Rosen or Take QB with 1st Rd Pick, NOT BOTH

[Ferretsquig]

How was it a waste of resources by the Chargers? By taking a QB with the top pick they were able to flip that into Philip Rivers, a 3rd round pick (65), 1st round pick in 2005 (12th overall) and a 5th round pick in 2005 (144).

It was a waste because Brees could have been throwing the ball to Fitzgerald. They drafted exceptionally well, and I love Rivers despite all of his faults. But the fact remains that they let a hall of famer walk and they passed up on another in order to replace the first. That hurts.

We traded a 2nd round pick for Rosen 62nd overall and a 2020 5th round pick. If we end up drafting Tua with the 1st overall pick next year it would no different than the following teams draft strategy.

Panthers: 2010-2-48 Jimmy Clausen--2011-1-1-Cam Newton
Browns: 2017-2-52-Deshon Kizer--2018-1-1-Baker Mayfield
Lions: 2007-2-43-Drew Stanton--2008-1-1-Matthew Stafford

What does one situation have to do with the other? Is it supposed to be a good thing that all these teams wasted second round picks on terrible quarterbacks and felt compelled to draft another a year later?

If Rosen turns out to be a bust and the front office feels compelled to draft a quarterback that's a failure and should be viewed that way. The quality of the quarterback selected in the subsequent draft doesn't have anything to do with that. Most people, including myself, view it as a worthwhile risk but its a risk nonetheless. Just like Clausen was with the Panthers. At the time most of us saw that as a good value pick. In hindsight not so much......Sean Lee would have looked good in blue.

We can all go back in history and find all sorts of examples of past successes and failures but none of it has anything to do with the path Grier must forge going forward. If he fails at everything except finding a franchise signal caller the team will be better for it in the long run. That doesn't mean hes a good GM and deserves to keep his job.

 

[EasyRider]

Yes I did, as this thread garnered a lot of conversation.

All you did was copy my thread basically. Not offended but come up with your own idea, how bout that

 

[phins_4_ever]

You take Tua and if Rosen beats him out you trade him for a 1st. If its close and both are great prospects u trade 1 for multiple picks. If they are both just good trade for a 1st or 2nd pick.

Still got a 1st for Minkah

Minkah didn't lose his job. He wanted to be traded.
@Tiffany1981 is right. If Rosen would beat out Tua or any other QB we have taken with our first pick that QB will lose its value immediately.

There will be no drafting a QB and keeping Rosen. If we draft a QB it will only be because this coaching staff feels like they have reached the limit with Rosen and he is not good enough to be a starter. Rosen would be leaving us. It would be deja vue for Rosen.

 

[Feverdream]

There is a mock draft over at CBS; the writer has us taking a DE, then an OT, then a Center.

IF (and that is an if) Rosen looks good... this is very plausible.

 

[Mach2]

Minkah didn't lose his job. He wanted to be traded.
@Tiffany1981 is right. If Rosen would beat out Tua or any other QB we have taken with our first pick that QB will lose its value immediately.

There will be no drafting a QB and keeping Rosen. If we draft a QB it will only be because this coaching staff feels like they have reached the limit with Rosen and he is not good enough to be a starter. Rosen would be leaving us. It would be deja vue for Rosen.

That's way too many "absolute" conclusions, unless you can read Flores/Griers minds.

Even if we do draft Tua, or anyone else for that matter, what leads you to believe they will be ready to start, and be ahead of Rosen, after he has a year in the system? Could be "xyz" QB sits a season, or a half season, before he has learned the Offense.

Surely you don't want to draft a guy in rd1, then throw him out there before he develops the tools to be successful, do you?

 

[phins_4_ever]

That's way too many "absolute" conclusions, unless you can read Flores/Griers minds.

Even if we do draft Tua, or anyone else for that matter, what leads you to believe they will be ready to start, and be ahead of Rosen, after he has a year in the system? Could be "xyz" QB sits a season, or a half season, before he has learned the Offense.

Surely you don't want to draft a guy in rd1, then throw him out there before he develops the tools to be successful, do you?

