Running Back "Controversy"

Agent51

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OK, here is a question I have been wondering since day 1 of the draft talks:

WHY is everyone so adamant about Ronnie Brown for us? Not only people on the boards but even the "professional analysts" give us Brown without a second thought. Let's compare the two best choices at RB for us here (Brown and Cedric Benson)

Ronnie Brown (6'0", 233lbs):

Pros - Size, Speed, and Power, said to be built like a fullback but with the speed of a tailback. Great acceleration. "Will finish every run". Great recieving skills, said to have "WR-caliber hands" and can make adjustments on the ball and cath em downfield. Has great instincts in reading the rush, and is willing to block. Great character and leadership qualities.

Cons - Not very elusive, he's a pretty "straight ahead" runner. Lacks great instinct at finding the hole, doesn't have the 'vision' that most great RBs have. Not a great initial burts either. The most important con on Ronnie however would be that he has never been a feature back. They key thing here is Miami isn't JUST looking for a running back, we are looking for a WORKHORSE. We need someone to take the heat of AJ so he can get the ball to Chris and Randy and Marty and maybe David Boston if he comes back. Ricky was a workhorse for us. Ronnie Brown has never carried more than 175 times in a season, that's only an average of 15 carries a game, and thats in the SHORTER college season. How is someone who has never been a full time starter or feature back, or carried more than 15 times a game going to step in and carry the ball at least DOUBLE that EVERY GAME for SIXTEEN GAMES for us without getting injured or worn down? Not to mention he has been injured before, in a shorter season at a lower level of football while not even taking all the carries. THOSE are the most important stats to evaluate when it comes to Brown, yeah, his combine and workout numbers are amazing, as were his college numbers for someone who split time and never STARTED over 7 games in a season, but that is also his biggest drawback, I don't think he can handle the workload that Miami will need him to. I think he would be a better fit in another system that has a RB already where he can sit out a season or two, or at least split time, gradually moving into full time starter and feature back, in order for his body to adjust.

Cedric Benson (5'10, 225lbs):

Pros - "Classic workhorse back". Tough guy who is USED to carrying 20-25 times a game. Can "erode" defenses in the 4th. VERY durable and will play hurt. Runs low and powers through tackles. Great cutback ability. Good body control. Has patience and great vision. CAN EXPLODE THROUGH HOLES AND CREATE OPENINGS WHEN HIS BLOCKING FAILS (perfect for Miami, since our O-Line is nothing to write home about). "In terms of career production and workload, he is the most proven tailback in the draft". PLUS, this guy IDOLIZES Ricky Williams and modeled his game after him (obviosuly not the weed thing) and Ricky fit PERFECTLY into our system, he was a workhorse back with big play capabilites, plus the toughness and power to plow through people AND the moves to make tem miss, exactly what Benson is, exactly what we NEED.

Cons - Not as agile as Brown. Some trouble route running. Some fumble trouble last year.

How all the mock drafts have Brown being taken at #2 instead of Benson is beyond me, unless they are purely based on workouts and the combine. Benson has better carreer #s and better fits OUR system. We don't need a guy that is gonna split time or a guy that can't handle the workload, we need a guy that will carry our workload and carry it effectively, through all 16 games AND the post season if we make it. Even if Brown started off strong he would taper off towards mid season, cuz mid season with all the carries he'd be getting would be like a whole season splitting time at Auburn. We don't have time to nurse a RB along to condition him for the NFL, maybe if we had a starter right now we could take Ronnie and mold him for a year or two and gradually ease him in, but we don't, we need a guy that will hop in, can handle the work, and will make a difference right away, and that is Cedric Benson, not Ronnie Brown.
 

inFINSible

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Was EJ supposed to go ahead of Ricky in their draft??
A RB who can catch out of the backfield and pass block fits Linehan's system better.
 

NJ_Fin_Fan

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inFINSible said:
Was EJ supposed to go ahead of Ricky in their draft??
A RB who can catch out of the backfield and pass block fits Linehan's system better.
That's the point I was going to make... it's all about the system. The flaw to your theory, Agent51, is that you're saying he fits well into the Miami system that Ricky worked well in... that system no longer exists. Linehan's system (pass to set up run) is here now, and it is COMPLETELY different than the old Miami system (run all the time, to occasionally set up the pass).
 

HysterikiLL

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Pros, Cons, Mock Drafts, I don't give a damn. When I see Ronnie run, I just see this fresh cut runner, somebody who I feel reminds me exactly of how I felt Ladanian was going into his year.

I just can't see Ronnie failing in this system. All these questions about can he carry the ball as a full feature back....BLAH!!!!!!!!! This is a professional sport. Professional adaptations will need to be made and professional players will make professional adaptations.

Also, I strongly disagree with all this talk of him being a "straight ahead" runner. He had great shuttle times and when I watch some of the cuts he makes, I don't know how he is just a straight ahead runner. I think the more common reprise would be that he is a "downhill runner" and who wants to stand in front of a Hummer going down hill at 4.43 seconds?
 

csabe

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inFINSible said:
Was EJ supposed to go ahead of Ricky in their draft??
A RB who can catch out of the backfield and pass block fits Linehan's system better.
:yeahthat:
 

Agent51

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That being said, since Benson is rated lower on the boards, we SHOULD trade down and try to pick up another pick and take Benson a little lower. Most I've seen have hime going to Arizona at #8, so going by that formula we need to drop between 3 and 7 to still get him, or even 8 because if we drop that means Brown will still be there so Arizona, or any team after us that wants a RB too, can take Brown. Not only would getting Benson later than #2 give us an extra pick (or two, depnding on the deal) it would also save us money. I don't care WHAT people say, running back is the only way to go in round 1. We spent a 2nd rounder on AJ, and while I don't agree with it, for that much we need to at least give him another shot, so even if we took a QB it should be in the later rounds so we can groom him to take over one day while AJ still starts now. We also don't need a first round WR, there is enough talent to get our back AND a good WR in the second, or maybe even 3rd round. If we took a RB in the first, a WR like Roscoe Parrish or Troy Williamson in the 2nd (if available) and a QB in the third like Adrian McPherson (hopefully he drops, we DO have the 6th pick in round three, so its nice and early) or Stefen LeFors, or even one of the projected 2nd rounders like Charlie Frye, Jason Campbell, or Andrew Walter, maybe even Kyle Orton (unless we can wait til round 4 for him), then we would have a GREAT foundation for a future Super Bowl contention team. Three great young talents at historically our three worst positions (minus the Marino and Griese years at QB), combined with the reciving and defensive talents already in place.
 

