Reality Check JETS fans....

[The New Guy]

You didn't like me quoting that I guess. You keep bragging about facts that have no meaning. Drive summaries have no meaning how an offense performs, yet u continue to satisfy yourself by saying ur presents facts. That is so dumb, I wouldn't doubt u claim ur opinions to be facts especially after u said it yourself.

I have no issue with you quoting anything. Just try and apply some common sense when reading. Drive summaries have a lot to do with how the offense performs. It gives you a summary of the plays. That is why it is called a summary. The play by play tells you exactly what they did. I've told you this a million times, I don't just look at the stats, I watch how they play. When I present facts, they are just that.

I ignore a lot of ur posts just cuz they too childish.

At least you admit it. If you want to do that, please use the ignore button and save us both some time. It gets annoying when I consistently have to correct you. You are always saying things I never said, and ignore the things that I do say. Here is an example for you:

A better example of a lucky break for the Dolphins is when Holmes dropped that easy TD pass last year. That was a difference maker.

He forgot about the Santonio dropped TD against the Dolphins last year

If you want to ignore my post, just don't reply. ^ That gets annoying, and makes you look dumb.

Again, what is average to you, may be good for someone else. It depends what each person sets a criteria for being good, average, and bad. Maybe one defines a good offense that doesn't turn the ball over, while someone else defines one that can score 30 points a game regardless of how many turnovers they had. Its never a fact, always an opinion.

It doesn't matter what my criteria is for what I think is good or bad. It is what it is. An opinion does not change what something actually is. Your opinion is either wrong or right. If I called an offense that scored 30 points a game, but threw 5 ints that were returned for TDs good, I would be wrong. If I called an offense that never turned the ball over, but didn't score any points good, I would be wrong. If I called an offense that scored 30 points, had 400 yards passing, 200 yards rushing and no turnovers and penalties good, it would also be a fact.

I didn't change ur quote. Told u Im not a huge g*y smiley face fan. U said it somewhere SD is an average team and KC is a bad and that it is a fact. I can't find the quote but I know I read it here somewhere. Too many pages to dig up.

I don't care if you are a smiley face fan or not. You purposely deleted the smiley face because you know it makes a difference in how the statement is taken. You know I was being sarcastic, and when I even told you so, you try to make it look like I was being serious by deleting the smiley at the end of the statement. You are so sad.

The only thing I ever said about SD was that I didn't think that they were that good. Maybe this is what you are thinking of?

I said it would be close because I don't think SD is that good, and it is very difficult for teams to travel coast to coast and play in an early game. They started the game at 10am SD time. It is not an excuse, it is a fact.

Or maybe this one:

You can look at it however you like. The fact is, SD has only won against bad teams, and they were close games.

Those quotes were after you kept telling me how good SD was when they were 4-1.

 

[JETSJETSJETS]

I have no issue with you quoting anything. Just try and apply some common sense when reading. Drive summaries have a lot to do with how the offense performs. It gives you a summary of the plays. That is why it is called a summary. The play by play tells you exactly what they did. I've told you this a million times, I don't just look at the stats, I watch how they play. When I present facts, they are just that.

Does it tell you that a defender missed a tackle? No
Does it tell you that the WR slipped after catching a pass and was then downed by the player? No
Does it tell you how good a pass was or how bad a pass was? Does it present facts? Yes
Does it tell you how good or bad an offense was? No

At least you admit it. If you want to do that, please use the ignore button and save us both some time. It gets annoying when I consistently have to correct you. You are always saying things I never said, and ignore the things that I do say. Here is an example for you:

If you want to ignore my post, just don't reply. ^ That gets annoying, and makes you look dumb.

Why are you concerned about me? And no, you don't correct me. You just don't agree with me and think you corrected me, unless u are counting where u corrected me when I had two totally different plays mixed up.

It doesn't matter what my criteria is for what I think is good or bad. It is what it is. An opinion does not change what something actually is. Your opinion is either wrong or right. If I called an offense that scored 30 points a game, but threw 5 ints that were returned for TDs good, I would be wrong.

Now you are setting criteria, and thats why it becomes an opinion.

