Oh Darn, Another Thill Thread! Just A Few Points I Wish People Could Be Honest About....

[FinfanInBuffalo]

here's the facts; ryan tannehill is entering his 7th season and hasnt played in an nfl playoff game. if, on draft day 2012, you told that to all 32 nfl teams, he would have went undrafted. so the fan club can spin it whichever way they want. make all the excuses they want. it doesnt matter. facts are facts. and after this year when we go 6-10, RT will be entering his 8th season with nothing to show for it. when is enough, enough?

LOL. You have the audacity to talk about spinning?

 

[dnespins]

Would you have drafted Andrew Luck #1 overall if you just looked at the Colts' current trajectory as well as his medical?

Because let's be honest, neither are his fault. He didn't choose to play for Chuck Pagano behind a dogshit garbage OL coached by Joe Philbin on an imploding team owned by a cokehead.

i did so good man. i made it nearly 4 months through the offseason without getting involved in any of the 38462 ryan tannehill threads. now, here i am, arguing with the same guys i have been for years now and neither side ever budges. just win baby!

 

[raving]

I find the bash Tannehill threads beyond annoying.

He’s good enough.

Our organization has been one of the WORST in the NFL for 20 years. We have sucked for so many reasons.

There are 4 or 5 franchise QBs - 10 to 15 average ones like Alex Smith, Sam Bradford, Kurt Cousins, joe Flacco....

An average QB is good enough if the organization builds the team well.

Ryan has pocket presence issues - and our o line has sucked for a decade or more - so that’s a bad combo.

We’ll be good this year because our running game is about to be good so enjoy.

 

[srp1979]

Hate to be a nitpicker, but your point 5 isn't a FACT but rather an OPINION. I happen to agree with the opinion, but it is just that.

I point it out because convoluting facts with even just one opinion will invalidate the entire list and provides an open rebuttal to your premise. If your goal was to establish fundamental facts that everyone can agree on, and to form discussion from there, then the addition of just one opinion may negate the acceptance of any other facts presented.

Very true, and it's an opinion that I disagree with. We saw what happened to the Colts after they lost Manning.....and then again when they lost Luck. I could cite dozens of examples similar. And this opinion would be one that most disagree with, as the QB position is widely regarded as the most important position in all of sports.......and precisely why teams mortgage their whole franchise to obtain the chance to get a top tier draft pick.

We can win with Tanny, pending we have a good team around him that is well coached, but I don't think we will ever dominate with him. And that is why people are ready to move on. Hopefully I'm wrong, but we will see

 

[The Ghost]

With a cuttable contract after the year, 2018 will be Tannehills make or break year

A cuttable contract?

You mean one of the most favorable QB contracts in the entire league.

Cuttable lol

 

[hammersmithlad]

Too many people want to be able to say 'I told you so' and actively want to see Tannehill fail. He's our QB for the 2018 season, and for that reason alone he deserves our support. Same with any player who pulls on the jersey.

Disagree with this comment & unnecessarily adds fuel to the fire for these kind of T-Hill threads.

I’ve actually seen more ‘T-Hill will prove all you doubters wrong” than “I want T-Hill to fail” comments on this board.

Let’s be honest come Sunday a large majority of Finheaven contributors want the Dolphins to win which normally means whoever is our QB playing well.

There may be a small minority who as you say are playing the ‘long-game’ and positioning themselves to return to this forum if things go south for the Dolphins this season. However, in response to this I say fair play to these people who obviously have taken the energy & resources to commit to the Finheaven forum rather than doing something more meaningful in their life or doing the same on another team forum.

 

[Dajesus]

Favor him or not, at least try to keep it fact based:


1. It has not been "7 years" .... you're using that for demagoguery effect. He has played 4 and a half seasons.

2. he hasnt had multiple injuries nor is he like an oft injured player striggling w injuries past two years (like Pouncey for example). He's amazingly durable and he incurred an injury by a cheap shot directly to knee of a planted foot.

3. most of us (including mgmt and coaches) are not waiting for Thill to "arrive" or have his "breakout season" - that already happened in 2016 and it was cut off by the injury.

4. by most objective measures, he has improved his play each season, which is remarkable, and he was a pretty decent rookie QB playing behind a godawful line.

5. this is the last and biggest truth, and hardest for some to grasp- a QB in NFL can only do so much. he can make a bad team ok. he can make an ok team pretty good. and he can make a good team great.

Gase is trying to build a good team first.

Fact- a thing that is indisputably the case.

1. Not fact- He started 13 games in 2016, and that is greater than 3/4, so 4.5 years would be wrong. By ever defining measure the nfl has in place he is going in to his 7th year. Spending last season on the IR last year didn’t make stop aging for a season.

2. Not fact- I agree for 4 years he was amaziny durable, but for 2 years he went in the IR. It’s funny that you picked a guy who played all 16 games last year as a comparison, and who has missed less career games due to injury, as a comparison. Teddy Bridgewater would have been a much better comparison for your point.

3. Not a fact based argument so can’t hold to that standard. I’m not sure what point you are making. He was 8-5 and the 12th rated qb In 2016. If that is his break out year it’s ecactly what everyone says about him...average.

