Ronnie Brown's Injury and the Cincinatti Bengals | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Ronnie Brown's Injury and the Cincinatti Bengals

JCane

JCane

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You have to begin looking at Ronnie's injury and the big picture. We all understand that Ronnie Brown is the best player on the team and that the success and execution of the Wildcat begins and ends with him. Ricky Williams does not execute the Wildcat quite like Ronnie does. These are just eyeball facts.

Some of you love Pat White. Some of you hate Pat White. Some of you love Chad Henne. Some of you hate Chad Henne. But who really believes that this team has a better chance of winning with Pat White running the Wildcat as opposed to Chad Henne going out there and winning football games with his arms like a quarterback should do? Be honest. Put down the Kool-Aid. Take off those Dan Marino pajamas and put on your big boy pants.

I think Coach Sparano wants to develop the talent that he has on this team and progress slowly—and I'm fine with that. However, I think we're moving a bit too slow. Chad Henne needs to be trusted with his big arm more. Now, with Ronnie's injury diminishing the success of the Wildcat, Coach Sparano's hands are tied. He's all but forced to put more faith in his quarterback's ability to throw the football and make smart decisions with the football. I simply can't see us employing the use of the Widcat against Carolina as often as we have been with Ronnie Brown in the lineup.

So turn to the Cincinnati Bengals; an NFL bottom feeder for the majority of a decade and a team stricken with players with poor judgment. Bengal players were hauled off to jail at alarming rates. Questions circled Marvin Lewis and his ability as an NFL head coach. The Bengals were a laughing stock.

But last year Carson Palmer suffered a ligament injury in his arm and played only four games in 2008. The Bengals, without their star quarterback, went 4 - 11 - 1 with backup quarterback Ryan Fitzgerald. Marvin Lewis had no choice but to turn to running back Cedric Benson.

My point is, the Bengals were forced to learn how to run the football. And with Carson Palmer on the sidelines with an injury, they learned how to run the football as a team.

Have a look at the Cincinnati Bengals today. They're 7 - 2. They’re first in their division. They've beaten their two biggest division rivals—TWICE. If it weren't for some miracle tip to Brandon Stokley in week one, the Bengals would have beaten the Broncos and would now be sitting at 8 - 1. You can make the argument that the Bengals are the front runners to get to the Super Bowl. They could very easily host the AFC Championship. The Bengals knew how to throw the football with Carson Palmer and Chad Ochocinco all along. It was just a matter of establishing a power running game and they've done that and did so by being forced to.

Ronnie's injury could be a blessing in disguise. Short term this isn't a good thing, no. And I know we all want to win now but you take what you get and you do what you can with what you have. Right now, we're not a great football team but we're headed in the right direction. If Ronnie is out for any significant amount of time, Chad Henne will be asked to win football games and that's what the team needs. It's time to get out of shallow water and take the plunge with Henne.
 
If your hope for the Dolphins rests on Henne then you are going to plunge.

I have no intention of putting my hope in Henne. He isn't that good. He never has been. He never will be.

He may be our best choice for the time being, but he is never going to carry a team like Brady or Manning or Favre or Marino or many many others; he just isn't on that level, and shows no sign that ever will be.

He isn't bad...............he just isn't plunge worthy.
 
Henne doesn't worry me. What worries me is he seems to have NO ONE to throw to.
 
Good post Cane, I agree for the most part with your assessments. The only flaw I see in your theory would be:

It's possible they have told Henne to go deeper with some passes and with our WR's it just hasn't been there. I find it hard to believe the loss of our top RB is gonna in some way free up our wideouts.

I can see them opening up the pass game in the same way we use to with Fiedler/Penny and that means a lot of underneath stuff. They did that with Fiedler and Penny because of a lack of arm, they will have to do it with Henne because of a lack of receivers. It's not a knock on Henne it's just a reality.

I do agree with your idea that in the long run the experience of being depended on more and simply being on the field for more snaps is only going to help him going forward. Hell even playing with no #1 WR might end up being good for him in the long run because when he does get one he will be that much sharper. As it stands now he has to throw the ball into a mailbox sized hole, these guys don't get any separation besides Ginn and I'm sure Henne would love to hit a guy in the hands long and he actually pull it in.

So while I agree this is good for Henne long term it is also bad for the team short term. Which who we fooling this is still a team in the middle of a major rebuild and any winning we see now is just a bonus. Plus I don't think we want to lose to much because those high 1st rounders cost so much more and most of the time you can get just as much value in the later 1st especially with a guy like Parcells scoping out the talent.

I left the your Bengals premise out of my review because I just didn't really get the connection you were trying to make there. Kind of an apples and oranges thing, at least for me.
 
Elliott 1 said:
If your hope for the Dolphins rests on Henne then you are going to plunge.

I have no intention of putting my hope in Henne. He isn't that good. He never has been. He never will be.

He may be our best choice for the time being, but he is never going to carry a team like Brady or Manning or Favre or Marino or many many others; he just isn't on that level, and shows no sign that ever will be.

He isn't bad...............he just isn't plunge worthy.
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Give this guy some weapons and he will be a top end QB on the same level as Rivers and Big Ben. I'm not totally sold on him being a Manning, Brady or Brees level guy but I'd be thrilled with upper level II. The system Parcells has laid the tracks for doesn't require a top of the heap kind of QB. Look at Sims, Hostetler, Testaverde, Bledsoe and Penny. All of these guys had success under Parcells system and none were putting up record breaking numbers.
 
You say Favre, Manning ,Brady like those guys come along all the time..
Those are 3 of the best qb's to strap it up.