If I called an offense that never turned the ball over, but didn't score any points good, I would be wrong. If I called an offense that scored 30 points, had 400 yards passing, 200 yards rushing and no turnovers and penalties good, it would also be a fact.

What if all 30 points came in the first half where the Corners missed their tackles on three short passes that were then turned in to 90 yard TDs? Same with the rushing game? What if you were down 30-33 at half-time, but had no turnovers and threw for 350 yards and ran for 150 yards...and then go three and out for the entire half and lose the game 30-33? Is that a good offense, even though it didn't turn the ball over once, had three TDs, and three FGs and 600 yards of offense? Yeah, the stats look great, but they failed miserably and got lucky with a few missed tackles in the first half resulting in all 30 points.

Its always an opinion. Admit it.

I don't care if you are a smiley face fan or not. You purposely deleted the smiley face because you know it makes a difference in how the statement is taken. You know I was being sarcastic, and when I even told you so, you try to make it look like I was being serious by deleting the smiley at the end of the statement. You are so sad.

 

[The New Guy]

Does it tell you that a defender missed a tackle? No
Does it tell you that the WR slipped after catching a pass and was then downed by the player? No
Does it tell you how good a pass was or how bad a pass was? Does it present facts? Yes
Does it tell you how good or bad an offense was? No

That is where watching the game comes in. I watch the games I comment on.

Why are you concerned about me? And no, you don't correct me. You just don't agree with me and think you corrected me, unless u are counting where u corrected me when I had two totally different plays mixed up.

JETSJETSJETS says "You don't correct me. Unless you are talking about that time you corrected me, or about that other time you corrected me when I said you forgot about Holmes TD against the dolphins, or that other time....."


I don't really care if you look dumb. I care about having to correct the things you misquote me on, or the things I say that you ignore. If you want to ignore me, please use the ignore option.

Now you are setting criteria, and thats why it becomes an opinion.

What if all 30 points came in the first half where the Corners missed their tackles on three short passes that were then turned in to 90 yard TDs? Same with the rushing game? What if you were down 30-33 at half-time, but had no turnovers and threw for 350 yards and ran for 150 yards...and then go three and out for the entire half and lose the game 30-33? Is that a good offense, even though it didn't turn the ball over once, had three TDs, and three FGs and 600 yards of offense? Yeah, the stats look great, but they failed miserably and got lucky with a few missed tackles in the first half resulting in all 30 points.

Its always an opinion. Admit it.

Again, that is where watching the game comes in. If an offense puts up 30 points every week with no turnovers or penalties, that is a good offense. I would not care when they scored them. If a team can't win a game scoring 30 points, the O is not the problem. The D is. According to you, no one can know what a good offense is and what a bad offense is, or anything else for that matter. It is all just opinions. You said the Dolphins suck, but I guess that is just your opinion. They have been playing really hard, and came close a couple of time. Maybe my criteria for a good team is one that plays hard, so the Dolphins are a good team. No, that is not true. That could indeed be someones criteria for a good team, but that does not change the fact that the team is bad. There are standards in life, and football is no different. Just because your standards are lower or higher does not change what something actually is. It is what it is, and you are either right or wrong. An opinion is just an opinion, but it can also be a fact at times.

You purposely edited one of my quotes to try and make it look like I was contradicting myself. You also claimed I said something that I never said.
Why would I be mad at you embarrassing yourself?

 

[JETSJETSJETS]

That is where watching the game comes in. I watch the games I comment on.

You post game summaries and make ur judgement according to that. You have been doing that for a while now.

JETSJETSJETS says "You don't correct me. Unless you are talking about that time you corrected me, or about that other time you corrected me when I said you forgot about Holmes TD against the dolphins, or that other time....."

I don't really care if you look dumb. I care about having to correct the things you misquote me on, or the things I say that you ignore. If you want to ignore me, please use the ignore option.

I didn't misquote you, but u certainly did here.

Again, that is where watching the game comes in. If an offense puts up 30 points every week with no turnovers or penalties, that is a good offense. I would not care when they scored them. If a team can't win a game scoring 30 points, the O is not the problem. The D is. According to you, no one can know what a good offense is and what a bad offense is, or anything else for that matter. It is all just opinions. You said the Dolphins suck, but I guess that is just your opinion. They have been playing really hard, and came close a couple of time. Maybe my criteria for a good team is one that plays hard, so the Dolphins are a good team. No, that is not true. That could indeed be someones criteria for a good team, but that does not change the fact that the team is bad. There are standards in life, and football is no different. Just because your standards are lower or higher does not change what something actually is. It is what it is, and you are either right or wrong. An opinion is just an opinion, but it can also be a fact at times.

