Slimm's 2020 Quarterbacks (underclassman) | Page 32 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Slimm's 2020 Quarterbacks (underclassman)

Herbert - to me - is most similar to Wentz. I think there will always be frustrating aspects of his game, and his ceiling isn't what his physical tools suggest. Still, those tools are enough to work with.

Love has a higher ceiling - is a more natural passer. The Mahomes comparisons make a lot of sense. If Love didn't lose his playcaller and pretty much his entire offense between 2018 and 2019, the narrative would be different. My biggest concern with Love is that even though his 2019 struggles are largely not his fault, success is important for the development of a young QB. Bad situations can create uncertainty and bad habits.

Also, Love probably won't have a situation nearly as good as Mahomes's. People forget that Alex Smith was the most efficient deep passer in the NFL the year before Mahomes took over. He also completed 67% of his passes and had a 5/1 TD/INT ratio, while averaging 8.0 yards per attempt. KC's offense took a major step forward with Mahomes the following year, because he's much more talented than Smith, but you couldn't have given him a better situation. We don't know what he would have looked like in Cleveland or Buffalo - especially if he was asked to start as a rookie.

If Tua doesn't check out medically, or if he's gone by the time Miami drafts, I would roll the dice on Love or Herbert, but I wouldn't start either in 2020, and I'd be ready to draft a QB in 2021 if I didn't like their development in practice.

I don't feel especially confident about either, but QB is the one position where it's much worse to be too conservative than too aggressive. I said it in another thread, but when looking at Top 40 players who are not QB's, I view them as guilty until proven innocent. That is, I want clean evaluations, and I don't care if I let someone get by me, because I'm being too picky. With QB, it's the opposite. Of course, you want the best, cleanest player you can get, but I'd much rather draft multiple misses than sit on my hands.
 
Player comparisons don't mean anything. That said, comparing Love to Mahomes is just about the most absurd one I've read so far!

Is that just because Mahomes is too good to compare another QB to or because you have a legit different opinion of Love?
 
No one is saying love is gonna be what mahomes has been thus far. Comparisons are for who a player reminds you of, not a prediction of the exact mold they are gonna form in to.

the athleticism,success from wacky throewing platforms and the uncanny arm strength to boot is what draws the mahomes comparison to love.

the way love plays, mahomes is absolutely the closest comparison. Doesn’t mean he will ever be mahomes
 
The one thing that bothers me about a Carson Wentz comparison for Justin Herbert is I remember watching Wentz at North Dakota State, and 2018-2019 as well for that matter, and that dude makes a lot happen by moving around and using his athleticism, buying extra time, etc. That's never really been Justin Herbert's game. He's built like Wentz but he doesn't have the same playground style.
 
The one thing that bothers me about a Carson Wentz comparison for Justin Herbert is I remember watching Wentz at North Dakota State, and 2018-2019 as well for that matter, and that dude makes a lot happen by moving around and using his athleticism, buying extra time, etc. That's never really been Justin Herbert's game. He's built like Wentz but he doesn't have the same playground style.

Speaking of Jordan Love & North Dakota St, the next Jordan Love, or at least the guy many hope he becomes, appears to currently be a redshirt freshman in Fargo. North Dakota St QB Trey Lance (6'4 221) has all the tools to become a top pick like Wentz. He plays in a pro-style offense, his arm strength rivals that of Eason & Herbert, he's extremely mobile rushing for nearly 1000 yards this year, & in 15 games this year he threw ZERO interceptions. He was phenomenal in the FCS semi-final game against Montana St. He does still need to learn ball placement & touch on close passes but it will be very interesting to see how he develops over the next couple years.

The FCS championship against James Madison is January 11 at noon.
 
Player comparisons don't mean anything. That said, comparing Love to Mahomes is just about the most absurd one I've read so far!

Love doesn't have the same confidence in the improvisational stuff. Not close to Mahomes' level in that regard. Mahomes obviously was around professional athletes all his life so he saw the swagger, if you will, and it became ingrained in his mindset and also his skill set. It's like he's doing fungo drills on a football field.

Love can move around similarly to Mahomes. But it never occurs to him. He wanders a little bit, instead of Fran Tarkenton or Patrick Mahomes style. Most likely that will never change. The comparisons are not awful because if it ever did trigger then he's capable of both the movement and the throws. Love is going to look terrific in the combine type drills.