I am a huge proponent of having a drafted QB sit first. But I would do that behind a vet. Rosen is too young to be a mentor especially when you draft his possible future replacement. You cannot ask a guy at 22 or 23 to mentor a drafted QB when your own development has not come to full fruition yet. In that case they probably would let the draft pick sit behind Fitzpatrick or another vet they might pick up.

 

[Mach2]

I am a huge proponent of having a drafted QB sit first. But I would do that behind a vet. Rosen is too young to be a mentor especially when you draft his possible future replacement. You cannot ask a guy at 22 or 23 to mentor a drafted QB when your own development has not come to full fruition yet. In that case they probably would let the draft pick sit behind Fitzpatrick or another vet they might pick up.

Possible, but then the whole theory about getting something for Rosen goes out the window. I don't think you cut him, nor do I think you let him go for peanuts. We can have a third QB on the roster to "mentor" a rookie. That's not that big of a deal. It's not like he would be taking a roster spot from a proven player, if Flo feels strongly about having a vet presence in the QB room.

 

[phintim]

If the Dolphins take Tua, and he can't beat out Rosen (who you got for a 2nd round pick) no one will give you a 1st or a 2nd! If you aren't good enough to play for Miami, why would any team give you anything?

Rosen could be that good and Tua would definitely be worth that and mores. QB are worth their weight in gold. We got a 2nd for Welker.

 

[Gonzofinfan]

Possible, but then the whole theory about getting something for Rosen goes out the window. I don't think you cut him, nor do I think you let him go for peanuts. We can have a third QB on the roster to "mentor" a rookie. That's not that big of a deal. It's not like he would be taking a roster spot from a proven player, if Flo feels strongly about having a vet presence in the QB room.

I don't even know if we need a mentor QB, We got dan freaking marino working for the fins

 

[Mach2]

I don't even know if we need a mentor QB, We got dan freaking marino working for the fins

I understand the point, but I seriously doubt Dan is going to sit in on meetings, and film sessions, breaking down undividual plays on a regular basis.

Moral support, and words of wisdom are one thing, but that's not how I understand the term "mentor".

 

[GG.exe]

Also...look at Denver. Elway (a great QB) is the GM and he can't even draft one to save his life.

 

[Kamelion4291]

And you would have ripped my *** if I said we scored 40 points a game. And no, I didn't see the game, because unfortunately, I have a job that I work every Sunday. I don't live and breathe football. It's entertainment. I was just implying that if Rosen is respectable, with this o line, etc, he deserves another season. I would rather build the rest of the team around a serviceable QB. How many super bowl wins did we have with Marino???? It takes a TEAM.

Oh my god, the "I have priorities therefore I can't be bothered to base my forum opinions on facts and will therefore justify my ignorance" argument.

Aside from that outrageously cringy comment, personally I'd rather get a great QB and then build the rest of the team rather than stick with a "serviceable" QB and save myself one whole pick in the process, but I must be crazy...

 

[DolfanISS]

To me it's too early to have this discussion. I'd like to see a complete body or work for Rosen in this system before making this call. I was hoping we'd eventually get better OL play even if it is marginal but the injury bug seems to be crushing any hope we had at continuity as we're losing offensive lineman on a weekly basis. It would be nice if Rosen's pals could help him out a bit, none of our soap handed wideouts are doing Josh any favors.

 

[Ray R]

A QB doesn't have to be a bust to be replaced.

As long as a team keeps testing the water with new potential QB's, sooner or later they will find one better then the one they are playing. That is a good thing.

It may take two or three years to evaluate and train an upcoming potential replacement. In the mean time, that potential replacement will be the backup QB. This is the way it should be at every position.

One unique feature about the QB position, is it often has a longer career potential then most of the other positions. This is why a potential replacement may need to play second fiddle for a few years. If the primary QB keeps playing at a very high level, we can trade off the backup for a draft pick and possibly another player. At this point the 3rd string QB becomes your second string QB while the team improves at each position the QB search continues. This kind of replenishment should go on forever.

 

[BlueFin]

Both