According to me, calling an offense good or bad is an opinion. It doesn't make it a fact even if everyone agreed it is a good or bad offense.

Calling a team bad is an opinion. If I say Miami sucks, its an opinion. If I said Miami has the second worst record in the NFL, then thats a fact. What is this, English 101 now? And you can have whatever criteria you prefer, but then you'll have to stick by to it for your own good. If ur criteria for being a good team is playing hard, then even high school kids can play hard in the NFL and still get blown away by 100-0. And opinions don't HAVE to be right or wrong. Not always. If you say a team is bad because it is 1-7, then the fact is, the team is 1-7. Being bad is not the fact.

According to the Webster’s Dictionary, the fact is “anything that is done or happened; anything actually existent; any statement strictly true; truth; reality” and opinion is something that “indicates a belief, view, sentiment, or conception.”

 

[The New Guy]

You post game summaries and make ur judgement according to that. You have been doing that for a while now.

I posted drive summaries only once after you were so impressed that the Jets put up 27 points on the Bills. The drive summaries showed that the Jets started in great FP most of the game, and only scored their first TD when they got the ball on the Buff 19 yardline. I've been telling you that I didn't think the Jets offense has been playing well from week 1. I don't need any drive summaries to know that. I've been watching them.

I didn't misquote you, but u certainly did here.

:lol2: Yep. Most people had no clue I was being sarcastic, and actually thought that I was giving them a direct quote from you. I'm not the one editing your actual post to make it look like something it is not.

According to me, calling an offense good or bad is an opinion. It doesn't make it a fact even if everyone agreed it is a good or bad offense.

Calling a team bad is an opinion. If I say Miami sucks, its an opinion. If I said Miami has the second worst record in the NFL, then that is a fact. What is this, English 101 now? And you can have whatever criteria you prefer, but then you'll have to stick by to it for your own good. If ur criteria for being a good team is playing hard, then even high school kids can play hard in the NFL and still get blown away by 100-0. And opinions don't HAVE to be right or wrong. Not always. If you say a team is bad because it is 1-7, then the fact is, the team is 1-7. Being bad is not the fact.

:crazy: I don't even now why I bother. An opinion is just an opinion when it rests on grounds that can not produce complete certainty. Even if everyone agreed, that would not necessarily make it a fact, but it could be. Everyone could be right, or everyone could be wrong. If a team goes 1-15, they are bad. That is a fact. You know why? Because the standard for a good team is winning games. When you don't, you are a bad team. I don't care what someone's criteria for a good or bad team might be. The set standard is winning. If my opinion is that a certain team is great, and they go undefeated and win the Super Bowl, then my opinion becomes a fact.

According to the Webster’s Dictionary, the fact is “anything that is done or happened; anything actually existent; any statement strictly true; truth; reality” and opinion is something that “indicates a belief, view, sentiment, or conception.”

When an opinion (a belief, view, sentiment, or conception) is proven, it becomes a fact. Long ago, one guy had the opinion that the Earth revolved around the Sun when everyone else's opinion was that the Sun revolved around the Earth. It was only an opinion at that time because his belief rested on grounds that could not produce complete certainty. It was not until later that his opinion was proven to be a fact. That didn't mean the Earth did not revolve around the Sun until it was proven. Peoples opinions don't change the facts. His opinion was a fact all along even when it could not be proven. He was right, and they were wrong. There was no in between.

There are standards for what is good and bad in football. There are standards for what we think beauty is. Your opinion might be that this girl is beautiful:

She very well could be attractive to you, and that could be your honest opinion. My opinion is that this girl is very ugly. According to the standards we have set for beauty, my opinion becomes a fact. (any statement strictly true)

I would much rather be talking about football, so this is the last I am going to comment on this.

