The truth on Joey - from a lions fan - disspelling the rumors

[Air2theThrown]

I am a Lions season ticket holder and I feel I have a solid understanding as to what type of player Joey really is... I have read some totally inaccurate comments on the issues of Joey H. and why he was not successful in DET.

Here are the reasons many of you claim Joey stunk it up..

1) The OL - The Lions OL consists of Riaola at C whom many think is one of the better young centers in the league, Backus at OT a former first round pick out of U of M, Woody at guard a former pro-bowler ( Miami fans should know him well), Rick DeMulling (good enough to block for Manning) who was considered the best OG in last years FA. Our weakest link is 3rd year RT Butler whom IMO played nearly as well as Backus last season. I have my issues with the Lions OL but it is not nearly as bad as many on hear want to make it out to be. In 2004 and 2003 the Lions OL gave up the fewest sacks in the NFL. Kyle Kosier a back-up OL in Det just got big money to start in Dallas this off-season.

2) RB KJ his rookie year came out of camp a little banged up and led the league in rushing the last 8 games of the season. He had a tough time of it last season but he is a stud and has proven that. Shawn Bryson our back up and 3rd down back is a pretty good player. He is valuable in the passing and blocking game. Cory Schlesinger is the Rodney Dangerfield of all FB's the man gets no respect ..he is a great player, tough, good blocker, and asset to the receiving game and in many Lions fans eyes one of the best FB's in the league when healthy. Brian Urlacher once stated that Cory Schlesinger is the one player he hates to go up against.

3) WR's - 3 top ten picks, and guys like Tia Streets, Scottie Vines, Troy Edwards, Reggie Swinton, Az-Zahir Hakim, Kevin Johnson, Bill Schroeder are all guys Joey has had for targets over the years. While not the greatest WR group certainly he had better then average talent there. BTW - Roy Williams is a stud WR and future pro-bowler and I highly expect both him and Charles Rogers to bust out this year now that Joey is long gone.

4) TE's Mikhael Ricks and Marcus Pollard are darn good receiving TE's.

5) Coaching - Wasn't Mooch considered the biggest coaching name the year the Lions signed him to take over? Now ran out of town because his OFF cold not get it done.

6) Defense - Actually the Lions Def is the only thing that has kept the team in games over the last 3 seasons. They often spent a great deal of time on the field and kept the Lions within scoring a TD of winning. Problem was the Lions were the worst in the NFL in scoring during that time.

The real reasons why Joey is no longer a Lions...

1) The biggest reason is his leadership. Many of the players on the Lions felt Joey was strange bread, he did not mesh well with his players and most of them did not get along with him. Joey has been rumored to be gay (I don't buy it) because he comes off as a goodie momma's boy. Joey is a smart guy and very polite and I think the players just were not comfortable with him. Many of the Lions players blamed Joey for the poor play of the entire OFF. The cold hard truth is Joey was not respected by his players and he cannot lead players who do not respect him.

2) Joey often faced 8 man fronts with heavy blitz packages - this hurt the run game because so many defenders were in the box. Every team played DET tight... they dared Joey to beat them by passing down field but Joey seldom ever hit that open guy because once Joey felt any pressure he lost all composure ...

3) Accuracy... often Joey had a man open for a first down and would miss him or place a poorly thrown ball and his WR would take a huge hit.. Joey often put his receivers in compromising positions, and frequently delivered the ball late. Several WR's got injured trying grab a poorly thrown passes by Joey. He seldom would hit a WR in stride and often delivered balls late and behind his WR.. this would result in a catch but the WR would get creamed or tackled for no gain after the catch.. This was a huge drive staller. Joey's completion % suffered heavily by this..

4) Vision - I cant tell you how many times Joey had a wide open WR 15 yards down field on a 3-7 play and he dumped it off 3 yards. Or how many times we need 5 yards for a first down and Joey would throw the ball late and behind the WR forcing that WR to come back for the ball and get tackled 1 yard shy of the first down. Joey seldom ever sees a WR on the left side of the field unless the play is designed to go to that side. Joey did not have the confidence to go down field on a consistent basis.

With all that said - Let me add that many Lions fans like Joey because he is not your normal NFL player. He is a nice guy with a good attitude, polite and friendly. They see a guy who wants to win and a guy who works hard.

Martz felt Joey needed to be torn down and rebuilt - he felt Joey had the talent to be an NFL back but he felt Joey had to many fundamental problems that needed to be fixed. He continued to talk about getting Joey back to the basics... I tend to agree ... something happened to Joey along the way.. maybe the Lions started him to earlier, maybe he was not ready for the NFL, maybe he just does not have what it takes but Joey struggled in DET not because the coaching OL, or talent around him ... Joey struggled because of Joey...


