No illusions... Not there yet.

[Kamelion4291]

Everything was just really, really hard on offense. Not a single player that could make a guy miss, break a tackle, and go 60 yards for a TD on the entire roster. Every throw is caught and the guy is immediately down if the ball is even caught at all in the first place. I can't even tell you how many times we have WRs JUMP a foot or two just so the ball hits them in the chest which absolutely removes any possible YAC because they don't trust their own hands (looking at you Grant and Bowden).

We did as well as we could do considering what we had and that is an indictment on the coaching staff. I mean there are a lot of anti-Gailey people, but with objectively the worst weapons in the NFL, a bottom 10 Oline, no consistent running game to speak of, a journeyman QB and a rookie QB, it's a miracle we could drive the length of the field to score at all.

 

[fansinceGWilson]

First I think the Dolphins needs to figure out what the abberation was. The defense's play most of the season, or the defenses play today? If it turns out the D is fine and this was just a historically bad game, I think the Dolphin's next problem is do they actually have a QB or not? How many times have my team (Bills) and yours thought they had their guy, only for it to all be an illusion? Are you really sold that Tua is going to slot into a group that includes (playoff Qbs this year) Rogers, Russ, Goff, Brees, Brady, Allen, Mahomes, Lamar, Tannehill, Big Ben, Baker, Rivers? Or is he going to be more of a Trubisky or 2020 Alex Smith that can maybe not get in the rest of the team's way if they have a good season and back into the playoffs? I'm not taking a position one way or another, you all watch him more, but have you seen or believe Tua can display the ability of that first group of QBs? If not, then you don't really have your guy.

Just from watching the game, the D seemed on point early, but faded. Tired? Lost emotion? No idea, But the 2Q D was vastly different from the D the rest of the game.

As for TT, no one knows how he'll turn out. Will it be the 'bust' group (I think not) of the 'savoir' group? Fans saw enough of the 'good' and 'bad' TT this season to point out reasons for their opinions. Personally, I think he'll be average at worst and could be very good. It seems the most vocal are on the extremes.

Realistically, I'm confident Flo and staff understand TT often didn't play well AND he didn't have many weapons. I expect them to view the off-season and camp to raise his level of play and confidence. I can NOT envision them giving up on a player with such natural talent, PARTICULARLY to the point of wasting a #1 on another QB

 

[Mach2]

Just from watching the game, the D seemed on point early, but faded. Tired? Lost emotion? No idea, But the 2Q D was vastly different from the D the rest of the game.

As for TT, no one knows how he'll turn out. Will it be the 'bust' group (I think not) of the 'savoir' group? Fans saw enough of the 'good' and 'bad' TT this season to point out reasons for their opinions. Personally, I think he'll be average at worst and could be very good. It seems the most vocal are on the extremes.

Realistically, I'm confident Flo and staff understand TT often didn't play well AND he didn't have many weapons. I expect them to view the off-season and camp to raise his level of play and confidence. I can NOT envision them giving up on a player with such natural talent, PARTICULARLY to the point of wasting a #1 on another QB

I doubt they "give up", and I'm not in favor of cutting or trading him either.

I have to ask, though. What are these "natural talents" of which you speak? Haven't seen exceptional accuracy. Haven't seen exceptional read/processing. Haven't seen exceptional pocket awareness.

Are you talking about "intangibles", or what?

 

[Kamelion4291]

I doubt they "give up", and I'm not in favor of cutting or trading him either.

I have to ask, though. What are these "natural talents" of which you speak? Haven't seen exceptional accuracy. Haven't seen exceptional read/processing. Haven't seen exceptional pocket awareness.

Are you talking about "intangibles", or what?

I have to ask, were you expecting to see exceptional read/processing as a rookie? Do you expect that from any rookie QB ever?

 

[Mach2]

I have to ask, were you expecting to see exceptional read/processing as a rookie? Do you expect that from any rookie QB ever?

I didn't expect it, but he wasn't my choice to begin with. We were told he was head and shoulders above other prospects, when it came to the mental aspects. As it turns out, that may not be true.

Given his lack of physical attributes, he is going to have to rely on reads and processing.

