Slim Reaper comes in at 6’ and 166 pounds. | Page 32 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Slim Reaper comes in at 6’ and 166 pounds.

Do you have any second thoughts/reservations about drafting 'The Slim Reaper' when he's 166lbs?


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Still waiting to hear how it changes in the NFL.

If a corner can't press him despite being able to put up 225 18-19 times, how does that change in the NFL? Is there a magical cutoff where press starts working relative to a strength metric?
Really, still waiting on how the NFL is different? Ask Tim Tebow for one. Everything tightens up, not just the corner across from him and even stud 1st rounders like Surtain and Horn more often than not take a few years to reach their potential. He will be going from a stacked team that over matches almost every single opponent to an NFL team that lives in the land of parity. How will he do when his team doesn't have a good running threat and the QB has to get rid of the ball 2 seconds faster than Jones or Tua ever had to? While doubled? Point is the greatness of Alabama currently can easily pump up some of their prospects because we are watching them make big plays in big games down the stretch but that doesn't always translate to the league in the same dominating fashion. DJ Fluker was a 1st rounder years back and now we pick him up and I'm reading theads that he's a chump, JAG, etc. So it's not just his weight because of potential injuries or press problems as so many are focused on, it's the total package and again we are parsing degrees between the very top players in this draft. He's great and will go high but potentially first or second non QB in this draft? Ignoring the very outlier size here would be irresponsible that high in the draft even if you are sold his game will translate. A little lower where everyone has a red flag pretty much, sure.
 
Really, still waiting on how the NFL is different? Ask Tim Tebow for one. Everything tightens up, not just the corner across from him and even stud 1st rounders like Surtain and Horn more often than not take a few years to reach their potential. He will be going from a stacked team that over matches almost every single opponent to an NFL team that lives in the land of parity. How will he do when his team doesn't have a good running threat and the QB has to get rid of the ball 2 seconds faster than Jones or Tua ever had to? While doubled? Point is the greatness of Alabama currently can easily pump up some of their prospects because we are watching them make big plays in big games down the stretch but that doesn't always translate to the league in the same dominating fashion. DJ Fluker was a 1st rounder years back and now we pick him up and I'm reading theads that he's a chump, JAG, etc. So it's not just his weight because of potential injuries or press problems as so many are focused on, it's the total package and again we are parsing degrees between the very top players in this draft. He's great and will go high but potentially first or second non QB in this draft? Ignoring the very outlier size here would be irresponsible that high in the draft even if you are sold his game will translate. A little lower where everyone has a red flag pretty much, sure.
Tim Tebow wasn't accurate. It's not a problem in college when Percy Harvin was running free, but it's a problem when your guys are covered and you don't have a gigantic area that you can throw to.

It's different when the argument is "better corners will press him and have success doing so". I mean, we're not talking about something that's super difficult here. You get your hands on someone and push/stop them from moving. You either have the strength to do that or you don't. Since Smith was the best WR in college football against press and he only weighs in the mid 160s, it's not a big assumption to make that maybe his success against it has nothing to do with the opposing corner's strength and has more to do with his own ability to avoid it. The latter is transferable to the NFL yet people only assume that the former is the only variable here.
 
Right but Tebow was taken in the 1st anyway because of the insane college production, Heisman, NC winning plays, the "it" factor and intangibles. These I believe are the same primary reasons we selected Tua last year over Herbert's protypical arm and size and I believe the primary reasons someone might take Smith ahead of say Pitts who is 80 lbs heavier, 6 inches taller, and faster to boot! I just don't think we make a living by always trying to find that outlier gem and passing on prototype talented players for the "it" factor/intangible guy. You want to have an open mind and not always go prototype but you should be most of the time.
 
Are corners better in the NFL than most he faces in college, week in, week out?

Either way, Chase and Waddle are my preference for Pure WR's.
2/3 of the corners he faced might never play in the pros, But it is on the same level of competition. 😂
 
If Smith puts on 15-20lbs he's not gonna be the same player.
Uh.... 15 pounds of muscle and the only effect it has is he will be stronger and be able to take more punishment ... He'll still have all his skillset. If he doesn't put on 15 pounds of muscle I'd be shocked.


 
Bill Polian suggested that with a lean body, you might be able to add 5-7 lbs of muscle...
 
Makes you wonder why he is still 166lbs at 6', then! It was rather a joke about the S&C program being bad, honestly!
Maybe they felt he was perfect playing at that weight. He missed a half of one game with a broken finger after destroying the Ohio state defense in the first half. Other than his broken finger, he didn’t miss any games in 3 years at Alabama because of injury.

Not many players can play three years in the SEC at the level Smith did and not miss some games because of injury. Pitts missed three games last year due to injuries and I don’t see anyone questioning if he will hold up in the NFL because of his size and weight.
 
I was hesitant to share this chart I did yesterday on Harmon's analysis because I didn't know if I could, but I will post this comparison since his other stuff is out there.

Any analysis method is a work in progress. Still, I find it encouraging when I read this statement from Harmon, " Among the 270-plus players charted in Reception Perception history, only one of the wide receivers has cleared the 90th percentile in success rate vs. man coverage and never had a 1,000-yard season in the NFL. That’s Curtis Samuel, who did record 1,000 total yards for the Panthers in 2020. Pretty close, right? At least we know he’s good."

So for me, after seeing this comparison and taking in other evaluations of Smith, he's my guy. I am not saying we shouldn't consider his weight; however, I think his success rate among man, zone, and the press is enough to convince me that his skill set is so varied and special that we can find a way to use him successfully.


View attachment 74450

Note: In his analysis, Harmon defines success as: "A success is charted when a receiver “gets open” against the coverage. Creating separation, enough for the quarterback to have a reasonable target, is marked as a success. The only plays that are automatically given as success to the receiver are instances where a receiver is obviously held or interfered with (called or not). These plays make a big difference to an offense, and signify a receiver winning yards for his team by forcing the defensive back to hold him." Since the standard is the same for every WR, it is a fair analysis, in my opinion.
Thanks you for this! Interesting stuff though I wouldnt put to much stock in categories where the %of route run is under ~10-15%... This makes for a very limited sample size. IMO.
Of course it's a serious statistic.

The problem is when someone tries to indicate a direct correlation to weight and injury with statistics like this. I certainly wasn't trying to do that as I stated it was impossible to tell if the injuries were related to the player's weight.

My personal opinion is that I think a player's weight matters to some degree, any athlete that is in a competitive sport requiring direct physical contact would probably benefit by being as big and strong as they could be without sacrificing abilities like speed and dexterity.
Here's an article about a research on exactly that. You'll be surprised by the results.
 
Yeah... Polian wouldn't know anything about athletes or their bodies.

(rolls eyes)

He has no clue about Smiths body. My job is literally performance training athletes. From middle school to professionals. Bodies are not the same from one to the next. Polian has no clue obviously or he wouldn’t make that statement.
 
I’m no expert, but I knew hundreds of athletes growing up (and was one), and I never, ever heard of a 6-foot, 166-pound athlete trying and failing to get up to 175-180. Plenty of guys never tried and hovered around 165, but anyone I ever knew who made a serious effort to add bulk to a 6-foot frame under 170 pounds had no problem doing it. That includes myself.

Maybe I’m just ignorant, but I don’t understand how this is even a question. It’s science. If the dude eats X amount of calories a day, he’s going to gain weight. Just seems like it hasn’t been a focus to this point.
 
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