Is "clutch" real or myth in terms of the QB position?

[Mach2]

Was having an exchange in another thread when the subject of "clutch" came up.

I believe it is an intangible trait. It isn't necessarily either yes or no. There are different degrees.

Montana, Brady, Warner, etc had "it". You will never convince me they were simply products of their environment.

 

[superphin]

It’s absolutely real because pressure is real and being able to step up and not let your nerves overwhelm you when pressure is at a high point is a mental skill. I think it aligns with your fight or flight response.

 

[BrowardDolfan]

Was having an exchange in another thread when the subject of "clutch" came up.

I believe it is an intangible trait. It isn't necessarily either yes or no. There are different degrees.

Montana, Brady, Warner, etc had "it". You will never convince me they were simply products of their environment.

It is real, but it has limitations. It depends on the team around the QB as well. A QB can take a team on his back and do unbelievable things, but he needs receivers to make the tough catch, the D to get a big stop, etc. He can only do so much himself.

As an example, Mahomes was great enough to win the Super Bowl 2 years ago with an underwhelming receiving corps, but he did have a strong OL, enough of a running game, and his own ability to create plays to overcome it. However, in this past SB, his OL laid a huge egg, his WRs had some huge drops, and the Chiefs were never really in it. Does it mean Mahomes lost it? No, a man can only do so much.

Plus, I think guys have shown they can develop having "it". Elway is an example. He's on 3 SB losers, but shows the grit and leadership in winning 2 before he retires. Of course, having Terrell Davis helped quite a bit, but that again goes to having the team around you to get the job done.

And there is just lousy luck in some circumstances, Kelly brings the Jills down to kick the game winner against the Giants, but Norwood misses it a foot to the right. History is totally different if Norwood hits that kick. (As a Dolphin fan, one of my fave SBs ever lol).

PS, with all due respect, how does Warner get on your list with Montana and Brady? He won it all once with one of the best offenses in the history of the NFL. Did he make the tackle on the 2 yard line to keep Tennessee from coming back? The next year, he loses it as a huge favorite to an unknown Tom Brady. And then Roethlisberger had "it" more than Warner did in his SB with the Cards.

 

[djphinfan]

Ask a pro golfer??

Pivotal situations affect the nervous system which affect the ability of the athlete to execute mentally and physically, especially in the hands

 

[Mach2]

It is real, but it has limitations. It depends on the team around the QB as well. A QB can take a team on his back and do unbelievable things, but he needs receivers to make the tough catch, the D to get a big stop, etc. He can only do so much himself.

As an example, Mahomes was great enough to win the Super Bowl 2 years ago with an underwhelming receiving corps, but he did have a strong OL, enough of a running game, and his own ability to create plays to overcome it. However, in this past SB, his OL laid a huge egg, his WRs had some huge drops, and the Chiefs were never really in it. Does it mean Mahomes lost it? No, a man can only do so much.

Plus, I think guys have shown they can develop having "it". Elway is an example. He's on 3 SB losers, but shows the grit and leadership in winning 2 before he retires. Of course, having Terrell Davis helped quite a bit, but that again goes to having the team around you to get the job done.

And there is just lousy luck in some circumstances, Kelly brings the Jills down to kick the game winner against the Giants, but Norwood misses it a foot to the right. History is totally different if Norwood hits that kick. (As a Dolphin fan, one of my fave SBs ever lol).

PS, with all due respect, how does Warner get on your list with Montana and Brady? He won it all once with one of the best offenses in the history of the NFL. Did he make the tackle on the 2 yard line to keep Tennessee from coming back? The next year, he loses it as a huge favorite to an unknown Tom Brady. And then Roethlisberger had "it" more than Warner did in his SB with the Cards.

Fair enough about Warner. IMO, though, he executed that very prolific offense almost to perfection. The flip side would be, even he says Marshall Faulk was the catalyst that drove the "Greatest Show on Turf".

 

[dolphan]

I think the playcalls matter more than anything when you’re down to the last plays, at least.

If the defense has the right call…it’s incredibly difficult to win the play. During most of the game you can just throw it away or dump it off or slide for a yard and you keep negative plays away. But when you have no choice but to make yards…you damn well better have called something you can get it with.

Sure…sometimes the QB pulls a Mahomes behind the back blindfolded miracle throw across the field to a guy whose man slipped…or Allen takes off and runs past a perfect coverage…or Jayden Daniels does one of his crazy Jayden Daniels things…but it’s rare. And they wouldn’t have to do it if the defense hadn’t won all their reps.

TLDR…Hope you fooled the defense enough to win the play and then execute it. People will think that’s clutch.

 

[Fred Bear]

We havet had any real clutch guys in a long time ..still waiting

 

[Fred Bear]

The window is so small and it takes team effort.

 

[AMakados10]

Some people/players have gravitas that makes people want to follow them.

Some people/players have ability to perform well in high pressure situations while others get flummoxed.

Great people/players have gravitas and have the ability to perform well in high pressure situations.

 

[Feverdream]

I think it's mostly myth... I've always thought that QBs get too much acclaim when their teams are good and too much blame when their teams are bad.

 

[Mach2]

I think it's mostly myth... I've always thought that QBs get too much acclaim when their teams are good and too much blame when their teams are bad.

That's true but the two aren't mutually exclusive.

 

[phinsforlife]

Ask a pro golfer??

Pivotal situations affect the nervous system which affect the ability of the athlete to execute mentally and physically, especially in the hands

i agree.
although i think about it very differently than most.
i think clutch means be able to do in a high pressure situation, what you can normally do in a low pressure situation.
most athletes cannot.
that is what choking is.
missing the 3 foot putt that you made 270 straight times, like rory did at pinehurst. missing the xp or 30 yard fg, you never miss, until the kick is to win the game.
to believe in clutch, you need to believe in choke.
i believe in choke first. most athletes choke. that is why there are very few elite players at positions where they are exposed to individual pressure.
in my view clutch therefore means just being able to NOT choke when it really matters.
can some people actually elevate their game in high pressure situations, and do what they don't normally do?
that is interesting.
i think there are a few that come to mind, so i do believe it is possible, but that is even a smaller subset of athletes.
david ortiz seemed to come up big in the biggest moments. adam vinatieri as a fg kicker. brady and montana as QBs.
end of the day though, i think choke is the starting point, and many/most do, including sadly players on the dolphins, and frankly the same for the coaches and GM, who seems to constantly outsmart himself in high pressure situations like draft, FA, and big contract negotiations. yup i think grier is a choker

 

[Feverdream]

That's true but the two aren't mutually exclusive.

Well, let me expand on that a bit more.

Some people are more fearless than others, less afraid that their next action will be a failure. When this guy is a QB, we usually call him a gunslinger... CBs almost have to have the ability to forget about the last play and throw themselves into the next high stakes play.

This said... the difference between the clutch player who throws a TD to the tightly covered player and the guy who throws a pick to end the game probably has a much to do with his teammates than anything else.

Blurry answer? probably...

 

[SF Dolphin Fan]

I think it's mostly myth... I've always thought that QBs get too much acclaim when their teams are good and too much blame when their teams are bad.

I think it's more of a team thing.

 

[JamesWsenior]

Tiger Woods in his prime was clutch. Lots (ok maybe not tons) with similar talent didn't step up and he did.

QBs. Some are naturally more talented than others but many times the ones with the bigger will to win, just do it. That being said, an awesome front 4 can take a lot out of the clutch..see last Superbowl.

Soccer has many examples too. Messi, Ronaldo etc.