QB Plan thread #208

[Canuck]

1) Restructure Jay. Tell him he'll be in an open competition for the starters job with a mid level free agent signee. Offer him a chance to get the monies back through incentives. He'll do it because no team in the NFL is going to offer him a chance to be a starter (and get paid like one) much less annoint him as starter.

2) Give Sage real shot at starting QB gig.

3) Sign Ricky Ray to Jake Delhomme type contract on the premise he's going into camp to battle for starters job against Fiedler and Rosenfels.

4) Draft young QB with first round pick. Rivers or Losman. I don't know which one I want anymore. Senior Bowl reports were contradictory in every other one I read.

 

[Section126]

I don't see where we upgrade in your post........where's the beef?

 

[finfan54]

Originally posted by Canuck
1) Restructure Jay. Tell him he'll be in an open competition for the starters job with a mid level free agent signee. Offer him a chance to get the monies back through incentives. He'll do it because no team in the NFL is going to offer him a chance to be a starter (and get paid like one) much less annoint him as starter.

2) Give Sage real shot at starting QB gig.

3) Sign Ricky Ray to Jake Delhomme type contract on the premise he's going into camp to battle for starters job against Fiedler and Rosenfels.

4) Draft young QB with first round pick. Rivers or Losman. I don't know which one I want anymore. Senior Bowl reports were contradictory in every other one I read.

A few things here. I am currently wondering about Jay Fiedler and his cost to us if we cut him as opposed to keeping him. What happens if Rivers is a dynamo and makes jay look ill and then we cut him later? cost us more?
Sage has to signed and if Norv goes to Raiders, he might go with him. anyone ever consider that? then we would have noone at QB other than a draft pick.
Ricky Ray is coming in for workout right? dont know if he has already but there is no indication that he will actually be signed. I think Ray is a just sign that Spielman is looking high and low and will continue to do so.
The overall thing to me here is that one thing is certain if Jay gets cut, and that is alot of new people will have the opportunity to lead a team with ricky in your backfield with big questions to be answered.

 

[Phinzone]

Originally posted by Section126
I don't see where we upgrade in your post........where's the beef?

Agreed.

Sage is very unproven. If we were to fall short of signing a QB, I'd want to give him the keys to the ferrari. He deserves a shot, Jay has wasted all of his chances.

I am NOT ok with Jay being in "commpetition" for a starting job next year. It CAN'T happen. 4 years and we've busted with the guy, he's come up short. Give me anyone by him (including a raw backup QB from our bench). I'm willing to go 3-13 next year if it means we don't have Jay at the helm, and are grooming our rookie QB.

Also, Ricky Ray is not high on my list. Nor the Big O's He said we probably won't go after the guy as he won't be ready for probably 2-3 years. In which case, we should jsut draft a QB.

 

[finfan54]

Originally posted by Section126
I don't see where we upgrade in your post........where's the beef?

Im thinking his thinking is that we cant afford Brunell or anyone else for that matter. He may be right if that is the case sec126. That is the real question here that noone wants to confront and will not like (if fielder is retained). Fiedler is the key. If JF stays, i dont see us getting brunell. if fiedler gone, i see brunell all the way.

 

[Canuck]

The key is our 1st round pick

That's where we (ultimately) upgrade.

This QB plan is a compromise for the chance to win now (by keeping Jay as starter or back-up) and still groom a QB for the future. Obviously no QB in this year's draft will end up starting for us come next September (outside pipe-dream pick up: Eli manning) so if Miami doesn't land Mark Brunell, we could switch gears and bring in someone unhearalded, but talented, like Ricky Ray to push for the starting job now.

Who knows, maybe Ray will be 04' version of Jake Delhomme and at 24 yrs of age he could end up being our QB of the future too. The fact is, I'd feel a lot better about the future of this team's QB position by adding youth, talent and arm strength. Ray and Losman (for instance) would do just that.

 

[Canuck]

We could do a lot worse than Fiedler as our back up

Originally posted by Graythreat


I am NOT ok with Jay being in "commpetition" for a starting job next year. It CAN'T happen. 4 years and we've busted with the guy, he's come up short. Give me anyone by him (including a raw backup QB from our bench). I'm willing to go 3-13 next year if it means we don't have Jay at the helm, and are grooming our rookie QB.

In fact, I think Fiedler is the perfect back-up QB. Someone with intangibles and smarts who can come off the bench in a pinch to lead his team to victory should he have to (see Was game this year). He'd also be a great tutor for a youg QB like a Ricky Ray or Losman. Losman especially because where Jay has intangibles in spades, Losman does not.

This plan is all predicated on Miami NOT landing Brunell as a free agent. From the stuff I've read of late, he's going to draw a lot of interest and while I think Miami is the most logical place for him, it's not a forgone conclusion he'll be coming here. IF we do sign Brunell, then you can be 99.9% sure that our first rounder will NOT be used on a QB and we'll be waiting at least another year to draft the next Dan Marino for this franchise....

 

[BLITZKRIEG]

Re: The key is our 1st round pick

Originally posted by Canuck
The fact is, I'd feel a lot better about the future of this team's QB position by adding youth, talent and arm strength. Ray and Losman (for instance) would do just that.

I agree.

I'm not against drafting QB P. Rivers, and letting him fight for a chance to start....

Jay doesn't deserve another chance to start IMO. He's back-up material all the way IMO. He'd make a fine back-up too, but his days as a starter are over I think....

QB M. Brunell appears to be the fan favorite to replace Jay, but he'd only be a temporary solution at QB IMO. We need a young gun in Miami sooner or later, and I wouldn't mind taking a chance on Rivers / Ray / or Losman....

