The Case For Defense in Round One | Page 6 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

The Case For Defense in Round One

Digital

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Long story short, there are competing priorities. Every team wants to draft the Best Player Available (BPA), and at #3 overall, that player can be a franchise changer. Still, the ultimate goal is to build a football team, that means players who fit schemes the coaching staff can make succeed, and sometimes fit positions of need. Then there is the salary cap, which says they can't all be stars because we can't afford to keep the team together! One aspect that I like about Grier is that he tries to move up and down the board to find places where the BPA also fits a position of need, with positional value, AND our scheme. That is impossible to do always, but Grier does a good job of finding those.

But at #3, there are only 2 or 3 guys that the Dolphins even have in their internal discussions as being worthy of that pick. Sure, the fans have a dozen or so, but the scouts have an entirely different point of view, and the real list is very short. In this draft, the only defensive player even remotely worth the #3 pick would be a CB, and I think none of those CB's are even in that discussion, and the gap between that prospect and what you could get at #36 isn't huge. Remember, we traded up a bit in round 2 to get Xavien Howard, and I think that type of situation might happen again this year as the end of that tier 1 CB class starts to get hoovered up. But at #3 ... it's going to be offense. Specifically, I think it's either a QB, Pennei Sewell or Ja'Marr Chase. Given that, I'd try to trade back for more picks from a QB-needy team, or I'd pick Ja'Marr Chase. YMMV, but that's my $0.02 on it.
 

Ferretsquig

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I think this team is talent poor enough that they should take whoever they are sold on as a potential future all pro. If you're looking at Sammy Watkins and Aaron Donald on the board it shouldn't matter that they just spent a first rounder on a DT a couple years back.
 

Feverdream

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I think this team is talent poor enough that they should take whoever they are sold on as a potential future all pro. If you're looking at Sammy Watkins and Aaron Donald on the board it shouldn't matter that they just spent a first rounder on a DT a couple years back.
For the most part... I agree with this in a general sort of way.

Where it falls apart is when you are already loaded at a particular position, or when you have several players who are outstanding at their own position.

If Randy Moss, Tony Gonzales, and Anthony Munoz... all at 21 years old... were available, you'd probably go with need and fit.

A simple BPA is rarely that easy.
 

Ferretsquig

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For the most part... I agree with this in a general sort of way.

Where it falls apart is when you are already loaded at a particular position, or when you have several players who are outstanding at their own position.

If Randy Moss, Tony Gonzales, and Anthony Munoz... all at 21 years old... were available, you'd probably go with need and fit.

A simple BPA is rarely that easy.

I do think it needs to be a case where you place one player clearly above another. I know its impossible to judge potential impact across different positions but if you think Parsons is a hall of fame type talent and Smith's ceiling is a top 10 receiver in the league then you have to go with Parsons. I can understand targeting positions later in a draft but early on when there are truly unique talents I think you have to search for those that can have a real outsized impact.
 

Feverdream

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I do think it needs to be a case where you place one player clearly above another. I know its impossible to judge potential impact across different positions but if you think Parsons is a hall of fame type talent and Smith's ceiling is a top 10 receiver in the league then you have to go with Parsons. I can understand targeting positions later in a draft but early on when there are truly unique talents I think you have to search for those that can have a real outsized impact.
I'm with you on this 100%

...and while I have my opinions on this (Devonte Smith will be a #2 WR on his team), they are... just opinions, and I have been wrong many times before. I've been divorced and everything.
 

SF Dolphin Fan

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I really wish there was a blue chip edge rusher in this draft class i.e. a Bosa, Young, etc...none worth a top 5 pick let alone top 10 for us. Anyone else would be a reach that is unacceptable(Parsons would be the least reach but still stretch armstronging it).

Rousseau interests me cuz of size and his ability to rush from the inside, but is he a run game liability, can he rush from the edge? I think Flo would have have fun with him but will he execute? But Paye seems to more a Flo type. Rousseau really threw a wrench into things by opting out...not sure if it will help or hurt, but something tells me he will FEED at the combine, but will it translate? *cough*Gholston

Definately need offense at 1A or trade WITHIN top 10 and grab a WR/Pitts, would love Najee or another WR at 18 (Bateman, Moore, Toney).

I wouldn't cry if we went defense at 18 but I'd start my SSRI again if we went D at 3 even for Parsons. At 1B the only D boiz I would be satisfied with would be Parsons (long gone most def), Zaven Collins, Owusu-Koramoah, or Rousseau. Or PSII just cause his father was a gawd(phat chance he's sitting there).

2nd round can fortify the OL grab def grab a C,/G. Maybe 2 if there's no edge rushing talent worthy. With Raekwon and Wilkins I like out DTs esp if Davon doesn't disappear.
If Chase Young was in this draft, have to believe he'd be Miami's target. Maybe the Jets too.
 

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This draft should all be helping out our future franchise qb. Nothing else matters
Agree, but would extend it to free agency as well. The bulk of the picks and free agent money should go towards offense.
 

Birdmond

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I’d be stunned if two defensive players are selected in round one. I can’t see a scenario where this is even close to BPA. I can however see OL/DL being the first two picks. I’m not advocating this but if a trade down isn’t possible i would bet on it.
 

juniorseau55

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I'm more or less playing Devils Advocate with this argument. I want us to draft an offensive tackle first (Sewell or Slater) and then come back around at 18 with a weapon (Marshall or Bateman) or trade up from 18 for a weapon (Waddle or Pitts).

