So let me understand this?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Tannchise, Jan 8, 2018.

  1. Tannchise

    Tannchise Banned Hammered

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    We have only one legitimate WR on the team, in Landry. Parker is not a #1, Stills just goes deep, Carroo is a bust and Grant is slowly coming along. So first of all, we are talking about not Paying Landry $X, right? However, he is producing for at least 2-3 WRs right now. I know the next thing that will be discussed is stats and his average per catch. So because we don't have a vertical QB in house, a shaky line and play calling that requires bubble screens as a solution to run the ball, Landry has to pay the price for this? Think about it, for a sec. He is basically the only option in the passing game, and has been. It is not his fault that he has to catch short passes and advance it to average 8-9 yards a catch. This board and this team has no vision. You have to picture the guy with decent talent around him. Just because they don't have a coach, WR or QB, doesn't mean Landry can be really effective. Think about it on a level playing field this year. Julius is Julius from Denver, Parker is an Alpha X, Stills takes the top off the ball. Oh and we actually don't have a scrub line or qb. Landry is lined up against a nickel or LB and is dragging across the middle, can easily average 10-12 yards a catch. Did you see the big plays two seasons ago against AZ and the Jets? The inabilities of this team from coaches to personnel under-value Landry. He is the victim of a bad offense. Bad offenses don't have good stats, team-wise and individually. And his passion is second-to-none. He loves this team. He will fight for this team. And maybe if Parker, Stills, Carroo, Gase and Tannehill had that kind of fight in them, we wouldn't be talking about losing Landry.
     
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  2. Fintastic17

    Fintastic17 A True Fan

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    I stopped reading after "Stills just goes deep" ..tells me all I need to know about the rest of the post.
     
  3. Andyman

    Andyman Canadian Fin Fan

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    I got one line further...shame on me.
     
  4. NBP81

    NBP81 Yippi ka yay mother******! Finheaven VIP Donator

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    1) Stills is a better WR than Landry.
    2) We don't have a vertical QB in house... How did Stills manage 14 yards per, Grant 15 yards per and Stills 14 yards per? Did they have a different QB throwing to them?
    3) It's the bubble screens! Ok! So why his Landry the only one being thrown those bubble screens?
     
  5. fininpsl

    fininpsl A True Fan Donator

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    Stills is a very good WR, and he's improving his craft. WAY off there OP. That said, IMHO Stills and Landry complement each other well in the WR corp. If Parker lived up to his billing, IMHO we'd have a nearly perfect balance in the unit.
     
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  6. gunn34

    gunn34 Pro Bowler

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    I couldn't finish it either. Sorry Tannchise.
     
  7. JTech194

    JTech194 Starter

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    Stills is NOT a better WR than Landry, that's nonsense. And to answer your questions... the reason he manages 14 yards per catch and Grant 15 is because of the routes the routes they run. They aren't nearly as involved or vital to this offense as Landry is. You guys are crazy people.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2018
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  8. NBP81

    NBP81 Yippi ka yay mother******! Finheaven VIP Donator

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    What does Landry do better than Stills?
    Why is Landry not running deeper routes?
     
  9. JTech194

    JTech194 Starter

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    Because he's the only WR that we have that also has the skillset of a running back who can make people miss after the other WR's fail to block their guy and get 5-6 yards by himself.
     
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  10. Yessir

    Yessir Dolfan for Life Donator

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    On what planet? Certainly not earth.
     
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  11. JTech194

    JTech194 Starter

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    Get open for one. Which is very important.
    Make people miss in the open field.
    Run people over
    He has better hands
    Catches tough passes across the middle
    Block
    Convert First downs

    The ONLY thing Stills does better than Landry is stretch the defense because he's faster. And he has less penalties.
     
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  12. Adam Strange

    Adam Strange Question Authority Finheaven VIP

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    Apparently Landry should ask for $20 million a year, 50% ownership of the team, and a cut of the beer sales on game day since he's just so absolutely indispensable and needs to be resigned whatever the cost.

    God forbid we lose the best receiver we have on this juggernaut of an offense. May end up with a losing season--like the one we just had. The horror.
     
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  13. JTech194

    JTech194 Starter

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    And to answer your question Why doesn't Landry run deeper routes? Why doesn't Stephen Curry Play in the post? Why doesn't Tom Brady run the read option? Because they are better at doing other things so why have them do something their not as good at? E
     
  14. Phantom

    Phantom Phantom Donator

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    They play two different roles on the offense.
     
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  15. Phantom

    Phantom Phantom Donator

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    Laundry couldn't play Stills position. Outside receivers go against the best db's week in and week out. Slot guys go against nickle backs , linebackers and safeties. two different positions. Outside guys are often doubled with safeties also.
     
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  16. Csonked Out

    Csonked Out FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    Stills is a far better all around receiver than Landry, it really isn't all that close. There is a reason 2 different coaching staffs over 4 years make Landry run the same 7 to 8 routes, he is elite at those routes but his game is surprsingly limited.
     
