Merged x4: mcnair and law to Miami.. | Page 12 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Merged x4: mcnair and law to Miami..

marino2duper73 said:
I'm simply pointing out that DW wasn't even a serviceable quarterback, he was good becasue his cast around him made him good. Gus isn't as bad as everyone thiinks. I agree he isn't our next Dan Marino, no one will ever be...But I don't remember anyone complaining about Gus when he was having success. Only when he had failure. I say give Gus a break, bring in a vet to COMPETE for the starting job, and draft a future QB. If a QB is all we need to get to a Super Bowl, we would have made the playoffs last year without one. think about it.

Woodley's flaws were also exposed in one of the worst performances by a QB in Super Bowl history, which is why Shula didn't hesitate in drafting Marino when he was still on the board. I don't know about you, but I don't just want to go to a Super Bowl. I want to win it.

But to reference your last sentence "If a QB is all we need to get to a Super Bowl, we would have made the playoffs last year without one", think about this- If we do manage to upgrade other positions to the point where we would be a legitimate SB contender, which isn't impossible in one off-season, would you really want someone like an inconsistant Frerotte manning the position when the stakes are the highest?
 
nopony said:
Ok… as promised...

Gus played in 16 games for us last year.

In one of them (San Diego) he was fantastic, just really great. In three more (Denver, Oakland and 2nd NE game) he was really good.

So that’s four. In ONE game he was on the good side of average (1st NE game).

So that’s five games total where he was either the good side of average or better.

Here are the bare bones of the other ELEVEN games:

20-43 for 177 yds. 46.5% comp! 1 td, 1 int. 56.1 rating.

14-33 for 171 yds. 42.4% comp! 2 tds, 1 int, 66.6 rating (satan!)

21-33 for 226 yds. 63.6% comp. 2 tds, 3 ints. 66.0 rating.

21-43 for 267 yds. 48.8% comp. 0 tds, 0 ints.. 68.7 rating.

11-29 for 125 yds. 37.9% comp! 0 tds, 1 int.. 37.3 rating. Ouch.

16-28 for 168 yds. 57.1% comp. 1 td, 1 int. 71.7 rating. :shakeno:


IT WAS HIS FIRST YEAR!
Look at his #'s the last half of the season. The QB has 10 other guys on the field dropping passes and missing blocks, so please......give the guy the credit he deserves. He didnt throw away games either. Im not saying hes the best option, yet I will say it was an improvment over feeley and fiedler. Note: we wouldnt have won six in a row without him either. Sage wouldnt have done that.
No matter what QB we have someones going to cry. They complained about Marino not being able to run.Blah Blah Blah.........

I like the Idea of Mcnair coming, but hes gat to learn a new system. If it came down to a tie between Mcnair and Ferrotte, I go with the guy that knows the system.
 
IT WAS HIS FIRST YEAR!

It was his, what, TWELTH year in the NFL. His THIRD year in the system. You really, really think that new teammates means you have to suck the first year? So completely and totally untrue.

It's not like Gus was always good and suddenly was bad last year. His career averages, even including his prime and barely better than what he did last year. There is no reason on earth to think he's suddenly going to get better at 34. He's just not any good.

Look at his #'s the last half of the season.

Ok. In the last six games everyone likes to talk about Gus had THREE terrible ones. Those last four games i listed? Yeah, all took place in the last seven games of the season.

The QB has 10 other guys on the field dropping passes and missing blocks, so please......give the guy the credit he deserves. He didnt throw away games either. Im not saying hes the best option, yet I will say it was an improvment over feeley and fiedler. Note: we wouldnt have won six in a row without him either. Sage wouldnt have done that.

Gus gets so much more credit than he deserves it's not funny. YEah, Gus has sucked for 12 years because people drop his passes.:shakeno:

And, by the way, when you have eight awful games in one season, you ARE throwing away games.

No matter what QB we have someones going to cry. They complained about Marino not being able to run.Blah Blah Blah.........

:shakeno:

I never complained about Marino. What's your point? That any criticism of any player is unacceptable? Please.

I like the Idea of Mcnair coming, but hes gat to learn a new system. If it came down to a tie between Mcnair and Ferrotte, I go with the guy that knows the system.

Any quarterback worth anything can learn a system. Zach and Jason learned a new and FAR more complicated system this offseason... and they did ok, didn't they?

People keep talking about the system as if that actually means something. You know what matters far, far more than the system? Talent.

After all, Gus knew the system and he was one of the worst qbs in football. Fiedler knew the system, and look where that got us.
 