 

[JETSJETSJETS]

I posted drive summaries only once after you were so impressed that the Jets put up 27 points on the Bills. The drive summaries showed that the Jets started in great FP most of the game, and only scored their first TD when they got the ball on the Buff 19 yardline. I've been telling you that I didn't think the Jets offense has been playing well from week 1. I don't need any drive summaries to know that. I've been watching them.

Aren't you the one that keeps referring "show me where Jets had an 80 yard TD drive"? You don't watch football. You just look at drive summaries and since summaries are a fact, you then base ur opinion around that fact.

:lol2: Yep. Most people had no clue I was being sarcastic, and actually thought that I was giving them a direct quote from you. I'm not the one editing your actual post to make it look like something it is not.

I didn't edit any post. I just cut out the part I was referring to.

:crazy: I don't even now why I bother. An opinion is just an opinion when it rests on grounds that can not produce complete certainty. Even if everyone agreed, that would not necessarily make it a fact, but it could be. Everyone could be right, or everyone could be wrong. If a team goes 1-15, they are bad. That is a fact. You know why? Because the standard for a good team is winning games. When you don't, you are a bad team. I don't care what someone's criteria for a good or bad team might be. The set standard is winning. If my opinion is that a certain team is great, and they go undefeated and win the Super Bowl, then my opinion becomes a fact.

At what point, does a team become bad from average? Is there a universal standard for that?

When an opinion (a belief, view, sentiment, or conception) is proven, it becomes a fact. Long ago, one guy had the opinion that the Earth revolved around the Sun when everyone else's opinion was that the Sun revolved around the Earth. It was only an opinion at that time because his belief rested on grounds that could not produce complete certainty. It was not until later that his opinion was proven to be a fact. That didn't mean the Earth did not revolve around the Sun until it was proven. Peoples opinions don't change the facts. His opinion was a fact all along even when it could not be proven. He was right, and they were wrong. There was no in between.

There are standards for what is good and bad in football. There are standards for what we think beauty is. Your opinion might be that this girl is beautiful:

She very well could be attractive to you, and that could be your honest opinion. My opinion is that this girl is very ugly. According to the standards we have set for beauty, my opinion becomes a fact. (any statement strictly true)

Wrong again. Yes, she's/he's ugly, but thats just an opinion. There is no set standard for something being ugly or pretty. She/He may be attractive to someone much uglier than her/him, thus making it an opinion.

I would much rather be talking about football, so this is the last I am going to comment on this.

If I were you, I would've stopped long time ago. Trying to prove a point that just isn't there will increase ur agony.

And just so you know, I've never given this much sh*t to any other poster, not here, not on ganggreen. The only reason I keep coming back at you is because your excuses get lamer by the week, and also because I feel one day you will learn the difference between luck and something thats not luck, and between opinion and facts. :3w:

 

[The New Guy]

Aren't you the one that keeps referring "show me where Jets had an 80 yard TD drive"? You don't watch football. You just look at drive summaries and since summaries are a fact, you then base ur opinion around that fact.

Yep. When I say that a team only scored in the 2nd half when they had good FP, and the other person disagrees, I'll ask them to show me the long drive.

I didn't edit any post. I just cut out the part I was referring to.

You also cut out a part of my statement which completely changes the tone of it. If it didn't, you wouldn't have excluded it.

At what point, does a team become bad from average? Is there a universal standard for that?

You can't know for sure until their season is over. The only thing you can know is how they are playing at that moment. You go from average to bad when you lose more games than you win. I think that is a pretty universal standard.

Wrong again. Yes, she's/he's ugly, but thats just an opinion. There is no set standard for something being ugly or pretty. She/He may be attractive to someone much uglier than her/him, thus making it an opinion.

If I were you, I would've stopped long time ago. Trying to prove a point that just isn't there will increase ur agony.

And just so you know, I've never given this much sh*t to any other poster, not here, not on ganggreen. The only reason I keep coming back at you is because your excuses get lamer by the week, and also because I feel one day you will learn the difference between luck and something thats not luck, and between opinion and facts. :3w:

You don't know it, but you prove my points for me. Fact : (Any statement strictly true)
By the way, I thought you didn't use smiley faces. Isn't that why you had to delete one out of one of my quote? :tubes:

 

[nyjunc]

I'll try to save some time here, the bottom line is the Jets have been one of the best teams in the league the last 2 years and are one again this year. No amount of jealousy from division rivals can change this. You can make all the excuses you want but the proof is in the results.