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  17. Daytona Fin

    Daytona Fin There's one, set for stun Moderator Finheaven VIP

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    In 2016 we nearly had 3 wr's with 1000 yards and many outlets had our wr corps as one of the best. In 2017 we are tasked with playing with a qb that has the arm of a 12 year old boy and a backup qb who has the football IQ of a high school player and now we are supposed to believe we only have one wr worth a damn? I wish Parker and Stills had a cute little first down dance maybe it might lower Landry's net worth.
     
  18. NBP81

    NBP81 Yippi ka yay mother******! Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Landry doesnt separate more than Stills, at least not when you take into account route depth...
    Make people miss in the open field. OK
    Run people over. OK
    He has better hands. No he doesnt
    Catches though passes over the middle. Good luck proving that
    Block. OK
    Convert 1st downs. Both Parker and Stills have better 1st% than Landry

    Landry is a better WR than Stills because he would make a better RB... lol
     
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  19. JTech194

    JTech194 Starter

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    And stills couldn't play Landry's position so what's your point? Good teams don't just double guys because they play on the outside.... Good teams usually double a teams BEST players. Nobody is doubling Stills OR Parker. Teams (the New England Patriots for one) Have doubled Landry.... Why? Because he's one of not just OUR best players but one of the Best players in the league. As a matter of fact... good teams like the NE Patriots often times take their BEST CB, and put them on a teams BEST WR no matter where he plays on the field and dares the other WR's to beat them. I think they did that to Landry a few times over the years. The thinking is..... "We're not going to let LANDRY beat us" And usually that strategy works because the other WR's we have, haven't stepped up.
     
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  20. BigChief

    BigChief Scout Team

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    Landry is a clown. Let him walk.
     
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  21. NBP81

    NBP81 Yippi ka yay mother******! Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Landy? one of the best players in the league? He's not even a top 10 WR...
     
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  22. DuderinoN703

    DuderinoN703 We? What the **** we? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Stills is better in what way exactly?
     
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  23. outlawd2u

    outlawd2u Pro Bowler

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    There is so much wrong with this post.
     
  24. Vaark

    Vaark Nihil taurus crappus Finheaven VIP Donator

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    OP 's anti Tannehill and Gase OCD is getting out of control. Another slam at Tannehill not throwing long to Landry. Doesn't matter that Tannehill in 2016 was the 3rd most accurate deep ball passer in the league or that if throwing to slot receivers was so easy, each team would have one as prolific as Tannehill has made Landry to be. (And while we're at it, how many QBs could have turned ****ing Hartline into a multi 1000yd receiver?) Incidentally in 2016 Tannehill also had the 4th highest QBR when operating from a clean pocket - him with his 30th ranked OL and Dak Prescott above him with his durable highly rated Dallas OL, fwiw - which is a good clue what really needs to change!

    It's to a point where the OP in another thread promises to save "BIG" pro Tannehill and Gase posts to mock any of us who disagreed after next season where he's obviously rooting for our QB, HC and therefore our TEAM to fail. As if that happens and anyone on the OP's "List" really gives a flying **** what he thinks.

    I will give the obsessed OP credit for creative ways to back into "Tannehill sucks" "Gase sucks" but enough is enough already!
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2018
  25. traptses

    traptses Starter Finheaven VIP

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    I’m really beginning to think Tannchise is Jonathan Martin
     
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  26. Daytona Fin

    Daytona Fin There's one, set for stun Moderator Finheaven VIP

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    When we have competent qb play? Everything, minus dumbing down our offense and 5 yard catches with a cloud of dust.
     
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  27. Kdawg954

    Kdawg954 Paint on My Hands from Paintin the Perfect Picture Finheaven VIP Donator

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    If Landry didn't show you all how valuable he is to this team this year, I don't know what to tell you.

    He became a legit redzone threat because of his ability to get seperation in close quarters and make strong catches.

    I really like Kenny Stills, he is certainly a top level deep ball threat . . . but there is no question that replacing him with Jakeem Grant is a better solution than replacing Jarvis with "insert name here".

    I am not advocating for either . . . you keep Stills, you resign Landry (or tag him and then resign him longterm) and if there is anybody you look to jetison, its Devante Parker because he will still have some trade value. Then you get your 3rd round pick Carroo (I know people think he sucks, but how on earth is he gonna get on the field with Parker/Stills/Landry . . . Grant has a skill set that sets him apart and gives Gase options which allows him to see the field more) on the field more in that Parker spot and you continue using Grant how you used him late last year, while pocketing a hopeful top 40 pick for Parker which you in turn use to grab a TE with one of those day 2 picks and you still have a boatload of UDFA/late round WR picks you are developing who can become that #5 WR.

    I like Parker, wanted him in that draft the whole time, but you are gonna face a big contract with him soon and you aren't sure if you have a dependable player here. If there is value in a trade, Miami needs to take a strong look.
     