With that being said, there is no doubt that we still have a few holes on defense, particularly in the front 7, and there is a case to be made for us to go defense in round 1 and make ourselves into a potentially super dominant D.

3rd overall - Micah Parsons
Fills the void in the middle of our defense as a big, elite MLB that can also rush the passer from the middle of your defense or move to rush off the edge on passing situations. Kid kills it against the run and can rush the passer like crazy. He's not great YET in coverage but he can develop and be our new Zach Thomas with better pass rush ability and a lot more speed.

18th overall (or trade up) - Rousseau or Paye

Big, Elite DE prospects that both have the ability to speed rush off the edge or bull rush or stunt. On the other side of Ogbah, either one of these guys can produce immediately and become star pass rushers that can also play the run. Rousseau is more raw but might have more upside as a Jason Taylor type that can do it all... Has a similar frame to JT but has the ability to add more bulk.

Like I said, I'd prefer us to go offense in round 1... However, knowing the mindset of our coach and GM and knowing how we want to be built as a dominant defensive team, I wouldn't be surprised if our first round was all defense... And I wouldn't be mad. With additions like Parsons and Paye to go along with our elite secondary - if we can also add a fat, run stuffing Nose Tackle in FA or in round 3 or 4, suddenly our defense has no holes (besides MAYBE a little weak at FS) and we can have a super elite D for years to come.

Thoughts?

With the latest developments it appears there will be a lot qb picked in the 1st round alone. Then work around that thought for a moment, and think about the hype among players such as Smith, Chase, and Pitts. This is a passing league after all right? And start adding teams that want to pick an offensive lineman for their team so they can protect their rookie qb. That would be about up to 5 other teams looking to add offensive linemen, and if we look at least year there were about almost 5 of them roughly picked. Either how, this means that a lot of the defensive players we are all raving for will be available after the top 10 picks.
 

Fin-Loco

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My first thought is OP has, masochistic tendancies, is just trying to stir the pot, has been smoking pot, or simply misplaced his meds.

Seriously though. I wouldn't assume Flo is a purely defense coach. I think he and Grier had a comprehensive plan and schedule for institution from the beginning.

Phase one: Teardown shedding bad contracts and bring sanity to the cap situation. As it turned out, we were able to stockpile draft capital at the same time. Complete

Phase two: Address the defense and O-line through FA, as well as the draft, making sure we have enough quality DBs to execute his multiple philosophy. Get a QB to build around. Close to complete.

Phase three: Add skill position players, and other upgrades where possible. Coming soon to a stadium near you.

The Covid situation threw a couple monkeys in the wrench as far as timetable, but it's the same with most franchises.

That's a long post to basically say the offense will be addressed early in the draft. I don't think all of our top 2 rd picks will be on skills, but at least two high profile offensive guys, and maybe more if we can find a trade down.
I'm similarly minded. However, I would really imagine we'll use the top three on skill. Probably Smith/Chase, Waddle/Toney and Harris/Williams.
 

BigNastyFish

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No... but neither does it imply that you should reach for a player who fills a position that you feel is a need when there are superior height/weight/speed players at other positions where you have a need... especially when your position of 'need' has a VERY deep pool.

Or in layman's terms, there are at least a dozen good WR prospects... and some of the ones on non-top 5 schools may actually be better bets... and will slide into day 2.
allow me to offer some degree of data compression:

Draft Smart!

Use the % to your advantage.

This message sponsored by a combination of memantine and donepezil!
 

hoops

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The real case is outside of qb no other position can impact tbe play on a per snap basis at the level a truly elite every down Mike lb can.

you can scheme and take away or limit just about anything. Good luck doing that with a off ball Mike.

Per snap basis I sure don’t see a more impactful player position.
 

Danny

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Long story short, there are competing priorities. Every team wants to draft the Best Player Available (BPA), and at #3 overall, that player can be a franchise changer. Still, the ultimate goal is to build a football team, that means players who fit schemes the coaching staff can make succeed, and sometimes fit positions of need. Then there is the salary cap, which says they can't all be stars because we can't afford to keep the team together! One aspect that I like about Grier is that he tries to move up and down the board to find places where the BPA also fits a position of need, with positional value, AND our scheme. That is impossible to do always, but Grier does a good job of finding those.

But at #3, there are only 2 or 3 guys that the Dolphins even have in their internal discussions as being worthy of that pick. Sure, the fans have a dozen or so, but the scouts have an entirely different point of view, and the real list is very short. In this draft, the only defensive player even remotely worth the #3 pick would be a CB, and I think none of those CB's are even in that discussion, and the gap between that prospect and what you could get at #36 isn't huge. Remember, we traded up a bit in round 2 to get Xavien Howard, and I think that type of situation might happen again this year as the end of that tier 1 CB class starts to get hoovered up. But at #3 ... it's going to be offense. Specifically, I think it's either a QB, Pennei Sewell or Ja'Marr Chase. Given that, I'd try to trade back for more picks from a QB-needy team, or I'd pick Ja'Marr Chase. YMMV, but that's my $0.02 on it.
Is that your "short" version of a long story?
 
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