Our quarterback options (or lack thereof)

[vinivedivichi]

I'm not really surprised by the anti-Gus sentiment on the board, but I am surprised that you guys are down on Saban for starting Gus. Saban was forced to make a decision based on who could give us the best opportunity to win games this year. Sadly, that man is Gus. I would love to think that we had a better option, but we don't.

Speculation that Gus/Saban=Jay/Wanny is ridiculous. Wanny had 5 years to find a replacement for a mediocre quarterback and didn't. Saban inherited a team without a lot of things, and is working to fill some of those holes. He found a stop-gap at quarterback to help us win games this year, but that's the extent of Gus. The assumption that Saban is playing Gus for any other reason than he gives us the best chance to win is off-base. As hard as it may be to accept, Gus is the guy that gives us the best chance to win games right now.

My point is that there's no problem with bashing Gus. He is what he is. He's a journeyman quarterback that fills a short term need for us. He's not our quarterback of the future, and I seriously doubt he's even our quarterback of the near future. I don't think, however, that it's fair to bash Saban for starting Gus. Everyone knows the learning curve for a quarterback in a new offense. If we have to go with a stop-gap, why not get a guy who's learning curve will be much smaller due to a history in the offense?

If you are bashing Saban for not starting Sage/Feeley, then you are fighting a losing battle. Even given our offensive defeciencies, it was apparent last year that Feeley has no business starting in the NFL. I'd like to think Sage has some potential, but if you're a budding star you don't manage to get overlooked by 3 coaching staffs. Sage could be a future Gus, but that's probably a best case scenario for him.

 

[rafael]

I agree. The problem is that there's a group who hold on to the fantasy that AJ was a good QB just being held down by the Man. LOL They see a strong arm and that's the extent of their QB evaluation skills. Then there's the group that doesn't evaluate anything and just says we should see what Sage can do. The "you never know" group. They just want to continuously plug players in and hope to get lucky.

 

[vcip]

I disagree. Gus may have given you the "best chance to win" for a short period, but he will be & stay flat at best. He seems to be regressing due to lack of ability. He knows the offense by heart & he still is inadequate.
Going with AJ might have involved a rougher start, but the plan would be he would improve as games went on with his obvious superiority in skills. You would want to see the decision making & pocket awareness get better. If after about 5-6 games there were no obvious signs of improvement than mayber they could have used Gus off the bench. I don't think our record would be any worse.

I feel they did it toatally backwards.

Anyway if Gus sucks it up again I go to Sage. 6 games is enough.

 

[vinivedivichi]

Gus hasn't played well, but he definitely hasn't "Sucked it up." Maybe you have forgotten last year already. Feeley and Fiedler routinely gave the other team the ball and 6 points due to bad decisions. Gus is inaccurate, but he's not killing us with dumb decisions. We could most definitely be worse off now had Feeley started - don't forget that we do have 2 wins.

Your stance on the Feeley issue is dependent on the belief you have that Feeley would get better. Is it possible that he would improve? Sure, but that's a big leap of faith based on past performance. He hasn't gotten any better since coming to Miami. He was given every chance to win the job in the preseason, and we all saw how he looked. I don't think Saban was playing favorites when he named Gus the starter. At that point it was the lesser of two evils, and to some extent it still is.

 

[tmny99]

My view of the QB situation is a bit different. First, I believe that when Saban named Linehan is offensive coordinator, Linehan immediately suggested bringing his backup along. It made sense. You have a first year head coach coming to a team that sunk to its lowest level and its best offensive player bounced. So he brought in a veteran QB to play in an offensive system that he knew extremely well. You see, Saban watched tapes of Miami games last year and he talked to the previous QB coach about AJ (Trestman believed that AJ would blossom into a legitimate NFL QB if given the opportunity, and he communicated that to Saban). However, Saban looked at the film and he really was not confident on letting the guy in the film lead his team. I believe his thoughts on the QB competition would be that AJ would play himself out it. A lot of people have been saying that AJ had his shot in the preseason, but if you look at it again, it wasn't that clear.
In the preseason, Feely started against the Bears. He was playing ok (I think 4-7 and maybe 30 yds) before he took that shot from Urlacher. If I remember correctly Feely wanted to stay in the game but couldn't because he couldn't get his shoe back on. Frerotte was going to get in the game soon anyway, but he ended up going in then, and really never lost the job again. Frerotte's play in the preseason was pretty subpar, but I always felt through the PC's that Saban and Linehan supported Gus no matter what. They would always point to his ability to manage the game, which is the exact opposite of what Feely was able to do last year. Again when Saban was saying he wanted a QB to manage the game, he didn't AJ in mind. Then there were the games where AJ played well against second and third stringers, but Gus still started. Then AJ finally got his shot in the Falcons game, and that shot went away with the pick 6, he threw. All too familiar. So you see, IMO Gus was brought here to be the QB at least for this year. The trade yesterday only solidified that.