 

[The New Guy]

I'll try to save some time here, the bottom line is the Jets have been one of the best teams in the league the last 2 years and are one again this year. No amount of jealousy from division rivals can change this. You can make all the excuses you want but the proof is in the results.

I'm not sure how you can say that a team is one of the best when it is 5-3 team with wins against Dal, Mia, Jax, SD, and Buff, a combined 16-24 record. You think the Jets are one of the best teams in the league, and I don't. We will know who is right when the season is over.

 

[nyjunc]

I'm not sure how you can say that a team is one of the best when it is 5-3 team with wins against Dal, Mia, Jax, SD, and Buff, a combined 16-24 record. You think the Jets are one of the best teams in the league, and I don't. We will know who is right when the season is over.

Have you seen the way the Jets are playing lately? did you see the way they dominated a quality team ont he road last week? don't worry so much about the first month where we struggled, this team is getting better every week and they know how to win.

 

[truthbtold]

I'm not sure how you can say that a team is one of the best when it is 5-3 team with wins against Dal, Mia, Jax, SD, and Buff, a combined 16-24 record. You think the Jets are one of the best teams in the league, and I don't. We will know who is right when the season is over.

Here are the facts you don't want to acknowledge ...

First 10 games under the current regime ... 9/13/09 - 11/22/09
Rookie growing pains and struggles for both coach and QB ... 4-6 Record.

Next 36 games ... 11/29/09 - 11/6/11
25-11 record.

Not 15 games ... not 20 games ... not 25 games ... The last 36 TIMES the Jets have taken the field over a two year period they've been the winner 70% of the time. Like Junc said - the proof is in the results.

25 wins -11 losses = ONE OF THE BEST TEAMS IN THE LEAGUE FOR THE PAST TWO YEARS.

What is it about those facts that you don't understand?

 

[bigvince75]

they're playing as good as any team in the AFC right now.

 

[The New Guy]

Have you seen the way the Jets are playing lately? did you see the way they dominated a quality team ont he road last week? don't worry so much about the first month where we struggled, this team is getting better every week and they know how to win.

Didn't you guys tell me that Buff was a 6-10 team at best? Didn't you guys tell me that Buff has the worst D in football? I heard that over and over again, so why are they a quality team now? Didn't you guys tell me how good SD was after you guys beat them, and I said that they were not that good. How are they looking now after 4 straight losses?

Here are the facts you don't want to acknowledge ...

First 10 games under the current regime ... 9/13/09 - 11/22/09
Rookie growing pains and struggles for both coach and QB ... 4-6 Record.

Next 36 games ... 11/29/09 - 11/6/11
25-11 record.

Not 15 games ... not 20 games ... not 25 games ... The last 36 TIMES the Jets have taken the field over a two year period they've been the winner 70% of the time. Like Junc said - the proof is in the results.

25 wins -11 losses = ONE OF THE BEST TEAMS IN THE LEAGUE FOR THE PAST TWO YEARS.

What is it about those facts that you don't understand?

I have no problem with those facts. Here are some more facts for you. In 09 a team laid down for the Jets allowing them in the playoffs. In 10 the Jets only beat 2 teams in the regular season that had a winning record. I don't care about any of that though because it is in the past. I only care about how they are playing right now, and they are not playing like one of the best teams in the league. The proof will be in the Jets playoff results, not in wins against bad and average teams, or what they did in the past.

they're playing as good as any team in the AFC right now.

Then I guess you must consider the Texans, Bills, Bengals, and Raiders as part of the best in the AFC right now. I don't feel those teams are playing at the same level as Bal and Pitt are right now.

 

[JETSJETSJETS]

Didn't you guys tell me that Buff was a 6-10 team at best? Didn't you guys tell me that Buff has the worst D in football? I heard that over and over again, so why are they a quality team now? Didn't you guys tell me how good SD was after you guys beat them, and I said that they were not that good. How are they looking now after 4 straight losses?

According to you, a team becomes bad when they lose more games than they win. Im guessing if the teams win more games than they lose, they become a good team. That's a standard used worldwide, but only according to YOU. Why are you questioning if Buffalo is a good team or not?