If he isn't better than your average rookie in this regard, then yes, I'm dissapointed.

I'm just not seeing elite, and don't want all our eggs in this one basket.

Why some find this threatening, i have no idea.

 

[Brasfin]

I didn't expect it, but he wasn't my choice to begin with. We were told he was head and shoulders above other prospects, when it came to the mental aspects. As it turns out, that may not be true.

Given his lack of physical attributes, he is going to have to rely on reads and processing.

If he isn't better than your average rookie in this regard, then yes, I'm dissapointed.

I'm just not seeing elite, and don't want all our eggs in this one basket.

Why some find this threatening, i have no idea.

Tua was my choice from the beginning, was ecstatic about drafting him. But I can’t disagree with what you’ve said here, unfortunately.

 

[fansinceGWilson]

I doubt they "give up", and I'm not in favor of cutting or trading him either.

I have to ask, though. What are these "natural talents" of which you speak? Haven't seen exceptional accuracy. Haven't seen exceptional read/processing. Haven't seen exceptional pocket awareness.

Are you talking about "intangibles", or what?

Physical tools, based on college film and the occasional streak he'd have in games. What I saw in his NFL games was inconsistency and what appeared to be some uncertainty/confidence. Both of those are fixable. WILL they be fixed is a separate question.

 

[Kebo]

Tua was my choice. No way to say what he will be yet. In college he had guys wide open. The NFL is different. Plus we had the worst receivers in the league. Tua gets some of the blame, but he needs at least one true #1 WR before I can really evaluate him in the NFL.

 

[ChitownPhins28]

First I think the Dolphins needs to figure out what the abberation was. The defense's play most of the season, or the defenses play today? If it turns out the D is fine and this was just a historically bad game, I think the Dolphin's next problem is do they actually have a QB or not? How many times have my team (Bills) and yours thought they had their guy, only for it to all be an illusion? Are you really sold that Tua is going to slot into a group that includes (playoff Qbs this year) Rogers, Russ, Goff, Brees, Brady, Allen, Mahomes, Lamar, Tannehill, Big Ben, Baker, Rivers? Or is he going to be more of a Trubisky or 2020 Alex Smith that can maybe not get in the rest of the team's way if they have a good season and back into the playoffs? I'm not taking a position one way or another, you all watch him more, but have you seen or believe Tua can display the ability of that first group of QBs? If not, then you don't really have your guy.

There's no abhorration. Dolphins have some good players and some not-so-good players and often good scheming to accentuate the positives and minimize the negatives. There's no pass rusher on this roster who can quickly beat his OL-opponent and get to the QB, no true FS with speed to bail out a CB deep, no great all-purpose LB.

Nobody has even discussed Shaq Lawson being out the last 2 weeks. He seemed helpful and was probably missed but apparently wasn't missed by fans. So, he's JAG and could potentially be improved upon.
Then, it might be nice to have another disruptive force in the interior D-line. Maybe the guys we have keep improving. That Seiler kid certainly has potential. Im bummed that the one kid we drafted in 2020 got cut. He seemed to have something extra in his college tape.

 

[Kamelion4291]

I didn't expect it, but he wasn't my choice to begin with. We were told he was head and shoulders above other prospects, when it came to the mental aspects. As it turns out, that may not be true.

Given his lack of physical attributes, he is going to have to rely on reads and processing.

If he isn't better than your average rookie in this regard, then yes, I'm dissapointed.

I'm just not seeing elite, and don't want all our eggs in this one basket.

Why some find this threatening, i have no idea.

He was being compared to Burrow, Herbert, Love, and Hurts. Yes, he is above the others when it comes to the mental aspects. Even on that back shoulder throw to Parker yesterday he looked off the safety before he threw it. Those aren't normal things that rookies do and if you think otherwise, watch a Herbert game and tell me if he's doing the same thing. There's a reason why the "Patriots" defense which is a defense that is designed to confuse made Herbert look straight up bad in the two games he's played against it this season (us and NE) and why his OC neutered his ability to throw anything past the 10 yard area until it was absolutely necessary when they were down too much because even he knew.

