

hoops

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Would it surprise anyone if he went from league mvp to average or below average even in 2020 depending on what defenses do to counter?

wouldnt surprise me

you got to start with a plan vs those heavy tight end sets. If you can’t deal with that you got no chance.
 

Dolph N.Fan

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I keep seeing this article of faith repeated as if it has any probability behind it. Belichick is 3-6 in the playoffs against teams that beat him during the regular season. They're far more likely to get the tires beat off them again because they have gaping weaknesses that are mismatched against Ravens' strengths. They got physically dominated.
Because the game will mostly likely be in Cheatsboro with New England getting favored tripping calls.
 

TannDaMan17

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Would it surprise anyone if he went from league mvp to average or below average even in 2020 depending on what defenses do to counter?

wouldnt surprise me

you got to start with a plan vs those heavy tight end sets. If you can’t deal with that you got no chance.
It's simple, you got to hit him in the mouth.

As Harrison explains in this video (8:05 mark), you got to deter him from running with consistant and violent hits, it's just that simple.


Of course that's easier said than done, but nobody has really started punishing him yet, that could change this week vs San Fran.

For as undeniably amazing as Lamar Jackson is, the truth is they aren't asking him to make a lot of tough throws because they don't need him too.

Force Lamar to make the types of throws outside the hash marks that most NFL QB's need to make to survive in this league (he doesn't) and Lamar isn't going to be very special at all.

He's so fast though it's tough to dictate what he will do, you can only deter him from running so much, but imo it's the only way because his speed is what make him special, not his arm like Mahomes.
 
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The Ghost

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Mark Ingram, their OL and TE's deserve a butt load of credit too.

They've done a great job of assembling the type of offense that he can thrive in.

Lamar would be successful anywhere, having a running game produce 5 yards a pop makes it damn near impossible to stop them.

Even Marquis Brown was the perfect addition.

That's what it takes to be an MVP and win a super bowl. A great team.
 

AMakados10

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The Dolphins have been a revolving door of QBs and coaches for years. There is little confidence they could develop a pocket passer, let alone restructure an offense to suit a QBs transcendent skillset.

I don't think this can be successful long term though. Eventually, Jackson's going to get his ankle rolled up on like every player or put on the cover of the next Madden game, and we'll see how he does. People said the same about Vick changing the league until he broke his leg.

We'll see how much the Ravens are willing to run Jackson when he's making $40M on a fully guaranteed $200M contract too. Until then, he is sure fun to watch. It's pretty crazy to lose track of the ball on TV lol.
 

LoneStarPhin

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Would it surprise anyone if he went from league mvp to average or below average even in 2020 depending on what defenses do to counter?

wouldnt surprise me

you got to start with a plan vs those heavy tight end sets. If you can’t deal with that you got no chance.
Exactly this! that was my point about declaring someone a generational talent.
 

Snoop

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Mark Ingram, their OL and TE's deserve a butt load of credit too.

They've done a great job of assembling the type of offense that he can thrive in.

Lamar would be successful anywhere, having a running game produce 5 yards a pop makes it damn near impossible to stop them.

Even Marquis Brown was the perfect addition.

That's what it takes to be an MVP and win a super bowl. A great team.
I mean Lamar is the reason the running game is so dominant. When the defense is terrified of him keeping it on the option that split second it takes to make sure he doesn’t have it allows the RBs to plow through for 7 yards.
 
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fansinceGWilson

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Jackson is doing things no other QB in history has ever done. His numbers are staggering. He is certainly a generational talent, a true prodigy like Marino was. Favre wasn't a generational talent at all. Jackson's physical gifts, combined with his football IQ and extraordinary leadership qualities are a perfect storm.
Can't really say that. If BALT had drafted Mahomes and NYJ had drafted Jackson, what are the odds Mahomes be the generational talent and Jackson wouldn't? I admit Jackson looks like the real deal, but crediting him as generational is ignoring the roster and coaches
 

j-off-her-doll

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I mean Lamar is the reason the running game is so dominant. When the defense is terrified of him keeping it on the option that split second it takes to make sure he didn’t keep it allows the RBs to plow through for 7 yards.
Had written a similar reply to the same post, but this is more succinct. He's a nightmare to defend, and he makes life easier for everyone else.
 
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