These guys like Love and Herbert who are lower rated high school recruits but become top pro prospects are always more difficult for me to evaluate. There is something missing if they weren't considered elite players in high school. You can't be sure if it will click quickly in the pros, or later, or never. For example, when I attended that Miami vs. Louisville bowl game in Orlando years ago I watched DeVante Parker every play. I expected to see a confident dominant athlete, based on his skill set and reputation. Instead I saw a lumbering guy who played tentatively with his head down and managed almost zero separation. Only now does he have that prized athletic arrogance. He's also finally in good shape. Wonderful. But I have no idea how you make a living drafting guys like that in the first round. The Dolphins don't seem to understand the issues, or at least the prior regime did not. You almost need to have a supreme sports psychologist on staff, as well as nutritionist, etc.

Meanwhile other teams are drafting guys who bite as puppies.
 
These guys like Love and Herbert who are lower rated high school recruits but become top pro prospects are always more difficult for me to evaluate. There is something missing if they weren't considered elite players in high school.

This is something that you should never take into consideration. The guys that evaluate HS prospects are not professionals & don't look at them the same way NFL scouts/front offices do. Recruiting sites are more of in the moment ratings from camps & 7 on 7 tournaments, NFL scouting does more projection. The thing that's typically missing with lower rated players is that they didn't get to a camp or they didn't play at a high school that faced higher competition. The most difficult thing to evaluate by far is a kid's personality & how they are off the field.
 
Slimm I can't remember where you said it but you were absolutely right about on Eason. He really struggles presnap. Which is odd considering how many indicators there are in the Petersen offense. Very rarely do you even see him drop back without one or both of motion and play action.
 
Slimm I can't remember where you said it but you were absolutely right about on Eason. He really struggles presnap. Which is odd considering how many indicators there are in the Petersen offense. Very rarely do you even see him drop back without one or both of motion and play action.

Yeah like to use motion trying to get those safeties to declare.
 
Herbert - to me - is most similar to Wentz. I think there will always be frustrating aspects of his game, and his ceiling isn't what his physical tools suggest. Still, those tools are enough to work with.

Love has a higher ceiling - is a more natural passer. The Mahomes comparisons make a lot of sense. If Love didn't lose his playcaller and pretty much his entire offense between 2018 and 2019, the narrative would be different. My biggest concern with Love is that even though his 2019 struggles are largely not his fault, success is important for the development of a young QB. Bad situations can create uncertainty and bad habits.

Also, Love probably won't have a situation nearly as good as Mahomes's. People forget that Alex Smith was the most efficient deep passer in the NFL the year before Mahomes took over. He also completed 67% of his passes and had a 5/1 TD/INT ratio, while averaging 8.0 yards per attempt. KC's offense took a major step forward with Mahomes the following year, because he's much more talented than Smith, but you couldn't have given him a better situation. We don't know what he would have looked like in Cleveland or Buffalo - especially if he was asked to start as a rookie.

If Tua doesn't check out medically, or if he's gone by the time Miami drafts, I would roll the dice on Love or Herbert, but I wouldn't start either in 2020, and I'd be ready to draft a QB in 2021 if I didn't like their development in practice.

I don't feel especially confident about either, but QB is the one position where it's much worse to be too conservative than too aggressive. I said it in another thread, but when looking at Top 40 players who are not QB's, I view them as guilty until proven innocent. That is, I want clean evaluations, and I don't care if I let someone get by me, because I'm being too picky. With QB, it's the opposite. Of course, you want the best, cleanest player you can get, but I'd much rather draft multiple misses than sit on my hands.

Would you draft Love at 5? I wouldn't want to, but you know how the QB hype heats starting with the Senior Bowl, during the combine, and into the draft. QBs projected as late 1st/early 2nd typically end up projected in the teens around Senior Bowl time, then top 10 if they impress in workouts.
 
So this must be in the depths of this thread, but what is the hate with Fromm? Guy looks pretty dang solid, throws a good ball, quick decision maker, good looking throwing motion, and seems to have command of his offense.
 
So this must be in the depths of this thread, but what is the hate with Fromm? Guy looks pretty dang solid, throws a good ball, quick decision maker, good looking throwing motion, and seems to have command of his offense.
His accuracy/completion percentage has been a big red flag lately. A lot consider him a game manager, not a guy who can lead his team to victory. Last few games his completion percentage was under 50% or around it. Some also say he has undersized hands.
 
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