 

[vinivedivichi]

My view of the QB situation is a bit different. First, I believe that when Saban named Linehan is offensive coordinator, Linehan immediately suggested bringing his backup along. It made sense. ..........

I don't really disagree with your assessment. I'm not sure if that's exactly how things went down, obviously, but I wouldn't be surprised if that's the way things generally shaped up. A couple of quick points about what you wrote that I want to mention:

1- Saban himself decided that he didn't want AJ to be the quarterback. He's not letting Linehan just go with his guy (Gus) blindly, Saban made the decision himself.

2- "Saban thought AJ could play himself out of it." Whether or not Saban had a preconceived idea to go with Gus, you have to admit that AJ did, in fact, play himself out of it. I think Saban made the decision, and rightly so IMO, that we can live with Gus' inaccuracy, but we can't live with AJ's turnovers. As hard as it is to see Gus overthrow open receivers every week, it still doesn't compare to watching AJ serve up the football 3 or 4 times on a silver platter.

I happen to think Feeley did get a fair shot at the starting job this offseason. Even if Saban/Linehan felt that Gus would ultimately win the job, which I think they probably did, you can't deny that up until the last few preseason games AJ was getting equal work with the first stringers.

Did they jump the gun a bit on deciding Gus was better for this team? Not at all. Again, they probably looked at AJ's play last year and decided that they couldn't put up with that style of football again this year. Once it became apparent that AJ was not really progressing, which you can't deny that he wasn't, they had seen enough to go with the effective "game manager" (i.e. Gus). Basically, Feeley was not given a "blank slate."

If Feeley had no reputation coming into the preseason he probably would have lasted as co-starter longer. Once he showed that not much had changed from last season, the choice was clear. In short, Feeley had something to prove and he didn't. Gus was the crutch that they fell back on once it was clear AJ was not gonna be a realistic option.

 

[tylerdolphin]

Besides, if the players thought Feeley was better (and they should know as well as anybody) they would say so. The fact that JT and Zach and the others never mentioned Feeley starting tells me that the players knew Gus was better.

 

[adamprez2003]

If you read comments from the players that come out occasionally, I think there's more to the story than just ability on the field. OJ Mcduffie was reported to have said that AJ was a cancer in the lockerroom. Evans our fullback has had two seperate intewrviews where he said that he has no doubt that AJ will make it in this league (I assume as a starter). He said it was unfortunate how things turned out and AJ just needs a fresh start. I have yet to read one professional (either player or personnell guy or coach) say that he doesnt have what it takes. It was reported that the receivers were starting to blame Frerotte for the latest losses and it may be that the cancer McDuffie was referring too was that half the team wanted AJ and the other half Gus. Saban's choice was Gus and so he had to kill the dissension.

The way to look at this chapter of Dolphin history is that if AJ never pans out in this league, Saban made the right choice. But if AJ blossoms somewhere playing for another team, then its just another Brian Griese situation and Saban screwed up.

Whats done is done. Lets hope we fix our mess at QB next year. Lets hope Saban and Mueller can bring us the QB we need to get to the next level. Our Dolphin needs more rings for his flipper

 

[Oboy]

AJ... the fact is he was not working hard enough to improve. The coaches saw that and cut their losses. I personally was hoping he would improve, but you can not teach desire.

Gus... He is OK. Not good, and not terrible, but he will lose some games for us. I don't see him winning many games for us. My biggest problem with Gus is he seems to miss too many open deep passes. There were a few last week and two weeks ago in the 2 minute drill he missed the winning touchdown on the play-action roll out. He had Chambers deep behind the corner, the safety bit on the PA so all he had to do was throw it up and let Chris run under it. Instead he threw it out of bounds.

Sage... probably a good comparison to Gus. However, we really don't know. If Gus continues, I'd be open to letting him try a bit.