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  28. JTech194

    JTech194 Starter

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    Ok, let's debate...

    What does Stills do better than Landry that makes him a far better all around receiver? Landry runs what 4-5-4.6 forty? No coaching staff will ask him to run deep routes on any consistent basis.... That makes no sense. As a coach, you find what a player's best skillset is and have them do that. Someone has to run the underneath routes, the crossing routes, the hitches and screens, someone has to run the WR reverses, someone has to block for the RB etc...

    Stills is good at the intermediate and deep routes while Landry is good at the short and intermediate routes.

    Oh, and not to mention the fact that the offensive line has been pretty bad. Hard to run deep routes if you don't have the time. Which is why stills only had 42 receptions last year and 58 this year. While Landry had over 100. So when the line doesn't give the QB time to throw deep... who will he throw to if there's no Landry getting open quickly underneath?
     
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  29. JTech194

    JTech194 Starter

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    i'm not going to let you off that easy homie.... give me specific skill sets that Stills is better than Landry is besides running deep routes.

    Does he gain yards after contact better?
    Does he have better hands?
    Does he make people miss in the open field or tights spaces better?
    Does he run people over better?
    Does he block better?
     
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  30. Tannchise

    Tannchise Banned Hammered

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    If Landry ran deeper, we would need more qb’s on the roster. There isnt enough time to throw. Also, Is Landry freestyling it or is running routes he is asked?
     
  31. NBP81

    NBP81 Yippi ka yay mother******! Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Landry was 9th in least average air yards per target. Of the top 10, 6 were TEs and 6 had a better catch rate...
     
  32. Kdawg954

    Kdawg954 Paint on My Hands from Paintin the Perfect Picture Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I fault Gase and his hardheadedness with that Bubble Screen to Landry all of the damn time. While he can break tackles you clearly saw you needed more quickness with the ****ty blocking on this team. My guess is those 1 yard passes put a huge dent into that number.

    I believe he was rated as a top 3 redzone WR this year, which lord knows we have needed that. Haven't had a player like that since Brandon Gibson's first year with the team in 2013.
     
  33. JTech194

    JTech194 Starter

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    Give me 10 WR that are better than Landry from a PRODUCTION standpoint... He led the league in receptions so there's no arguing he's tops at that.

    Some people will have players like the ones listed below as being better than Landry but from a production standpoint which is all that matters in my book, they have not been.
    Dez Bryant
    Amari Cooper
    Alshon Jeffery
     
  34. Tannchise

    Tannchise Banned Hammered

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    And who’s fault is this. They couldnt run for a while and he was forced to catch bubble screens because Parker was hurt and Still doesnt do that. My OP was because our lack of offensive ingenuity has caused this dilemma w Landry. Landry easily can be a 10-12 yards per catch guy because of how other slot Wrs are used. But everyone here is blind to the ineptitude of the offense. Get a better line and qb, call better plays. In TC, Landry was part of the “595/Turnpike” crossroads in Davie. He was catching balls 15 yards up. He wasn’t catching screens.
     
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  35. JTech194

    JTech194 Starter

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    I don't blame Gase, I've seen plenty of other teams run bubble screens and have much success. The problem is that our players don't block them very well, starting with the other WR's. And the fact that we don't have a consistent enough intermediate to deep passing game so DB's just sit on that short stuff. I'm surprised Landry was able to gain over 900 yards with the lack of a running game and deep passing game that we had this year.
     
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  36. Kdawg954

    Kdawg954 Paint on My Hands from Paintin the Perfect Picture Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I agree, but you at least saw with Grant that his quickness allowed those plays to have more success as his start and go and ability to make people miss, plus break tackles suprisingly was a much more effective tool than having Juice wait for blocks and try to make guys miss and break all the tackles.

    Glad Gase adjusted there later in the season.
     
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  37. Tannchise

    Tannchise Banned Hammered

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    Everyone here is so built up on Tannehill and Parker’s potenial, you forget the dog work Landry does
     
  38. NBP81

    NBP81 Yippi ka yay mother******! Finheaven VIP Donator

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    There's a reason Landry is not being targeted deep... If your argument to this is that Gase is an idiot, then there's not much we can argue about... Landry is being fed the ball as a TE/RB. My argument is that it's the only thing he can do efficiently. There is absolutely no way to prove that he can't read a defense properly or that he doesn't know the playbook as much as he should, but it would explain alot of things.
     
  39. Phinatic8u

    Phinatic8u Adam ****ing Gase Finheaven VIP

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    Landry is what he is. A good slot wr and a bitterly little bucket of annoying.

    I want him back, but at 10-11 million. Not top WR money.
     
  40. Dolphins81

    Dolphins81 Well-Known Member

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    It also depends on if Landry actually wants to come back also. He might not want to come back to a dumpster fire team. I like Landry and want him to stay but we have a ton of issues and shouldn’t overpay. You know Landry is talking to OBJ right now. I would love to see those 2 on the same team lol.
     

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