PHINZ RULE!!!irate:

 

[Ross]

"What happens if Rivers is a dynamo and makes jay look ill..."

That is an impossiblity. No rookie will make jay look ill when Brian couldn't do that this past year. Its not even worth considering as a possibility when deciding what to do about our QB situtaion this coming year.

People can rip Jay all they want, but no QB would have looked better behind that line. Hell they couldn't even run block for Gods sake. If the O is to get better next year, the line has be addressed first and foremost. Get a line capable of getting Ricky W. past that magical 4 YPC mark. Get a line capable of protecting the QB more than 2 seconds and you'll see this O do a hell of alot better regardless if Jay is the QB or not...

--Ross

 

[iceblizzard69]

Originally posted by Canuck
1) Restructure Jay. Tell him he'll be in an open competition for the starters job with a mid level free agent signee. Offer him a chance to get the monies back through incentives. He'll do it because no team in the NFL is going to offer him a chance to be a starter (and get paid like one) much less annoint him as starter.

2) Give Sage real shot at starting QB gig.

3) Sign Ricky Ray to Jake Delhomme type contract on the premise he's going into camp to battle for starters job against Fiedler and Rosenfels.

4) Draft young QB with first round pick. Rivers or Losman. I don't know which one I want anymore. Senior Bowl reports were contradictory in every other one I read.

This plan would give us 4 QBs. Also, with this plan, 3 QBs would be in contention for our starting job this year while the fourth QB would be a first round pick and should be starting by 2005. Sorry, but this is not a good idea. I don't think having more than 2 guys competing for the job is a good idea and neither of the two would be starting for more than one season anyway.

 

[Canuck]

What's wrong with carrying 4 QB's for one year?

Originally posted by iceblizzard69


This plan would give us 4 QBs. Also, with this plan, 3 QBs would be in contention for our starting job this year while the fourth QB would be a first round pick and should be starting by 2005. Sorry, but this is not a good idea. I don't think having more than 2 guys competing for the job is a good idea and neither of the two would be starting for more than one season anyway.

Realistically, mini camps will tell us of the three (Fiedler, Ray or Rosenfels) which one is trade bait or 3rd string therefore leaving the other two to fight for the first string training camp reps.

In this scenario, we have not brought in a sure fire legitimate starting candidate (someone like Brunell for instance). You got a status quo guy (Fiedler), a guy that's been in the system (Rosenfels) and a CFL import who's a winner and has lots of physical tools to work with. Add to that the 1st round QB pick, Miami has the future at the position looked after (Rosenfels, Ray or new guy). At worst we have the same starter at QB (Fiedler) with presumably upgrades on the OL and WR via the 3rd round pick and free agency.

 

[NavyFishFan]

Re: What's wrong with carrying 4 QB's for one year?

Originally posted by Canuck


Realistically, mini camps will tell us of the three (Fiedler, Ray or Rosenfels) which one is trade bait or 3rd string therefore leaving the other two to fight for the first string training camp reps.

In this scenario, we have not brought in a sure fire legitimate starting candidate (someone like Brunell for instance). You got a status quo guy (Fiedler), a guy that's been in the system (Rosenfels) and a CFL import who's a winner and has lots of physical tools to work with. Add to that the 1st round QB pick, Miami has the future at the position looked after (Rosenfels, Ray or new guy). At worst we have the same starter at QB (Fiedler) with presumably upgrades on the OL and WR via the 3rd round pick and free agency.

Definitely seems like the most cost-effective way to approach the QB situation.

 

[Canuck]

I hope Miami will always keep one eye on the future...

...while making decisions to win now. That's the compromise here.

Hey, who's to say that Sage doesn't pull a Tom Brady, work his tail off this offseason and win the starter's job. I'm not counting on that hence the need to keep Fiedler in this scenario. Ricky Ray is intriguing and I don't see any team giving him the keys to their offense for 04' without competing for it in training camp. If he can come to Miami to go against Fiedler.....don't you think he would? I would if I was 24 yrs old and had the oppurtunity to play for a great organization like Miami. Throw in a JP Losman or Philip Rivers and Miami all of a sudden has talent at the most important position on the field. Too long have we lived in the shadows of Dave Wannstedt's reign as he's neglected this obvious derth of talent at QB. Ray and Losman/Rivers would change things dramatically while still not having to be pressed into immediate action.

 

[NavyFishFan]

Re: I hope Miami will always keep one eye on the future...

Originally posted by Canuck
...while making decisions to win now. That's the compromise here.

Hey, who's to say that Sage doesn't pull a Tom Brady, work his tail off this offseason and win the starter's job. I'm not counting on that hence the need to keep Fiedler in this scenario. Ricky Ray is intriguing and I don't see any team giving him the keys to their offense for 04' without competing for it in training camp. If he can come to Miami to go against Fiedler.....don't you think he would? I would if I was 24 yrs old and had the oppurtunity to play for a great organization like Miami. Throw in a JP Losman or Philip Rivers and Miami all of a sudden has talent at the most important position on the field. Too long have we lived in the shadows of Dave Wannstedt's reign as he's neglected this obvious derth of talent at QB. Ray and Losman/Rivers would change things dramatically while still not having to be pressed into immediate action.

NOBODY on this team will pull a Tom Brady until the Oline is shored up. I watched a bunch of Pats game vids and almost EVERY time Brady was pressured, all hell broke loose....lotsa INTs. Brady is the result of consistent play behind a stout line. He's not Montana...he's good and consistent...but he's not the second coming.