Lemon... (LOL, don't even know his first name) WHO knows? I have not seen ANY film on him. No idea if he is crap or potential. If Gus and Sage falter, can't hurt to play him a bit and see what we have.

 

[LarryFinFan]

I am certainly not bashing Saban for starting Gus, however, my patience with him is growing thin (Gus, that is). Obviously, AJ was not the answer or at least if he was we'll never know now...Sage...well there is obviously a reason he couldn't beat out Ears or AJ...so here we are with a less-than-mediocre Gus leading our team...I don't think that Linehan or Saban could have forseen Gus tanking this quickly...I'm sure they were aware of his deficiencies long before any games were played. I'm a little confused tho with what Saban is trying to accomplish this year. He has said many times, that he wants to win now, but he clearly hasn't made the right moves at the QB position to ensure that. He says he wants to build the team thru the draft, but then jump starts the D with several key veteran signings (Carter, Holliday, Jones, Schulters, Traylor, etc). He says he wants to make haste slowly, but lives with Gus not being able to accomplish what this offense can do ?? Gus has had multiple scoring opportunities that he's missed on, far below the league averages for missed opportunities and that is why we are losing.

I see two important reasons for the AJ trade in Saban's eyes...first is utilization of available cap space this year to avoid it next season. Second is to avoid any QB controversy with Gus and AJ as the season progresses and we see that Gus isn't improving. A third reason for the trade might have been that they were looking at Lemon as a possiblity (see CKparrothead's conspiracy theory) to, at the very least, be our interim QB next year until a drafted guy is ready...it gives him an extra 4 months in the system before the offseason workouts begin...

So the issue here is that Saban seems to contradict himself as he goes along. It may not be the case, we just haven't seen his vision of each piece of the puzzle yet. I realize that with every signing or every move that he makes there are expectations and they may not be realistic. I also understand that Saban can't just come out and say "Hey, I'm building for the future, so we may have a few losses this year." Every move he makes is being scrutinized as much by the players on the team as the media and fans.

I am also aware that he can't work miracles and one offseason where he had to not only begin to mold the team to his system, but build a FO, coaching staff, FA, draft, salary cap dealings, etc...this next offseason, we will probably see more movement than in last simply because the FO, coaching staff, salary cap issues, and the fact that the current players have been in the system this year will not be concerns for him. He can concentrate on the issues of FA and the draft...

Starting off hot like we did surely raised the expectation bar among fans and I am one of them...I thought of a 6-10 record being a big step forward and then all of a sudden we whip up on the Broncs and play well in losing to the Jests and beat the Panthers and I'm thinking...well, maybe...just maybe there's hope...but it certainly doesn't look like we can overcome Gus' shortcomings and are destined for that 6-10, 7-9 record...it's just really hard for Fins fans to accept that, even from a guy whom we all respect as a coach and GM...

 

[adamprez2003]

I am certainly not bashing Saban for starting Gus, however, my patience with him is growing thin (Gus, that is). Obviously, AJ was not the answer or at least if he was we'll never know now...Sage...well there is obviously a reason he couldn't beat out Ears or AJ...so here we are with a less-than-mediocre Gus leading our team...I don't think that Linehan or Saban could have forseen Gus tanking this quickly...I'm sure they were aware of his deficiencies long before any games were played. I'm a little confused tho with what Saban is trying to accomplish this year. He has said many times, that he wants to win now, but he clearly hasn't made the right moves at the QB position to ensure that. He says he wants to build the team thru the draft, but then jump starts the D with several key veteran signings (Carter, Holliday, Jones, Schulters, Traylor, etc). He says he wants to make haste slowly, but lives with Gus not being able to accomplish what this offense can do ?? Gus has had multiple scoring opportunities that he's missed on, far below the league averages for missed opportunities and that is why we are losing.

I see two important reasons for the AJ trade in Saban's eyes...first is utilization of available cap space this year to avoid it next season. Second is to avoid any QB controversy with Gus and AJ as the season progresses and we see that Gus isn't improving. A third reason for the trade might have been that they were looking at Lemon as a possiblity (see CKparrothead's conspiracy theory) to, at the very least, be our interim QB next year until a drafted guy is ready...it gives him an extra 4 months in the system before the offseason workouts begin...