I do think you got a steal getting him for a 6th rounder if the rumors are true.

 

[67Stang]

OK, we will give you a 6th next year for him.

 

[Winbaby#23]

I am a Lions season ticket holder and I feel I have a solid understanding as to what type of player Joey really is... I have read some totally inaccurate comments on the issues of Joey H. and why he was not successful in DET.

Here are the reasons many of you claim Joey stunk it up..

1) The OL - The Lions OL consists of Riaola at C whom many think is one of the better young centers in the league, Backus at OT a former first round pick out of U of M, Woody at guard a former pro-bowler ( Miami fans should know him well), Rick DeMulling (good enough to block for Manning) who was considered the best OG in last years FA. Our weakest link is 3rd year RT Butler whom IMO played nearly as well as Backus last season. I have my issues with the Lions OL but it is not nearly as bad as many on hear want to make it out to be. In 2004 and 2003 the Lions OL gave up the fewest sacks in the NFL. Kyle Kosier a back-up OL in Det just got big money to start in Dallas this off-season.

2) RB KJ his rookie year came out of camp a little banged up and led the league in rushing the last 8 games of the season. He had a tough time of it last season but he is a stud and has proven that. Shawn Bryson our back up and 3rd down back is a pretty good player. He is valuable in the passing and blocking game. Cory Schlesinger is the Rodney Dangerfield of all FB's the man gets no respect ..he is a great player, tough, good blocker, and asset to the receiving game and in many Lions fans eyes one of the best FB's in the league when healthy. Brian Urlacher once stated that Cory Schlesinger is the one player he hates to go up against.

3) WR's - 3 top ten picks, and guys like Tia Streets, Scottie Vines, Troy Edwards, Reggie Swinton, Az-Zahir Hakim, Kevin Johnson, Bill Schroeder are all guys Joey has had for targets over the years. While not the greatest WR group certainly he had better then average talent there. BTW - Roy Williams is a stud WR and future pro-bowler and I highly expect both him and Charles Rogers to bust out this year now that Joey is long gone.

4) TE's Mikhael Ricks and Marcus Pollard are darn good receiving TE's.

5) Coaching - Wasn't Mooch considered the biggest coaching name the year the Lions signed him to take over? Now ran out of town because his OFF cold not get it done.

6) Defense - Actually the Lions Def is the only thing that has kept the team in games over the last 3 seasons. They often spent a great deal of time on the field and kept the Lions within scoring a TD of winning. Problem was the Lions were the worst in the NFL in scoring during that time.

The real reasons why Joey is no longer a Lions...

1) The biggest reason is his leadership. Many of the players on the Lions felt Joey was strange bread, he did not mesh well with his players and most of them did not get along with him. Joey has been rumored to be gay (I don't buy it) because he comes off as a goodie momma's boy. Joey is a smart guy and very polite and I think the players just were not comfortable with him. Many of the Lions players blamed Joey for the poor play of the entire OFF. The cold hard truth is Joey was not respected by his players and he cannot lead players who do not respect him.

2) Joey often faced 8 man fronts with heavy blitz packages - this hurt the run game because so many defenders were in the box. Every team played DET tight... they dared Joey to beat them by passing down field but Joey seldom ever hit that open guy because once Joey felt any pressure he lost all composure ...

3) Accuracy... often Joey had a man open for a first down and would miss him or place a poorly thrown ball and his WR would take a huge hit.. Joey often put his receivers in compromising positions, and frequently delivered the ball late. Several WR's got injured trying grab a poorly thrown passes by Joey. He seldom would hit a WR in stride and often delivered balls late and behind his WR.. this would result in a catch but the WR would get creamed or tackled for no gain after the catch.. This was a huge drive staller. Joey's completion % suffered heavily by this..

4) Vision - I cant tell you how many times Joey had a wide open WR 15 yards down field on a 3-7 play and he dumped it off 3 yards. Or how many times we need 5 yards for a first down and Joey would throw the ball late and behind the WR forcing that WR to come back for the ball and get tackled 1 yard shy of the first down. Joey seldom ever sees a WR on the left side of the field unless the play is designed to go to that side. Joey did not have the confidence to go down field on a consistent basis.

With all that said - Let me add that many Lions fans like Joey because he is not your normal NFL player. He is a nice guy with a good attitude, polite and friendly. They see a guy who wants to win and a guy who works hard.