He's going through his reads and some analysts have mentioned that he seems to be going through his progressions too quickly. I feel like people on this forum too often play the result and then decide to make up everything before it to try and tie them together into a neat little cause-and-effect bow.

He was off on some throws yesterday that he rushed. Josh Allen was too just like he's been his entire NFL career. The difference is that the throws in between go to people who are wide open or give you gigantic YAC and Tua doesn't get those things, so you look at the stats side by side and think that one QB is completely outplaying the other. Show me a play from yesterday where a receiver is single covered and streaking free of the corner by 4+ yards like what happened to Needham nonstop. It's a different world that Tua's playing in compared elsewhere.

Does Tua have an arm like Herbert, Mahomes, or Josh Allen? Nope. The advantage of having an arm like that is that in a lot of instances is that you don't really have to know how to play quarterback. You see guy open you throw him da ball. Guys like Brady, Brees, etc win through accuracy and if you really dig down into the splits you'll see that his accuracy is fine and if you watch the games you'll see his ball placement is mostly exactly where it should be aside from the times he's got happy feet. In college he had a green accuracy chart across every single section of the field. Short. Long. Outside the 20 yard hash etc so he can absolutely make all the throws. No other quarterback had that... ever.

It's not threatening. I just find it lazy.

 

[ChitownPhins28]

We drafted Robert Hunt @ #39 and Jonathan Taylor went at pick #41...The exact type of back we could have used all year long, Then we signed 2 free agent running backs for millions.

Robert Hunt has been starting for us for weeks. As a rookie, at a position most thought he would fail at badly.
As it relates to 2020, I doubt we win more games with Taylor than Hunt.

We paid dues loading up the trenches but we will be farther along in 2021 with rookie RBs (to supplement Gaskin and Ahmed) and rookie WRs (to supplement Parker and PW and Bowden) and OL guys with a full season of experience.
The flipside would be playing 2021 with year-2 skill players and rookie O-line guys.
I feel the way we did it was better.

 

[DolfanDuBbZ~]

I said weeks ago. Watching cement dry is never fun.

But looking back at the totality of the season. And I'm pleasantly happy, surprised and giddy with anticipation for next year.

Growth. Maturity. Gotta have it in team sports.

 

[ChitownPhins28]

Tua facilitated the 'Alabama Open' perception by frequently putting the ball where the receivers were gaining separation while the ball was in the air cuz they were in full stride running under the perfectly-thrown pass.
His accuracy also led to a ton of YAC.

We're gonna see a Lot of that moving forward if we get the right drafted players or A-Rob FA WR.
A-Rob seems redundant with Parker but he's much more versatile and certainly separates quicker.
But, other than the play where he fell down on the Pick-6 (Ouch!), even Parker being out there was very helpful to Tua and the number of targets that Parket got displayed this. Parker is a lower-tier #1 but he would lay waste to any #2 CB in single coverage so he's still a headache for opposing DCs when he's even 90% healthy.
A WR corp of Parker, Williams, A-Rob and a first-round-picked WR, a later-round WR and Bowden is going to vex opposing DCs pretty hard.

 

[ChitownPhins28]

The thought of a WR Corps where Bowden barely makes the team gives me swelling in my extremity.

 

[phinfann13]

Everything was just really, really hard on offense. Not a single player that could make a guy miss, break a tackle, and go 60 yards for a TD on the entire roster. Every throw is caught and the guy is immediately down if the ball is even caught at all in the first place. I can't even tell you how many times we have WRs JUMP a foot or two just so the ball hits them in the chest which absolutely removes any possible YAC because they don't trust their own hands (looking at you Grant and Bowden).

We did as well as we could do considering what we had and that is an indictment on the coaching staff. I mean there are a lot of anti-Gailey people, but with objectively the worst weapons in the NFL, a bottom 10 Oline, no consistent running game to speak of, a journeyman QB and a rookie QB, it's a miracle we could drive the length of the field to score at all.

I can't tell you how much this enrages me. I was taught not to jump for a ball unless you absolutely had to in JV high school football. I don't understand why our guys continue to jump for every ball. It makes no sense.