So the issue here is that Saban seems to contradict himself as he goes along. It may not be the case, we just haven't seen his vision of each piece of the puzzle yet. I realize that with every signing or every move that he makes there are expectations and they may not be realistic. I also understand that Saban can't just come out and say "Hey, I'm building for the future, so we may have a few losses this year." Every move he makes is being scrutinized as much by the players on the team as the media and fans.

I am also aware that he can't work miracles and one offseason where he had to not only begin to mold the team to his system, but build a FO, coaching staff, FA, draft, salary cap dealings, etc...this next offseason, we will probably see more movement than in last simply because the FO, coaching staff, salary cap issues, and the fact that the current players have been in the system this year will not be concerns for him. He can concentrate on the issues of FA and the draft...

Starting off hot like we did surely raised the expectation bar among fans and I am one of them...I thought of a 6-10 record being a big step forward and then all of a sudden we whip up on the Broncs and play well in losing to the Jests and beat the Panthers and I'm thinking...well, maybe...just maybe there's hope...but it certainly doesn't look like we can overcome Gus' shortcomings and are destined for that 6-10, 7-9 record...it's just really hard for Fins fans to accept that, even from a guy whom we all respect as a coach and GM...

great post!. I agree that too much had to be done to expect alot this year. Its frustrating though because a good qb could have gotten us a 5-0 record right now. I find that to be amazing how close we are. I think Saban has done a terrific job on defense. I have no doubts that in two years we will be a top 5 defense again. My only concern, not a judgement just a concern, is that Saban has done nothing to prove that he is as good on the offensive side as the defensive side. My hope is that his plan was to fix the defense this year and concentrate on the offense next. Next year has to be about offense. We are so close to being a playoff team that it just gets frustrating to see touchdowns sail out of bounds. I swear a good QB could have gotten us those additional three wins that we left on the field. We need a QB so desperately that I really hope that we bring one in next year

 

[LarryFinFan]

Gus hasn't played well, but he definitely hasn't "Sucked it up." Maybe you have forgotten last year already. Feeley and Fiedler routinely gave the other team the ball and 6 points due to bad decisions. Gus is inaccurate, but he's not killing us with dumb decisions. We could most definitely be worse off now had Feeley started - don't forget that we do have 2 wins.

Your stance on the Feeley issue is dependent on the belief you have that Feeley would get better. Is it possible that he would improve? Sure, but that's a big leap of faith based on past performance. He hasn't gotten any better since coming to Miami. He was given every chance to win the job in the preseason, and we all saw how he looked. I don't think Saban was playing favorites when he named Gus the starter. At that point it was the lesser of two evils, and to some extent it still is.

Perhaps he's not killing us by giving the ball away or with dumb decisions, but he is certainly killing us with being so inaccurate in his passing. If he is even at the league average, we win one or two of the games we've played...
(by league average, I'm referring to the multitude of missed open recievers that would have been TDs had he accurately hit the reciever...I count 5 for sure TDs and possibly as many as 7...)

 

[BigTom]

i just have a quick question that i can't seem to answer myself. why didn't we draft a quarterback last year? i think there was a bunch of good qb's and with saban coming out of college he had a chance to get a good look at all of them. he filled a bunch of big holes but i think that qb was the biggest hole to fill. feely was never a real long term option so what did saban think that one day he'd wake up and and there'd be some amazing qb sitting on his door ready to play? regardless if the rook didn't play at all and saban went with frerotte to try and win now, gus ain't nobody special and he's not getting younger. we shouldn't be worrying about our qb situation because we should already have it taken care of and be grooming the kid as we speak. frye, orton, mcpherson, orvlovsky(sp?) it doesn't matter take you pick, there should be some kind of young qb with atleast some potential. its time to face the music, we're not trading for our qb of the future, brees, rivers, they're all out of the question. now we're looking to the draft to draft a qb in the top 5 of 10 probably. now don't get me wrong i love some of these guys coming out, young, jacobs, croyle to name a few but some might not declare. i personally don't think they should start right out of college so now who does that make our starter? gus? sage? carr is a very realistic option if he doesn't start lighting it up all of a sudden. I'm all for carr should he be a freeagent. and if we sign him we still need to draft a qb. but i think that saban made a very critical mistake by not drafting a qb in the third, fourth, or fifth round. our options (or our lack thereof) would be much better. but hey, that's just my opinion.