Martz felt Joey needed to be torn down and rebuilt - he felt Joey had the talent to be an NFL back but he felt Joey had to many fundamental problems that needed to be fixed. He continued to talk about getting Joey back to the basics... I tend to agree ... something happened to Joey along the way.. maybe the Lions started him to earlier, maybe he was not ready for the NFL, maybe he just does not have what it takes but Joey struggled in DET not because the coaching OL, or talent around him ... Joey struggled because of Joey...


I do think you got a steal getting him for a 6th rounder if the rumors are true.

wrong.. joey struggled because the lions coaching staff sucks and he was playing for a loser. You are right though.. a 6th rounder is highway robbery.

 

[kpcane]

that's an interesting perspective...thanks

 

[Argos31]

wrong.. joey struggled because the lions coaching staff sucks and he was playing for a loser. You are right though.. a 6th rounder is highway robbery.

the guy comes here and writes 1000 words of well thought criticisms with a lot of detail, probably took him over half an hour and you just say wrong it's the coaching staff? I think you ought to reevaluate your opinon. Thank you OP, well done, I appreciate it very much.

 

[Prime]

What hurts Harrington is the poor coaching and the offense. He only had one "real" weapon and that was Roy Williams. Mike Williams didn't seem like he helped him out much and Rogers seemed more like a bust as the years go on. Kevin Jones was one of the most dissapointed players last season because he did so good his rookie year, but he didn't even rush for 700 yards this year and he played most of the whole season. To me it seems like your OL couldn't block worth a ****. Maybe he can pull half of a Jake Plummer and start to improve his game with a better team.

 

[1334]

Thanks for for the post. We will not know what he can do in a new system until he gets here (if he gets here) Personally I think Joey H sucks, but I hope if we get him I am wrong. If we don't get him I could care less how he does.

 

[newlownorder]

1) The OL - The right side of your line stinks.

2) RB- Jones did nothing last year and only did better his rookie year for 8 games....not proven, not a stud.

3) WR's - 3 top ten picks.....who have injury problems or attitude problems....the backups all stink.

4) TE's Mikhael Ricks and Marcus Pollard are darn good receiving TE's.........not that good...........

5) Coaching - Wasn't Mooch considered the biggest coaching name the year the Lions signed him to take over? Now ran out of town because his OFF cold not get it done.......Mooch had a good team when he took over the 49ers....good coach.....not the greatest.

6) Defense - They have a D??

I do think you got a steal getting him for a 6th rounder if the rumors are true.....yep a 6th rounder with his playing time in the NFL is a steal

 

[claytonduper]

Thanks for your side of the story. Harrington was a steal for a 6th rounder next year. He fills a very important void for us now despite his short-comings. He is still the best back-up QB since Don Strock and probably one of the better QB's if not the best of the QB's since Marino.

Appreciate doing business with your club!:cooldude:

 

[CashInFist]

OK, we will give you a 6th next year for him.

:sidelol: Where do I sign? :dolphins:

 

[Muck]

wrong.. joey struggled because the lions coaching staff sucks and he was playing for a loser. You are right though.. a 6th rounder is highway robbery.

Steve Marriucci has had success with every QB he's coached in the pros. Except Joey Harrington. Mike Martz, who coached Trent Green (to his first Pro Bowl in Washington), Kurt Warner and Marc Bulger, thinks Harrington needs to an overhaul. It's doubtful that those guys are wrong.

A change of scenery and philosophy certainly doesn't hurt. But Harrington is just as much to blame as the rest of the guys fans blame. Hopefully he can turn it around in Miami.

 

[Alex44]

Rookie WR's hardly ever do anything unless their name is

Moss, Boldin, or Fitzgerald

Now add in a new rookie WR for 3 years and you have a problem

 

[Dors156]

interesting

 

[Dolfan1000]

You overrate your players, especially your OL. Some big names means nothing when it comes to that position, its how they work together as a unit. Your WRs are way below average (some of those guys you mentioned are laughable), and the fact that you went out of your way to mention Shawn Bryson.. well.. that says it all I guess.

 

[bmark549]

I am a Lions season ticket holder and I feel I have a solid understanding as to what type of player Joey really is... I have read some totally inaccurate comments on the issues of Joey H. and why he was not successful in DET.

Here are the reasons many of you claim Joey stunk it up..

