Lets Come Down From The Clouds On Minkah | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Lets Come Down From The Clouds On Minkah

Phinfan31

Phinfan31

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Alright so were all pretty stoked on this kid, right?

He has the physical tools. He has the brains. He has the will. He has the highlights. He also has the respect from a man that few have ever received. He could be a hall of fame level talent one day.

That being said...lets fall back to earth a bit and realize that few players ever reach that ELITE status. So lets pick him a part a little bit. Lets get negative (yes, I know we've enjoyed the lack of negativity around here lately) but lets compile any footage of this kid that raises an eyebrow and discuss it.



Watch these highlights of the National Championship game. I can't blame the kid for the Bulldogs literally going the opposite way of him on every single play...I mean that is a huge positive, right?

But what I do know, and what really concerns me, is that he is going 50% or less on wayyyy too many of these plays. The plays I'm referring to begin after 1:20 in the video. On many plays he is stopping before the whistle. On many plays he expects his teammates to make the play. This is troubling to me. This was the National Championship. Where is the energy?

No HOF'er takes a play off. No Dolphins Great ever took a play off. Did Jason Taylor? Did Zach Thomas?

I don't like what I see in this tape. I invite you all to find more videos (e.g. blown assignments, getting out played physically, etc.) and lets continue this discussion beyond my video. I know it isn't a popular thing to do, but I want to know this kids weaknesses. I want to know what to look for when the season begins.
 
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If this is the tape you are going to use to demonstrate Fitzpatrick's negatives, than you might as well put him in the Hall of Fame right now. The only slightly negative play I saw on there was when a running back got outside on a running play and he had a bad angle, the running back was already past him so he let up. Other than that I see a kid who lined up all over the field, who stuck his nose in on running plays at him, blitzed from different areas of the field, and played the most sound assignment football I have ever seen from a prospect drafted by the Dolphins. I don't know how much more you could ask from the kid.
 
rickd13 said:
If this is the tape you are going to use to demonstrate Fitzpatrick's negatives, than you might as well put him in the Hall of Fame right now. The only slightly negative play I saw on there was when a running back got outside on a running play and he had a bad angle, the running back was already past him so he let up. Other than that I see a kid who lined up all over the field, who stuck his nose in on running plays at him, blitzed from different areas of the field, and played the most sound assignment football I have ever seen from a prospect drafted by the Dolphins. I don't know how much more you could ask from the kid.
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Noted. But you didn't address my concerns? And I might add that many other people (non-biased/non-Phins fans) had the same feelings as me in the comments on that video. There was definitely a few plays where he could have contributed and didn't make the effort. He was literally jogging. What if his teammate missed the tackle?

I know this tape doesn't demonstrate mental errors, etc. which is why I invite anyone else to contribute. Lets hunt down that footage together.

I figured a good way to kick this thread off would be a discussion about his energy and effort on plays he might not be in the heat of. I think this is an essential attribute at the next level. WR's are notorious for taking plays off, and this reminds me of that. While I think it would be unfair to say hes "taking plays off" here, his intensity is concerning nonetheless. This is the National Championship.
 
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...but I like it up here.

I get what you’re doing, but I feel this borders on pessimism for the sake of pessimism. A few thoughts:

1) I watched that, and there were two plays I really disliked. The one on the Michel end run I remember watching live, and going, “Dude, come on.”

2) This clip didn’t discourage me; it did the opposite. Are there plays where Fitzpatrick stops running full-tilt before the whistle? Sure. But the plays (with the exception of a couple) were well away from him. There’s a line between “high motor” and “playing like a lunatic and ramming into a pile every single play.” The latter gets you personal fouls. What I really liked was watching Fitz’s anticipation in passing lanes. There are at least two times where he baits Fromm, and to his credit, Fromm sees him doing it, and doesn’t take the bait. Fitz is almost always in the right position.

3) The thing about reminiscing is that it’s selective. Zach and JT are legends, and legends don’t tarnish easily. But I find it difficult to believe they never, ever did the equivalent of what Fitzpatrick did here. The thing is, we have so many more camera angles today than we did during Zach and JT’s college years, so a direct comparison is impossible.

4) Man, is Fromm impressive.
 
You know that scene in the original Incredibles where the teacher takes the video of Dash putting the thumbtack on the teacher's chair...

tenor.gif


I'm not even sure what you are referring to, watching the video (and maybe one of the bama guys can correct me on this), but it seems like the Bama player are coached to not pile on. Meaning when you see Minkah slow down, the player is in the process of being taken to the ground, jumping in there at the last second will only lead to a potential penalty.

