Jaylen Waddle ?

[macd123]

Back in the day, before money ruined baseball... I was a serious Reds fan. They had a player named Eric Davis. He might have been the most talented player I'd ever seen... Home Runs AND stolen bases... good defense too! But he was always... always battling hamstring issues. If he'd been sturdy, he's been one of the best players of all times, but he just wasn't. A broken bone or two, and he'd been fine, but his body betrayed him... injury prone doesn't even begin to describe Eric Davis... or Yatil Green...

Moore scares me... the same way that Tua does, and for the same reason. I'm just not convinced that either is structurally sound. If he's good, look out, but it might be a short ride.

Yup, I'm nervous about Sunday, and with Tua it will be like that for a while.

 

[Lovethefish]

I don’t have an issue with it. Kickoff returns and special teams plays count too. If Saban didn’t use some of his elite players in that role then Alabama doesn’t win the national championship the year Kenyan Drake won it against Clemson with a kickoff return TD.

Furthermore, you obviously don’t understand how bad Alabama’s punting situation is and how important field position and doing whatever you can to flip the field are.

If Waddle returns it for a TD then you’re all in here talking about how great of a play it was and how high he’s going to be drafted. He could’ve gotten hurt on any play.

Bottom line is if you can do a better job than Nick Saban, Alabama will make it worth your while I guarantee it.

Your last 2 paragraphs are just filler.
1. I don’t think he should be returning kicks.
2. There is no one in the world more capable than Nick Saban as a HC. So that means he can never be wrong and no can ever comment. Got it.

 

[BigNastyFish]

I don’t have an issue with it. Kickoff returns and special teams plays count too. If Saban didn’t use some of his elite players in that role then Alabama doesn’t win the national championship the year Kenyan Drake won it against Clemson with a kickoff return TD.

Furthermore, you obviously don’t understand how bad Alabama’s punting situation is and how important field position and doing whatever you can to flip the field are.

If Waddle returns it for a TD then you’re all in here talking about how great of a play it was and how high he’s going to be drafted. He could’ve gotten hurt on any play.

Bottom line is if you can do a better job than Nick Saban, Alabama will make it worth your while I guarantee it.

The standard issue reply to a player injured on teams is always the same -- "shouldn't be out there."
We heard it last year with Williams. But I'd be willing to bet the coaches are fully aware of the risks
that apply to every play on the field. And I guess you can try and "hide" your best players or
give 'em more at bats.

In terms of college and specifically Waddle. I'd assume these kids covet the "special jobs" where
they can make more impact plays and have a bigger stage to shine. All that factors into perceived
value on draft day -- and ultimately money in the bank.

Bottom line the ONLY way to completely eliminate risk in football is to not play. Conversely, the more
you play the more you subject yourself to risk.

 

[jimthefin]

I am not going to judge a decision like that with hindsight, it isn't fair.


Personally, I would save using important starters on kick returns for big moments in big games due to the risk, but Saban has certainly earned enough credibility to do it his way.

I also have no doubt that Waddle wanted to be out there.

We just had Philly lose DeSean Jackson on a punt return he volunteered to be out there for.

 

[EJay]

1. I don’t think he should be returning kicks.
2. There is no one in the world more capable than Nick Saban as a HC. So that means he can never be wrong and no can ever comment. Got it.

Maybe, just maybe .. what you think is wrong. Just an idea.

I’ll side with Saban‘s decision making over yours.

Every decision that doesn’t work is wrong. Too bad we all can’t have the gift of hindsight before we make those decisions.

Fact is, coaches like Saban and those like him seem to make the right decisions a vast majority of the time.

 

[EJay]

I have an issue using a top 10 draft eligible kid- essentially WR1 in the country- as a KR.
The argument “he has done for 3 years” doesn’t hold water for me. The argument- injuries can happen anywhere on the field - there is waste to minimIe risk.
Keep it for the 1st & 2nds, once you are JR - you’ve paid your dues.
He will never return a Kick at the next level.

Good thing for the likes of Charles Woodson, Devin Hester and Deion Sanders you never were their coach in college or the NFL. Those guys made a lot of game changing plays for their teams returning kicks and even playing a little offense.

To each their own. Your issues surely aren’t everyones issues.

Saban’s surely won enough to validate his way of doing things.

 

[Cheetah]

Good thing for the likes of Charles Woodson, Devin Hester and Deion Sanders you never were their coach in college or the NFL. Those guys made a lot of game changing plays for their teams returning kicks and even playing a little offense.

To each their own. Your issues surely aren’t everyones issues.

Saban’s surely won enough to validate his way of doing things.

I really hadn’t looked at it like that. Good point, Deion definitely affected a lot of games with his return work.

 

[EJay]

I don’t have an issue with it. Kickoff returns and special teams plays count too. If Saban didn’t use some of his elite players in that role then Alabama doesn’t win the national championship the year Kenyan Drake won it against Clemson with a kickoff return TD.

And Green Bay may not have won a SB during Favre's tenure if Desmond Howard wasn't returning kicks.

This is actually a comical topic to me from the standpoint that coaches, at all levels, have been using star players in the return game pretty much throughout the history of the game. More coaches do it than don't.

Reggie Bush was one of the most dynamic and important offensive players of the new millennium and he returned kicks for Pete Carroll. Just a couple seasons back, Saquon Barkley was returning kicks for James Franklin. Ted Ginn Jr. returned for Jim Tressell. The list is long.

If someone wanted to dig through the numbers of say the past 50 years and total up all the star players that returned kicks for their teams and compare the amount of success stories vs. the amount of injuries like that which just happened to Waddle, they're gonna find overwhelming evidence pointing to it being a wise decision for coaches to make.

That's precisely why championship level coaches like Nick Saban choose to do it.

Pointing to a couple outlier situations where it turned out badly is just a ridiculous way to look at it.

 

[Lovethefish]

You guys are changing the discussion.

Good thing for the likes of Charles Woodson, Devin Hester and Deion Sanders you never were their coach in college or the NFL. Those guys made a lot of game changing plays for their teams returning kicks and even playing a little offense.

To each their own. Your issues surely aren’t everyones issues.

Saban’s surely won enough to validate his way of doing things.

Changing the discussion here.
Talking about a top 10 JR eligible pick playing minor league Football.
NFL is a different story.
They are professionals and get paid to do a job.
But there is nothing wrong with differing opinions, if we all agreed not much to talk about.

 

[Lovethefish]

Maybe, just maybe .. what you think is wrong. Just an idea.

I’ll side with Saban‘s decision making over yours.

Every decision that doesn’t work is wrong. Too bad we all can’t have the gift of hindsight before we make those decisions.

Fact is, coaches like Saban and those like him seem to make the right decisions a vast majority of the time.

Your comment that “maybe what I think is wrong - is wrong” is pretty absurd.

Of course my opinion might be wrong. Anyone who claims they have all the right answers on some a forum is living in a fantasy world.
BUT.. but my opinion here its not clearly wrong- it can be right.
Ultimately it’s an opinion.
Of course most of Sabon’s decisions are correct. He’s the best college football coach in the country. But he can wrong here.

With regards to other examples - Changing the discussion here.
I’m talking about a top 10 JR eligible pick playing minor league Football.
NFL is a different story.
They are professionals and get paid to do a job.
But there is nothing wrong with differing opinions, if we all agreed not much to talk about. .

 

[A1.]

More times than not consistent ham string issues are a sign of poor training and body maintenance. It takes a dedication to the craft and the rehab room/weight room to strengthen their core, leg stability and back to get right.

So character and love for the game are something that a player w/ lower body injuries like that must possess.

you’re seeing it w/ DVP over the last few years. He didn’t love the process or the gym. Lower body injuries plagued him and almost ruined his career. He made a change and you saw it last year. It’s challenging him this year, if he stays on the path he’ll be fine. But it’s a full time job fixing and maintaining lower body health.

Julio is a prime example. He has a new lower body injury every week as they all linger. He has for years. He’s a true professional and his work ethic is why he’s still elite and even available so often.

 

[macd123]

Mostly true what all you wrote here. Although Waddle is a different cat. He’s not just a speed guy like Ruggs. Waddle is different.

I can’t think of any receiver that entered the league with worse hamstrings than Isaac Bruce. A few changes (and prayer if you believe in it like Bruce) and things like that can easily be overcome. That Rondale Moore is a player too now.

I wonder who Tua would prefer out of Waddle and Smith. I know GMs will see Waddle as having a higher ceiling, but apart from speed is there any other category you would say Waddle is better than Devonta Smith? Tua´s accuracy with Smith's hands would be incredible, plus his character fits exactly what Flores is after. It would be a nice choice to have to make tbf.

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

I wonder who Tua would prefer out of Waddle and Smith. I know GMs will see Waddle as having a higher ceiling, but apart from speed is there any other category you would say Waddle is better than Devonta Smith? Tua´s accuracy with Smith's hands would be incredible, plus his character fits exactly what Flores is after. It would be a nice choice to have to make tbf.

Tua and Smitty developed chemistry together early when they both got on campus while Waddle was still in high school. The only real difference between Waddle and Smitty is the special teams return boost that Waddle provides.

In terms of hands, route running and body control, there is nobody better than the Golden Gazelle - DaVonta Silky Smooth Smith. We actually had him playing DB some in camp before the season in case of emergency. He’d be an elite DB also if he was on that side of the ball.

It’s difficult to really grasp how good and how important both of em are to the program. They are elite young people. Two of my favorites that have ever worn the uniform.

 

[EJay]

I’ve been on the Devonta Smith bandwagon since last season. Been touting him as a potential Fins draft pick for over a year. Waddle has been gaining steam among many Dolphins fans. I don’t dismiss that choice either. Love Waddle too.

But there’s just something about Devonta Smith to me. I’d love to have him.

 

[macd123]

I’ve been on the Devonta Smith bandwagon since last season. Been touting him as a potential Fins draft pick for over a year. Waddle has been gaining steam among many Dolphins fans. I don’t dismiss that choice either. Love Waddle too.

But there’s just something about Devonta Smith to me. I’d love to have him.

He creates separation and catches everything so he's an instant upgrade.