1) The OL - The Lions OL consists of Riaola at C whom many think is one of the better young centers in the league, Backus at OT a former first round pick out of U of M, Woody at guard a former pro-bowler ( Miami fans should know him well), Rick DeMulling (good enough to block for Manning) who was considered the best OG in last years FA. Our weakest link is 3rd year RT Butler whom IMO played nearly as well as Backus last season. I have my issues with the Lions OL but it is not nearly as bad as many on hear want to make it out to be. In 2004 and 2003 the Lions OL gave up the fewest sacks in the NFL. Kyle Kosier a back-up OL in Det just got big money to start in Dallas this off-season.

2) RB KJ his rookie year came out of camp a little banged up and led the league in rushing the last 8 games of the season. He had a tough time of it last season but he is a stud and has proven that. Shawn Bryson our back up and 3rd down back is a pretty good player. He is valuable in the passing and blocking game. Cory Schlesinger is the Rodney Dangerfield of all FB's the man gets no respect ..he is a great player, tough, good blocker, and asset to the receiving game and in many Lions fans eyes one of the best FB's in the league when healthy. Brian Urlacher once stated that Cory Schlesinger is the one player he hates to go up against.

3) WR's - 3 top ten picks, and guys like Tia Streets, Scottie Vines, Troy Edwards, Reggie Swinton, Az-Zahir Hakim, Kevin Johnson, Bill Schroeder are all guys Joey has had for targets over the years. While not the greatest WR group certainly he had better then average talent there. BTW - Roy Williams is a stud WR and future pro-bowler and I highly expect both him and Charles Rogers to bust out this year now that Joey is long gone.

4) TE's Mikhael Ricks and Marcus Pollard are darn good receiving TE's.

5) Coaching - Wasn't Mooch considered the biggest coaching name the year the Lions signed him to take over? Now ran out of town because his OFF cold not get it done.

6) Defense - Actually the Lions Def is the only thing that has kept the team in games over the last 3 seasons. They often spent a great deal of time on the field and kept the Lions within scoring a TD of winning. Problem was the Lions were the worst in the NFL in scoring during that time.

The real reasons why Joey is no longer a Lions...

1) The biggest reason is his leadership. Many of the players on the Lions felt Joey was strange bread, he did not mesh well with his players and most of them did not get along with him. Joey has been rumored to be gay (I don't buy it) because he comes off as a goodie momma's boy. Joey is a smart guy and very polite and I think the players just were not comfortable with him. Many of the Lions players blamed Joey for the poor play of the entire OFF. The cold hard truth is Joey was not respected by his players and he cannot lead players who do not respect him.

2) Joey often faced 8 man fronts with heavy blitz packages - this hurt the run game because so many defenders were in the box. Every team played DET tight... they dared Joey to beat them by passing down field but Joey seldom ever hit that open guy because once Joey felt any pressure he lost all composure ...

3) Accuracy... often Joey had a man open for a first down and would miss him or place a poorly thrown ball and his WR would take a huge hit.. Joey often put his receivers in compromising positions, and frequently delivered the ball late. Several WR's got injured trying grab a poorly thrown passes by Joey. He seldom would hit a WR in stride and often delivered balls late and behind his WR.. this would result in a catch but the WR would get creamed or tackled for no gain after the catch.. This was a huge drive staller. Joey's completion % suffered heavily by this..

4) Vision - I cant tell you how many times Joey had a wide open WR 15 yards down field on a 3-7 play and he dumped it off 3 yards. Or how many times we need 5 yards for a first down and Joey would throw the ball late and behind the WR forcing that WR to come back for the ball and get tackled 1 yard shy of the first down. Joey seldom ever sees a WR on the left side of the field unless the play is designed to go to that side. Joey did not have the confidence to go down field on a consistent basis.

With all that said - Let me add that many Lions fans like Joey because he is not your normal NFL player. He is a nice guy with a good attitude, polite and friendly. They see a guy who wants to win and a guy who works hard.

Martz felt Joey needed to be torn down and rebuilt - he felt Joey had the talent to be an NFL back but he felt Joey had to many fundamental problems that needed to be fixed. He continued to talk about getting Joey back to the basics... I tend to agree ... something happened to Joey along the way.. maybe the Lions started him to earlier, maybe he was not ready for the NFL, maybe he just does not have what it takes but Joey struggled in DET not because the coaching OL, or talent around him ... Joey struggled because of Joey...


I do think you got a steal getting him for a 6th rounder if the rumors are true.

Kind of depressing......not sure for whom, but thanks for the well thought out insight. By the way, duck, your going to catch quite a bit of bashing now from some people on here.