I have no problem with those facts. Here are some more facts for you. In 09 a team laid down for the Jets allowing them in the playoffs. In 10 the Jets only beat 2 teams in the regular season that had a winning record. I don't care about any of that though because it is in the past. I only care about how they are playing right now, and they are not playing like one of the best teams in the league. The proof will be in the Jets playoff results, not in wins against bad and average teams, or what they did in the past.

Like when the Jets shut out the Bengals first offense, or like when Manning left the field up 3 points? Even against Manning, Jets had a lead at one point, just a drive before Manning was benched. And just so you know, that is not a fact I highlighted. Its an opinion. Gosh, when are you going to learn?

And in 2010, Jets won FOUR games against teams with winning record, including two in the playoffs. Heres a fact. Jets are the only team to make it to two straight AFCCG in the last two years, and then you say "The proof will be in the Jets playoff results".

Then I guess you must consider the Texans, Bills, Bengals, and Raiders as part of the best in the AFC right now. I don't feel those teams are playing at the same level as Bal and Pitt are right now.

Pittsburgh isn't playing at an elite level. It Baltimore swept them, and even Baltimore lost to teams like Tennessee and Jax, and needed a miraculous comeback against Arizona Cards minus their starting QB.

Just so you know, you can't have 16 teams to be considered one of the best in the league. Thats why I say, when someone says a team is good, its ALWAYS an opinion.

 

[The New Guy]

According to you, a team becomes bad when they lose more games than they win. Im guessing if the teams win more games than they lose, they become a good team. That's a standard used worldwide, but only according to YOU. Why are you questioning if Buffalo is a good team or not?

This is why I grow tired of debating you. You have a serious problem with reading and comprehension. I said:

You can't know for sure until their season is over. The only thing you can know is how they are playing at that moment.

If you only look at the record, Buff is playing winning football at 5-3. I don't just look at records when I judge if a team is good or bad. Just like I told you SD was not that good when they were 4-1. That was my opinion that can only be made a fact at the end of the season.

Like when the Jets shut out the Bengals first offense, or like when Manning left the field up 3 points? Even against Manning, Jets had a lead at one point, just a drive before Manning was benched. And just so you know, that is not a fact I highlighted. Its an opinion. Gosh, when are you going to learn?

A Jets kick return for a TD is the only reason Manning came back out in the 2nd half to take the lead again. When a team puts its best players on the bench for the 2nd half of a game, they are laying down. That is a fact. If you think the Jets would have won that game had the Colts starters stayed in, you are delusional. The Jets could not take care of business against 6-7 Atlanta the week before, but I'm sure they were going to do it against the undefeated Colts.

And in 2010, Jets won FOUR games against teams with winning record, including two in the playoffs. Heres a fact. Jets are the only team to make it to two straight AFCCG in the last two years, and then you say "The proof will be in the Jets playoff results".

Here we go again. I said:

In 10 the Jets only beat 2 teams in the regular season that had a winning record. I don't care about any of that though because it is in the past. I only care about how they are playing right now, and they are not playing like one of the best teams in the league. The proof will be in the Jets playoff results, not in wins against bad and average teams, or what they did in the past.

What the Jets did the last 2 years has nothing to do with this season.

Pittsburgh isn't playing at an elite level. It Baltimore swept them, and even Baltimore lost to teams like Tennessee and Jax, and needed a miraculous comeback against Arizona Cards minus their starting QB.

Just so you know, you can't have 16 teams to be considered one of the best in the league. Thats why I say, when someone says a team is good, its ALWAYS an opinion.

That is why there are playoffs. :crazy: The best 12 teams play against each other to find out who is the best. How do you get in the playoffs? Hint, 1-15 (maybe good according to you) teams don't make it. I guess when people tell me that the Packers were the best team in the leauge last year, I can tell them that is just their opinion. I think the 7-9 dolphins were the best since they played so hard. It is all just opinions, and no one knows who the best team was last year since people's criteria for the best team can vary. :crazy:

I'm glad you think everything is just an opinion. Since that is the case, please stop giving me your opinion. I could care less about your opinions since they are always wrong. :up: