There is not 1 match up nightmare on this team | Page 6 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

There is not 1 match up nightmare on this team

Thanks @fin415 for the kind words.

Parker was clearly getting the #1 WR treatment this year, and even when his running mate, Preston Williams, went down Parker continued to be productive despite the focus. Our offense, like most in the NFL, looks to throw to the receiver who is single-covered. Parker drawing extra attention frees up other receivers to get that single coverage. Then, when Parker is single covered, he generally makes his catches. It's true we did not convert as many of our targets as a team as we would have liked, but then again we had a lot of turnover in our receiving corps. No Albert Wilson, who would have started. No Allen Hurns who would have been our #1 backup. Preston Williams injury after he had soaked up all of training camp and early games reps. Isaiah Ford spent time with us, then time with the Patriots, then back with us ... not ideal for chemistry. Antonio Calloway, limited time as well.

Then there was throwing to backs who rotated in and out like Myles Gaskins, Salvon Ahmed, and poor performers like Jordan Howard and Matt Breida. Then we blooded a new Albert Wilson type in Lynn Bowden Jr. All in all, that's a lot of churn. Factor in that we played musical QB's as well and had a limited preseason ... it's not surprising that our receivers were not as sharp as usual, nor that they had the same chemistry with Fitz and Tua. Overall, there was less chemistry because the guys weren't playing with the same guys for enough reps to really gel, IMHO.

Grant has been productive ... but yes, he has small hands and is a body catcher--which is a problem. He had a return TD, scared DB's off him constantly, and terrorized safeties to the point many other receivers were open. One thing some fans do not value as highly as they should is the ability of a speed guy to dictate defense. Whether it's Kenny Stills or Jakeem Grant, that safety will shade the side with the speed threat, and Grant's speed is elite. So, some of those successful running plays worked in part because the routes run pushed the DB's deeper. Some of those pass plays short worked because Grant pushed multiple DB's deeper.

Believe me when I say, we're not a good run blocking team and we're not a team full of good RB's. Our running game is wholly manufactured, and much of it comes from teams fearing our speed receivers. We were a short passing team. We threw few intermediate routes, and not a ton of deep routes. Without speed to keep those DB's at bay, teams would have completely shut down our short passing game. I'm just saying, sometimes not everyone appreciates what our receivers do when they're not catching the ball.

Digital,

I think you are confusing Parker being our #1 vs. being a #1 with all that comes with it. Sure, opposing defenses responded to our best receiver as if he was the biggest threat. He was. But he doesn't require consistent game planning, just good coverage. More importantly, while he has the good hands, they aren't great (there is a post in 347 showing he's 9th in drops). So, he's got better than average hands but not elite hands and can high point the ball with the very best of them, but has average speed, so so routes, and doesn't get YAC and as a result isn't a home run threat after the catch. How is that a true #1?

I not suggesting our injuries didn't hurt. I'm arguing that it hurt us more than it should have because our #1 WR is a 2 and our #2 is a 3 or 4 at best. Parker is loyal to the team in that he paid them back for giving him 4 or 5 years to finally show what he's worth via a team friendly contract. I respect that -- a lot in fact. I want him on the team next year. But if we don't have a legit get separation, run entire route tree, require the DC to plan for guy next year, it will be a huge disappointment. I think Parker would thrive with some of the heat off of him -- better for him and us.

P. Williams is another big and tall jump ball kind of guy with average speed and because he's body catcher, he's just a less good Parker. Neither is the take the top of the D with him kind of guy, can run any route, break on his cuts so good that he requires defensive help. Both require scheming open, which we did reasonably well, all things considered. When we got down to playing what should have been a developmental guy or 3, it was s **** show. Of course, our power running game helped by pulling 8 into the box to open up the passing game.... kidding. I kid. Ok, it's really more, I cry. But moving on.

Grant is a disappointment. That cut and acceleration is something else. Unfortunately, so are the stone hands. If he could just get to average hands, I wouldn't mind him as a #4, possibly a #3 as he is a really tough cover. The problem with Grant is you only have some many plays in the game and if he's not reliable, his number won't get called, and then he turns into a home run or bust kind of player for us. Ok, so where are the home runs?
 
Gesicki has the worst separation of any tight end in football. Not any flex any tight end period. Don’t blame me blame pff although watching guys draped all over him on every catch etc I can surely see it.

dvp is the only guy that draws coverage but like others said he’s hurt too much and it effects his stem in his routes with soft tissue injuries etc.
 
Who needs matchup nightmares to win. I’d rather have 11 good guys than 3 stars and 8 scrubs. Football is a team sport. As strong as the weakest link.
 
i would cash in on trade with gesicki cause that separation stuff isn’t changing. I think he limits the flex position frankly. A flex that doesn’t separate. And I can replace him with something that isn’t such a tell and poor in the run game.

but at the same time you add weapons around gesicki on the outside/slot at wr and I’m sure you can get by no doubt witb what he brings.

Problem is folks probably wouldn’t like tbe return in trade. I don’t see you getting your pick investment back I will put it that way
 
I'd like to keep and build around Gesicki and Parker (see him as a unreliable 2 sad to say). A solid #1 with a good hands, get open type of slot and we have potential.
 
But you will have to pay Mike to stay beyond 2021, he's not going to ask for minimum here. This FO have proved before that they will cash in before dishing out a big contract, Mike is a prime candidate for that.

You need to watch Kyle Pitts tape, I've watched every snap of the kid as a Gator and I can tell you he not just another prospect, he is the definition of the title of this thread:


Just Say No to Geisiki - spend on someone with the heart of a lion

Tired of these look like Tarzan play like Jane types
 
Who needs matchup nightmares to win. I’d rather have 11 good guys than 3 stars and 8 scrubs. Football is a team sport. As strong as the weakest link.
Those scrubs you love so much dropped 11 passes last week...
 
Digital,

I think you are confusing Parker being our #1 vs. being a #1 with all that comes with it. Sure, opposing defenses responded to our best receiver as if he was the biggest threat. He was. But he doesn't require consistent game planning, just good coverage. More importantly, while he has the good hands, they aren't great (there is a post in 347 showing he's 9th in drops). So, he's got better than average hands but not elite hands and can high point the ball with the very best of them, but has average speed, so so routes, and doesn't get YAC and as a result isn't a home run threat after the catch. How is that a true #1?

I not suggesting our injuries didn't hurt. I'm arguing that it hurt us more than it should have because our #1 WR is a 2 and our #2 is a 3 or 4 at best. Parker is loyal to the team in that he paid them back for giving him 4 or 5 years to finally show what he's worth via a team friendly contract. I respect that -- a lot in fact. I want him on the team next year. But if we don't have a legit get separation, run entire route tree, require the DC to plan for guy next year, it will be a huge disappointment. I think Parker would thrive with some of the heat off of him -- better for him and us.

P. Williams is another big and tall jump ball kind of guy with average speed and because he's body catcher, he's just a less good Parker. Neither is the take the top of the D with him kind of guy, can run any route, break on his cuts so good that he requires defensive help. Both require scheming open, which we did reasonably well, all things considered. When we got down to playing what should have been a developmental guy or 3, it was s **** show. Of course, our power running game helped by pulling 8 into the box to open up the passing game.... kidding. I kid. Ok, it's really more, I cry. But moving on.

Grant is a disappointment. That cut and acceleration is something else. Unfortunately, so are the stone hands. If he could just get to average hands, I wouldn't mind him as a #4, possibly a #3 as he is a really tough cover. The problem with Grant is you only have some many plays in the game and if he's not reliable, his number won't get called, and then he turns into a home run or bust kind of player for us. Ok, so where are the home runs?
Brother it seems we fundamentally disagree on what Parker has accomplished and what Grant primarily brings to this offense. Fair enough, I'll just say this and then leave you with the last word.

IMHO, the best metrics of Parker's performances are these: 1) YPT (Yards Per Target) relative to the offense's YPT; 2) YPT relative to the other WR's on this team; and 3) PPP (Points Per Pass) when he is on the field relative to when he is not on the field (essentially a football equivalent of Wins Against Replacement in Baseball, but tailored for only passing plays). Those are the best ways to define a #1 WR's performances compared to his situation and teammates. When you do that analysis, you see that Parker carries our WR room quite admirably.

We also disagree about Jakeem Grant. I see a large part of a speed WR's role as being something akin to an OL, in that he sets the DB's to allow the other chess pieces room to breathe much like an OL sets the front 7 (or front 6 or front 5 as today's NFL usually appears) that allows the RB lanes through which to run. A WR who merely gets covered by 1 DB does not open up the secondary. A WR, even one who drops a lot of balls, who commands double-teams and always gets safeties shading to his side and supporting over the top opens up all of those lion share of short throws upon which our offense feasts. Without a speed receiver clearing that area by scaring DB's back, none of our WR's would be successful and neither of our QB's would have any success. Not saying Grant is the only one doing that ... but look at how many small fast guys we've recruited for essentially that same role.

We had Albert Wilson and Jakeem Grant. When Wilson sat out the season we had Matt Breida. When he didn't work out we used Myles Gaskin. When he was injured we added Salvon Ahmed. When the chance came we traded for Lynn Bowden Jr. That's a lot of small fast guys all trying to fill a role, because the role is crucial to the success of this offense. If we had a young Irving Fryar, we wouldn't be bringing in all of these guys, but we don't, so we're looking for our speed threat in the passing game, and so far, Grant is the best we have in that role.

That's my opinion. I now cede the floor and the final word to you. :UP:
 
Brother it seems we fundamentally disagree on what Parker has accomplished and what Grant primarily brings to this offense. Fair enough, I'll just say this and then leave you with the last word.

IMHO, the best metrics of Parker's performances are these: 1) YPT (Yards Per Target) relative to the offense's YPT; 2) YPT relative to the other WR's on this team; and 3) PPP (Points Per Pass) when he is on the field relative to when he is not on the field (essentially a football equivalent of Wins Against Replacement in Baseball, but tailored for only passing plays). Those are the best ways to define a #1 WR's performances compared to his situation and teammates. When you do that analysis, you see that Parker carries our WR room quite admirably.

We also disagree about Jakeem Grant. I see a large part of a speed WR's role as being something akin to an OL, in that he sets the DB's to allow the other chess pieces room to breathe much like an OL sets the front 7 (or front 6 or front 5 as today's NFL usually appears) that allows the RB lanes through which to run. A WR who merely gets covered by 1 DB does not open up the secondary. A WR, even one who drops a lot of balls, who commands double-teams and always gets safeties shading to his side and supporting over the top opens up all of those lion share of short throws upon which our offense feasts. Without a speed receiver clearing that area by scaring DB's back, none of our WR's would be successful and neither of our QB's would have any success. Not saying Grant is the only one doing that ... but look at how many small fast guys we've recruited for essentially that same role.

We had Albert Wilson and Jakeem Grant. When Wilson sat out the season we had Matt Breida. When he didn't work out we used Myles Gaskin. When he was injured we added Salvon Ahmed. When the chance came we traded for Lynn Bowden Jr. That's a lot of small fast guys all trying to fill a role, because the role is crucial to the success of this offense. If we had a young Irving Fryar, we wouldn't be bringing in all of these guys, but we don't, so we're looking for our speed threat in the passing game, and so far, Grant is the best we have in that role.

That's my opinion. I now cede the floor and the final word to you. :UP:

Given the courtesy of the discussion despite our disagreements, I'm going to defer and leave the above as the last word on this topic between us.
 
Given the courtesy of the discussion despite our disagreements, I'm going to defer and leave the above as the last word on this topic between us.
You sir, are a scholar and a gentleman. It is a pleasure debating the team which we both love and should you change your mind on weighing in, please feel free to wax eloquent again at leisure.
 
I agree.

Who are the five biggest nightmare matchups in the draft? Won't talk free agency until we find out who actually is a free agent.
 
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