Watching through full games I see one of the most sound players to come out in the last 5 or so years.
 
I have watched and read just about everything on him and he was my top choice throughout and am thrilled we got him. With that said, I have seen that tape before and it’s not good. There are multiple instances there of him appearing to hold back or give up too early. He also gave a huge cushion in coverage and I had wondered if he was not playing at full strength.

The good news is that I had not seen those traits in anything else I have seen on him and I do believe he is a big time player in our defensive backfield for years to come.
 
I'll take that kind of game from him. but you are correct he did slow up some when he thought that his teammates had the guy instead of playing til the whistle blew. but I don't see it on 50% of the plays. Bakers game footage was a 100 times worse when you look at not going 100% every play. if we're playing him at FS though id assume watch film from 2016 tho
 
Phinfan31 said:
Alright so were all pretty stoked on this kid, right?

He has the physical tools. He has the brains. He has the will. He has the highlights. He also has the respect from a man that few have ever received. He could be a hall of fame level talent one day.

That being said...lets fall back to earth a bit and realize that few players ever reach that ELITE status. So lets pick him a part a little bit. Lets get negative (yes, I know we've enjoyed the lack of negativity around here lately) but lets compile any footage of this kid that raises an eyebrow and discuss it.



Watch these highlights of the National Championship game. I can't blame the kid for the Bulldogs literally going the opposite way of him on every single play...I mean that is a huge positive, right?

But what I do know, and what really concerns me, is that he is going 50% or less on wayyyy too many of these plays. The plays I'm referring to begin after 1:20 in the video. On many plays he is stopping before the whistle. On many plays he expects his teammates to make the play. This is troubling to me. This was the National Championship. Where is the energy?

No HOF'er takes a play off. No Dolphins Great ever took a play off. Did Jason Taylor? Did Zach Thomas?

I don't like what I see in this tape. I invite you all to find more videos (e.g. blown assignments, getting out played physically, etc.) and lets continue this discussion beyond my video. I know it isn't a popular thing to do, but I want to know this kids weaknesses. I want to know what to look for when the season begins.
Click to expand...


I get what you're doing . . . the reverse of highlight reels. And I agree to an extent. Highlight reels can make Pat White look like a potential GOAT. And I agree it is common for fans to project a rookie as god-like. With that as preface, none of the projections look unreasonable (sans HOF). Given the talent and dedication, seeing a quality starter is within reason.

No offense, but, yes, all humans take plays off. The question is how many. We don't know. How many ended up allowing a big play? Again, we don't know. I DO like what I see on tape . . . in it's entirety. I'm not going by highlight reels, good OR bad.
 
Using FH as a pathological petri dish , I have come to realize that for every 7-8 members out of 10 who see the glass as "half full" the rest see that same glass as at best 2/3rds empty. I've also come to realize that in many cases it's a hard-wired predisposition or default mindset one reverts back to when fatigued from operating against their grain- and likely not their fault. Personally I couldn't live surrounded by perceived negativity, but that's just me.

Let me put the OP's mind to rest here. The likelihood that Fitz is who we see him as is better than 99%. We don't need to trust our own perceptions, our "fandom" which really is defined by enthusiastic hope. Instead, we should trust the SOB most of us Fins Fans have come to detest: Nick Saban. Say what you will about him, there is no denying that as an anal perfectionist, he makes Philbin look loosey-goosey. The big difference is that unlike Philbin, he translates those demanding qualities in ultimate successes.

So if I tell you that Fitz's teammates referred to him as "Saban's son;" that Fitz was the only player invited into coaches strategy meetings; that Saban has actually said thinking about Minkah makes him feel good and that he's one of his all-time favorite players, if not his all time favorite among the legendary Bama rosters, that really should be ALL you need to know vs a few plays that can be interpreted different ways on one ****ing tape!!!!!

There are so many others to focus hard-wired negativity on; let's not besmirch the best draft pick, (someone who's Mike Mayock's 5th ranked players higher than James & Edmund) we've lucked into in many years even before he takes the field ferchrissake!!!!!!!
 
College players are drafted on what they can do, any negatives and there always are are for the respective coaching staff to improve on. At worse his floor is a Chris Clemons with ball skills while the sky is pretty much the upper limit.
 
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