Dolphins12thMan said:
Can somebody tell me how long McNair has been with his current OC? Or how many OCs he has had in his carrer. I am all for an upgrade, which I think a McNair would be, as you can see my only concern is a vet coming in and learning a new system. Now I know Gus has to start over with OC MM, but at least he is familiar with the team. Any thoughts and answers would be appreciated.


McNair was in first year with new OC Norm Chow and performed better than Frerrotte running Linehan's system from the last 3 years. Don't know how similar Linehan's system is too Mularkeys, or Chows is to Mularkey's so either or both could be learning a complete new offensive system in 2006 in Miami.

As for McNair's injury history, not certain why other posters that are mentioning this would still want Law. Bot have missed 10 games over the last 3 years. And the previous 6 years from when McNair became a full time starter Law missed 4 games compared to Mcnair's 6 games(EDIT: 5 starts for Law, 9 for McNair). They both appear to be recovered from the injury that cost them the most time at any time in their respective careers in 2004. But I'm sure before we'd sign either our doctors will be checking them over big time.

Saban's stated any position is subject to upgrade. McNair is a big uprade in talent over Frerotte. I would like to see him starting in Miami over Frerotte or any other current free agent QBs including Kitna. That being said, don't think we'll get him because don't think Saban will match other offers. Think he'll end up in Arizona if he doesn't stay in Tennessee. Denny likes veteran QBs and has had success Moon, Cunningham, George, and even some with Warner last year. If Titans get the same as Jacksonville did for Brunnell, a 3rd for McNair from the Cardinals helps Miami by removing (most likely) Cards from spending a 1rst or 2nd round pick on a QB.

Law would also be an upgrade at CB over Madison in Saban's system. But no way is Saban paying a 32 year old CB anything close to the 10 million bonus he wants. But someone probably will, maybe the Giants.
 
G-Force said:
Yeah Mcnair looked great in the probowl especially since the D can't blitz. I would make him the highest paid qb for the next 6 years and cut Sam , Zach and not resign anyone or worry about any FA's as long as the great Mcnair can lead us like he did the AFC. Man the way Steve has played the last 20 years I would even trade Ricky and Ronnie to make sure no body takes the ball from his hands.


Nice sarcasm, but I don't think anyone has stated that McNair is the best QB in the league or that he is the single and only savior for us to win.

The guy isn't even availiable for us to sign, if we even wanted him now. It is possible he could be cut in a few weeks. If he is cut he is a very good option at QB. Hopefully we will not make him the highest paid QB either, maybe little better then the deal we gave Gus might do it =)

Ohh and the probowl is not the tape most people study when they are looking for FA pickups. McNair was on the shortest amount of practice time of anyone I believe, and I am not sure any QB had a stellar performance.

McNair probably will not be availiable anyways so this is a mute point =)
 
Eshlemon said:
McNair was in first year with new OC Norm Chow and performed better than Frerrotte running Linehan's system from the last 3 years. Don't know how similar Linehan's system is too Mularkeys, or Chows is to Mularkey's so either or both could be learning a complete new offensive system in 2006 in Miami.

As for McNair's injury history, not certain why other posters that are mentioning this would still want Law. Bot have missed 10 games over the last 3 years. And the previous 6 years from when McNair became a full time starter Law missed 4 games compared to Mcnair's 6 games. They both appear to be recovered from the injury that cost them the most time at any time in their respective careers in 2004. But I'm sure before we'd sign either our doctors will be checking them over big time.

Saban's stated any position is subject to upgrade. McNair is a big uprade in talent over Frerotte. I would like to see him starting in Miami over Frerotte or any other current free agent QBs including Kitna. That being said, don't think we'll get him because don't think Saban will match other offers. Think he'll end up in Arizona if he doesn't stay in Tennessee. Denny likes veteran QBs and has had success Moon, Cunningham, George, and even some with Warner last year. If Titans get the same as Jacksonville did for Brunnell, a 3rd for McNair from the Cardinals helps Miami by removing (most likely) Cards from spending a 1rst or 2nd round pick on a QB.

Law would also be an upgrade at CB over Madison in Saban's system. But no way is Saban paying a 32 year old CB anything close to the 10 million bonus he wants. But someone probably will, maybe the Giants.


^
Yea that.... also McNair won't be going anywhere...IMHO
 
I'm curious as to how a bunch of fans who practically wanted to run Jay Fiedler out of town like he was Frankenstein's monster are suddenly embracing Gus Frerotte?