4. Not fact- in 2015 he was worse statistically than he was in 2014 in all but one measured stat.

5. This is an arguement not a fact.

We all hope Ryan kills it in 2018, and Miami wins a super bowl, so you can have actual facts to support this post. The fact is his stats have him in the middle of the pack over his 5 seasons he played in, and he has a losing record as a starting QB. These things aren’t debateable because there is imperical evidence that support them.

 

[BSQ]

I agree with The Goat. So much has been said about RT. It's time to see how he plays. If the knee issue is behind him ( you better believe it is ) I see no reason why he can't end up in the Pro Bowl this season. He's being given every opportunity to succeed. This offense is way more talented than any that Tannehill has played in. There is a ton of pass blocking, excellent RBs and just a major amount of speed and explosiveness available. This is better than Bess and Hartline by light years.

 

[Vaark]

Too many people want to be able to say 'I told you so' and actively want to see Tannehill fail. He's our QB for the 2018 season, and for that reason alone he deserves our support. Same with any player who pulls on the jersey.

Well, my take on this is now that the die is cast that Tannehill is our starting quarterback either you're gonna root for his success or you lose any credibility of being a legitimate fan and can rightfully be treated accordingly on here!

 

[traptses]

A cuttable contract?

You mean one of the most favorable QB contracts in the entire league.

Cuttable lol

While it may be one of the more favorable contracts out there, if he doesn’t preform and we end up in a spot where we can draft a QB, hard to believe they won’t take advantage of the $13 mil savings

 

[The Ghost]

While it may be one of the more favorable contracts out there, if he doesn’t preform and we end up in a spot where we can draft a QB, hard to believe they won’t take advantage of the $13 mil savings

My concern is only with the knee. The player will be better and hungrier than ever.

 

[traptses]

My concern is only with the knee. The player will be better and hungrier than ever.

Agreed. Let me clarify, I was in no way wishing us to cut him. Just stating that if he regresses or his knee continues to give him issues, and we end up with a top 5-10 pick again, I’d have to believe a rookie QB will be in Miami

 

[vcip]

For so many games I saw the D's pass rush just charge at him and hit him with almost zero resistance over and over and maybe with the exception of David Carr (Archie Manning? for us old guys) I have never seen it before that bad
The thing that will always impress me with Tanny is that during those lowest times he still managed to make plays and when he received even below average time he looked pretty damn good.

 

[DolfanDuBbZ~]

Favor him or not, at least try to keep it fact based:


1. It has not been "7 years" .... you're using that for demagoguery effect. He has played 4 and a half seasons.

2. he hasnt had multiple injuries nor is he like an oft injured player striggling w injuries past two years (like Pouncey for example). He's amazingly durable and he incurred an injury by a cheap shot directly to knee of a planted foot.

3. most of us (including mgmt and coaches) are not waiting for Thill to "arrive" or have his "breakout season" - that already happened in 2016 and it was cut off by the injury.

4. by most objective measures, he has improved his play each season, which is remarkable, and he was a pretty decent rookie QB playing behind a godawful line.

5. this is the last and biggest truth, and hardest for some to grasp- a QB in NFL can only do so much. he can make a bad team ok. he can make an ok team pretty good. and he can make a good team great.

Gase is trying to build a good team first.

1.) A player drafted in 2012, is going into his 7th year. Saying otherwise is something I could imagine a agent telling Tannenbaum to bring in idk Jermon Bushrod.

2.) The echo chamber using "pissing blood" for 5 years says otherwise. As for his knee, its was fixed, rehabbed and he was playing on it before it decided to do what it was eventually going to do. TEAR.

3.) The talk of "breakout" was a product of the FH echo chamber defending your golden boy.

4.) Improved each season. True. Luckily in year 7, we are on the cusp of breaking out. /tongue and cheek.

5.) We are in year 3 of Gase. If he wasn't building his team year 1 or 2, wtf has he been doing on?

 

[FinfanInBuffalo]

1. Not fact- He started 13 games in 2016, and that is greater than 3/4, so 4.5 years would be wrong. By ever defining measure the nfl has in place he is going in to his 7th year. Spending last season on the IR last year didn’t make stop aging for a season.

4.75 years is closer to 4.5 than it is to 7. Also the phrase "it's BEEN 7 years implies that 7 years (and more appropriately 7 seasons) have PASSED. Disputing facts with even less accurate numbers is bad form, even on a message board.

He was 8-5 and the 12th rated qb In 2016. If that is his break out year it’s ecactly what everyone says about him...average.

You clearly don't understand the mathematical concept of average. Using the ranked position as an indication of whether someone is average at something makes no sense. 12th in passer rating is clearly above the median but it is not enough information to claim he is average.

I'm also confident in saying that not everyone thinks he is average and even fewer people say "exactly" that.

And the usual test of your "beliefs" would involve asking if other QBs with similar numbers would also be considered average or even below average (Russell Wilson in 2016 for example). That would devolve into a discussion of how "Russell Wilson" (by himself apparently) wins games and invalidates any discussion of his passer rating.