The thought is with the solid foundation we are laying down for a team, Henne looks more than able to me to be a solid NFL qb
 
I understand the Cincy comparison, I agree the more snaps Henne gets the better he will become. It's possible that That Henne may become a Brady/Manning type sometime down the road, just like Flaco and Ryan, too early to tell with either of them. However I feel we now have some stability at the QB position.
 
I personally like Henne and think he is going to be a good qb. Hes big, good arm, hes not wildly erratic considering this is his first significant playing time and I think he stands well in the pocket and has a pretty good feel when he is there. He does hold the ball too long at times but that can be corrected.

I would be fine if he was a Ben or Rivers, but even those guys have playmakers on the outside. Everyone forgets, Brady was a mid 20's touchdown a season guy before he got an elite receiver like Moss and a perfect complimentary piece in Welker. You could argue he was a game manager but obviously could get in a shoot out if he had to. Look at Manning, as good as he is, he has never had a good season without having a top 5 receiver in the game to throw too. Now to make things better he has a top 5 tight end.

Bottom line, not one qb we bring in here will be worth a damn without guys on the outside tomake plays. We cant play parcells ball of the late 80's and 90's unless we have a DOMINANT defense and even with that, in this day and age of the league being so heavily predicated on qbs and the big play, we have to be able to score from anywhere on the field. We cant go through the next 5-10 years trying to be an 70-80 yd , 8 minute drive type of offense. We have to be able to score with teams, period.
 
It's not about Chad Henne. It's about learning as a team. Chad Henne has to step up and make throws and these receivers in turn have to learn how to run routes and how to catch balls and how to make adjustments. That's the whole thing about the Bengals is that without their top threat Carson Palmer, they had to find other ways to win footballs games and they did so because they were forced to learn how to run the football as a team. And that's why the Bengals can go on the road and beat division opponents now. Without the power running game, they're simply just another one dimensional team with a .500 record.

Ronnie Brown's injury FORCES us to play a different dimension of football. A dimension we NEED to learn in order to go deep in this league. Otherwise, we're stuck peddling in a hamster wheel.
 
JCane said:
It's not about Chad Henne. It's about learning as a team. Chad Henne has to step up and make throws and these receivers in turn have to learn how to run routes and how to catch balls and how to make adjustments. That's the whole thing about the Bengals is that without their top threat Carson Palmer, they had to find other ways to win footballs games and they did so because they were forced to learn how to run the football as a team. And that's why the Bengals can go on the road and beat division opponents now. Without the power running game, they're simply just another one dimensional team with a .500 record.

Ronnie Brown's injury FORCES us to play a different dimension of football. A dimension we NEED to learn in order to go deep in this league. Otherwise, we're stuck peddling in a hamster wheel.
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The Bengals were 29th in the league in rushing yardage in 2008, so I don't know about them learning how to run the ball without Palmer last year. This year Benson stepped up and is 6th in the league in rushing yards, 2 yards away from being 4th. The Bengals have drafted well recently and you have to tip your hat to their defense in terms of the team's overall success.

The problem is that we don't have a Benson, so to speak, who can step up in our WR core. Ginn is sitting at a cool #81 in the receiving yards rankings. Until we get the horses for it our passing game most likely isn't going anywhere.
 
jim1 said:
The Bengals were 29th in the league in rushing yardage in 2008, so I don't know about them learning how to run the ball without Palmer last year. This year Benson stepped up and is 6th in the league in rushing yards, 2 yards away from being 4th. The Bengals have drafted well recently and you have to tip your hat to their defense in terms of the team's overall success.

The problem is that we don't have a Benson, so to speak, who can step up in our WR core. Ginn is sitting at a cool #81 in the receiving yards rankings. Until we get the horses for it our passing game most likely isn't going anywhere.
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Well that makes all the sense in the world doesn't it? Of course they were awful against the run last season. That's all they could do. Defenses would stack 8 or 9 in the box and attack. The Bengals continued to pound the football into the teeth of a defense. Big picture. Look at the Bengals today. We don't benefit at all from Brown's injury tomorrow. But in the future, you'll see that Brown's injury helped with the progress of Henne. Without the injury, we continue to be conservative with Chad Henne and we slow roll his development. Same thing applies to the Bengals. Without Palmer's injury, they continue to abandon the running game and continue to be mired in mediocrity this season. Marvin Lewis didn't suddenly wake up a great coach and the Bengals didn't wake up and eat a good breakfast and *poof* they're a great football team. They used a big time injury as a learning experience. It's as simple as that. You've seen the model work first hand with the Bengals. Why can't the Miami football Dolphins do the same?
 
JCane said:
Well that makes all the sense in the world doesn't it? Of course they were awful against the run last season. That's all they could do. Defenses would stack 8 or 9 in the box and attack. The Bengals continued to pound the football into the teeth of a defense. Big picture. Look at the Bengals today. We don't benefit at all from Brown's injury tomorrow. But in the future, you'll see that Brown's injury helped with the progress of Henne. Without the injury, we continue to be conservative with Chad Henne and we slow roll his development. Same thing applies to the Bengals. Without Palmer's injury, they continue to abandon the running game and continue to be mired in mediocrity this season. Marvin Lewis didn't suddenly wake up a great coach and the Bengals didn't wake up and eat a good breakfast and *poof* they're a great football team. They used a big time injury as a learning experience. It's as simple as that. You've seen the model work first hand with the Bengals. Why can't the Miami football Dolphins do the same?
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Cane I get what your trying to say but it just doesn't work. Like I said apples and oranges. There is a big difference between losing your QB and losing your RB especially one that also runs an entire package (wildcat)

A team can rally and decide to commit to the run when they lose a QB a lot easier then a team can just decide to start throwing the ball around when they don't have the weapons to do so. Besides it's not like Ricky is as big of a downgrade from Ronnie as Fitzpatrick was from Palmer. The problem might be that Hillard is a big drop off from Ricky though.
 
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