Agent51

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HysterikiLL said:
Pros, Cons, Mock Drafts, I don't give a damn. When I see Ronnie run, I just see this fresh cut runner, somebody who I feel reminds me exactly of how I felt Ladanian was going into his year.

I just can't see Ronnie failing in this system. All these questions about can he carry the ball as a full feature back....BLAH!!!!!!!!! This is a professional sport. Professional adaptations will need to be made and professional players will make professional adaptations.

Also, I strongly disagree with all this talk of him being a "straight ahead" runner. He had great shuttle times and when I watch some of the cuts he makes, I don't know how he is just a straight ahead runner. I think the more common reprise would be that he is a "downhill runner" and who wants to stand in front of a Hummer going down hill at 4.43 seconds?
I didn't say straight ahead runner, those pros and cons were compliations from various draft sites such as NFL.com, espn, sportsline, and cnnsi. Look, I will be HAPPY with either runner, but I'd PREFER Benson. I did kinda forget about the new system when writing that, but still, I just have some worries about Ronnie's durability and ability to last and carry the load. Also, the "pass to set up the run" system is all fine and dandy, except look at our QB, and our O-Line. We can't pass to set up the run if they can't block so AJ doesn't get sacked and if AJ can't throw the ball. The thing I like about Benson, aside from his workload capabilites and his durability, is that if there isn't a hole he will MAKE a hole, and I think thats a quality we desperately need at this point with the lack of an effective O-Line, we all saw what happened last year, to the RBs and QBs. our O-Line did NOTHING to protect em so new gameplan or not, we need a guy that can MAKE holes where there aren't in the current state of our line.
 

Agent51

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well Benson isn't going to be splitting time with another RB so that should be a problem. I am a diehard longhorns fan, so I have naturally followed his career, he may liek the ball but he isn't a keyshawn johnson, he isn't gonna get in saban's face if he doesn't get the ball
 

arsenal

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benson gets an unfair rep i think... and people act like linehans system needs a back who has hands like randy moss... benson can catch balls out of the backfield, just cause hes not gonna beat a cornerback on an out pattern doesn't matter to me cause thats not what they are going to ask of him... and we already have a great pass catching back in gordon who is also a good blocker... id take the best runner of the group, benson is that guy... and he can catch the swing passes and screens and dump offs that are in linehans system fine... but hes also gonna rush for more yards which as i remember is the key factor for a running back... RUNNING THE BALL
 

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I'd prefer to draft Benson or Williams. From what I saw from Williams he's a great runner too. I'd be much easier to get a half back to put on around 10 pounds than to teach him how to be elusive.

If neither, I'd like to see us take someone like JJ Arrington in the 3rd. He looked good from what I saw also.
 

PhinstiGator

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Agent51 said:
Ronnie Brown (6'0", 233lbs):

Pros - Has great instincts and is willing to block.

Cons - Lacks great instincts and doesn't have the "vision" that most of the great RBs have.
Something is instinctively wrong about this post.
 

Agent51

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arsenal said:
benson gets an unfair rep i think... and people act like linehans system needs a back who has hands like randy moss... benson can catch balls out of the backfield, just cause hes not gonna beat a cornerback on an out pattern doesn't matter to me cause thats not what they are going to ask of him... and we already have a great pass catching back in gordon who is also a good blocker... id take the best runner of the group, benson is that guy... and he can catch the swing passes and screens and dump offs that are in linehans system fine... but hes also gonna rush for more yards which as i remember is the key factor for a running back... RUNNING THE BALL
EXACTLY, jeez, good to see ONE other fan who wants Benson too. Plus, I was just coming here to post that I was reading some more scouting reports and came across the following:

"Benson is an effective receiver out of the backfield and would give a club a ball control presence needed to keep quarterbacks healthy."

So now that Brown's recieving edge is taken away and they are back to a level playing field with most of the other pros and cons, back into play comes the durability and workhorse factor, and Bensone BY FAR wins that. He is getting a bad rap cuz of an "average" Pro Day, but since when does running some drills on ONE DAY of your career determine the tpye of player you are overall? Just look at what this guy did in college:

One of only THREE players in NCAA HISTORY to rush for more than 5,000yds and score more than 400 points in his career. 2nd in school history with 6,161 all-purpose yards and 1st Longhorn to rush for 1,000yds in four seasons and run for 12 or more TDs each year. 5,540 yds and 64 TDs on 1,112 attempts (that's a 4.98yds per carry avg). Only 84 attempts of the 1,112 were for a loss (that's only SEVEN %!). 56% of his yards were after contact (that's 3,203.7 yds after contact). Had 100 yds or more in 25 games.

He has TWICE the career rushing attempts as Brown and almost FOUR-HUNDRED more than Williams, I THINK he is perfectly capable of handling the load, with NO doubts or questions. I don't care who you are, casual fan, die hard fan, "expert analst", NFL scout, head coach, you have to have SOME thought on the durability of Brown
 
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