If you look at QB rating, Jay eclipsed Gus's ratings in every year except his last one. A few of those seasons it wasn't all that close. Subjective nuance aside, stats are stats, and in this case the best measurement of performance.

Is it because the perception of a team on the upswing beats the perception of a team spinning its wheels?

Does winning 6 in a row, in whatever method, make people look at things much more optimistically (and perhaps falsely) than when we were in the midst of our late season swoons?
 
PhinGeneral said:
I'm curious as to how a bunch of fans who practically wanted to run Jay Fiedler out of town like he was Frankenstein's monster are suddenly embracing Gus Frerotte?

If you look at QB rating, Jay eclipsed Gus's ratings in every year except his last one. A few of those seasons it wasn't all that close. Subjective nuance aside, stats are stats, and in this case the best measurement of performance.

Is it because the perception of a team on the upswing beats the perception of a team spinning its wheels?

Does winning 6 in a row, in whatever method, make people look at things much more optimistically (and perhaps falsely) than when we were in the midst of our late season swoons?

Exactly.

In all seriousness, the guy Gus needs to get down on his hands and knees and thank is Sage.

The only reason so many people seem to think Gus is ok is that Sage came in and won two games. If Sage hadn't done that, we finish at 7-9 and everybody is very clear on how bad Gus is. Instead we finish at 9-7 and everybody is so happy with Saban that they are giving Gus credit he in no way earned.
 
No way do you sign McNair!! The guy is about done. If you sign any free agent QB...you sign Drew Brees:dolphins:
 
nopony said:
Exactly.

In all seriousness, the guy Gus needs to get down on his hands and knees and thank is Sage.

The only reason so many people seem to think Gus is ok is that Sage came in and won two games. If Sage hadn't done that, we finish at 7-9 and everybody is very clear on how bad Gus is. Instead we finish at 9-7 and everybody is so happy with Saban that they are giving Gus credit he in no way earned.


Agree wholeheartedly...seems that because Gus didn't throw any pick-6's, he's "Brett-Favre" like...and probably the next biggest difference that Gus had was that when he faultered, he had a backup come in and win the game for him rather than the assorted goofs that Wanny sent in to bail Ears out...
 
I believe McNair would be an upgrade over what we have now..
We would need to draft a youngster, no doubt, and I am sure Saban knows this as well.... that is a no brainer.

I would love to see us nab McNair - yes, hes not the 1999 McNair, but nevertheless, hes a solid passer, has a lot of heart, is tough, and has a better arm than what we have now.

Saban plans for the longterm, as we've seen, and we will nab a youngster...have you guys not thought about the value of McNair as a mentor? That just adds to his stock really....

I would love to see McNair stop by for a year, while we groom our next qb.

And as for TyLaw, If he plays for "peanuts,' then hell yea. Ty Law, Will Poole, Travis Daniels... and of course, Reggie "da man" howards... (jk), that sounds like a deep, excellent line up.
 
McNair and Law are dinosaurs. I want no part of either one of them....

Saban would be making a huge mistake if he expects McNair to come in here and be an upgrade over Frerotte. We can do much better than McNair. Hell, I'd rather see Saban give Rosenfels another shot before letting some has been like McNair come in here....

The bottom line is this. We already have an experienced veteran QB in Frerotte. We don't need another one. Especially someone as medicore as McNair. He's just simply not an upgrade at this stage. There's nothing McNair does that Frerotte can't do, so I don't see the point in adding him....

PHINZ RULE!!!
 
BLITZKRIEG said:
McNair and Law are dinosaurs. I want no part of either one of them....

Saban would be making a huge mistake if he expects McNair to come in here and be an upgrade over Frerotte. We can do much better than McNair. Hell, I'd rather see Saban give Rosenfels another shot before letting some has been like McNair come in here....

The bottom line is this. We already have an experienced veteran QB in Frerotte. We don't need another one. Especially someone as medicore as McNair. He's just simply not an upgrade at this stage. There's nothing McNair does that Frerotte can't do, so I don't see the point in adding him....

PHINZ RULE!!!

McNair is a much more talented QB than Frerotte. If McNair is mediocre then Frerotte should be a backup in the Arena League. The only knock on McNair is his medical situation. One ankle has had 3 surgeries and the sternum injury from 2004 that caused him to miss almost as many starts (8) as his previous 7 years (9). Any team will have their doctors evaluate these fully before signing McNair. And hopefully we keep Frerotte (assuming he restructures) until the draft and beyond depending on if/when we can draft a QB Saban is comfortable as #2 QB.
 
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