Today's loss is a big win

[marino13zach54]

I would have preferred the win over the Jets......but either way it works out.

This is unfortunately how I feel.

I should be more upset but I'm just grateful for a game that had my gut wrenching until the final seconds.

And doesn't that make you feel alive?

I'm also grateful for being able to watch such a motherfkin tough Fitzpatrick. He makes me want to strap up again.

All and all, twas a good Sunday. Would've preferred the win but I'll take the joy of being able to be at the edge of my seat as opposed to early on in the year when all hope was lost quickly.

Btw, they needed a call and a missed field goal to win. Jets still and will always suck suck suck.

 

[joenhre]

In order to win the division, the Bills would need to win out and the Patriots lose another game to have 5 losses. I think the Bills can win out but don't think they do. I think they beat the Steelers and Jets but lose in Foxboro. I think they end up with the 5th seed and play in Tennessee ( who I think wins the AFC South) in the Wildcard round. I think Houston ends up with the 6th seed.

 

[joenhre]

Tua will still be a big risk for whatever team drafts him. He may be able to throw by April but there will be no way of seeing how well he can move and take hits in real game action before the draft.

 

[DPhinz_DPhinz]

There are no guarantees any of us wake up tomorrow. But I’m going to trust both the doctor who said he would make a full recovery, as well as the surgeon who specifically said Tua’s injury is not the same as Bo’s...long before I trust message board experts.

The surgeon also said, "It's likely he won't have the same speed and mobility that we're used to seeing in him. That's probably the most predictable long-term outcome."

Surgeon explains Tua’s hip injury, long-term outlook

The FAQs about Tua Tagovailoa's dislocated hip, fracture and if the high-ankle sprain had anything to do with the latest injury.

www.al.com

To piggy-back the speed and mobility factor, Tua himself shared these words, "I don't think I'd be the same again because there's like metal in here, you know? I lose some rotation inward, so I won't be able to twist as much inward and whatnot."

Alabama's Tua Tagovailoa admits he might never be the same after hip injury

Tagovailoa is questioning what he can bring to the table after this injury

www.cbssports.com

His speed, mobility, and throwing will be affected...yet there are some who would take him at 4, and die with a smile if he fails.

 

[meatpardle]

Bo Jackson never played again from the same injury, and while Tua's situation was treated quicker, there is no guarantee he will ever be able to plant and throw again.

This has been completely debunked numerous times, Bo Jackson suffered the same injury but the injury itself did not cause him to have to retire, it's was the effects of continuing to play on the injury without the correct diagnosis and treatment. This does not not apply to Tua and has been confirmed. Not to mention that it was nearly 30 years ago, and there may have been some medical advances since then.

Despite the number of medical professionals who frequent these forums, some of which have declared that he will never play again and the best case scenario is that he'll be able to walk properly, the situation is that nobody knows how Tua will respond and what the injury will mean. There is no precedent for his situation. CJ Mosely dislocated his hip in college and has had a productive and injury-free career (so far). He didn't have a wall fracture like Tua did, so how much more of an effect will that have compared to a standard hip dislocation? Nobody knows. As Tua himself acknowledge having metal pins inserted will likely mean the joint will not be the same as it was before, but to what extent? Nobody knows. Some medical professionals have stated than the area will be less susceptible to further injury as it will be stronger due to being reinforced by pins. Is that true? Nobody knows.

A whole lot of baseless scaremongering going on regarding the injury, although of course there's a whole lot of blind optimism as well that is just as ignorant of the facts or the current situation.

 

[volk]

This has been completely debunked numerous times, Bo Jackson suffered the same injury but the injury itself did not cause him to have to retire, it's was the effects of continuing to play on the injury without the correct diagnosis and treatment. This does not not apply to Tua and has been confirmed. Not to mention that it was nearly 30 years ago, and there may have been some medical advances since then.

Despite the number of medical professionals who frequent these forums, some of which have declared that he will never play again and the best case scenario is that he'll be able to walk properly, the situation is that nobody knows how Tua will respond and what the injury will mean. There is no precedent for his situation. CJ Mosely dislocated his hip in college and has had a productive and injury-free career (so far). He didn't have a wall fracture like Tua did, so how much more of an effect will that have compared to a standard hip dislocation? Nobody knows. As Tua himself acknowledge having metal pins inserted will likely mean the joint will not be the same as it was before, but to what extent? Nobody knows. Some medical professionals have stated than the area will be less susceptible to further injury as it will be stronger due to being reinforced by pins. Is that true? Nobody knows.

A whole lot of baseless scaremongering going on regarding the injury, although of course there's a whole lot of blind optimism as well that is just as ignorant of the facts or the current situation.

I think you are misunderstanding my point. Clearly Bo Jackson and Tua's situations are not identical, I already stated as much. That said, we are talking about assessing risk with draft capital, and as you have pointed out, no one knows how Tua will recover, but even the current most optimistic scenario, including from the player himself, are that his mobility and range of motion will not be the same. These statements and the previously seen examples of such injuries cast significant risk on drafting Tua, even more so if he can't run, plant, throw or cut prior to the draft.

All I am saying is that the risk in drafting him is huge, especially with a high pick, and that risk makes the notion that Miami needs to draft top 5 to get him really ridiculous. Teams let a healthy Tunsil slide for a picture of him smoking weed through a mask. Acting like Tua is a top 10 pick despite a current inability to walk is asinine and ignores the value of a pick that high and the severity of the injury.

 

[Travis34]

There are no guarantees any of us wake up tomorrow. But I’m going to trust both the doctor who said he would make a full recovery, as well as the surgeon who specifically said Tua’s injury is not the same as Bo’s...long before I trust message board experts.

This.

Volk you are acting like Tua already has avascular necrosis already set it, and someone else saying it was an arthritic hip?

lets wait and see what happens, how about that?

 

[meatpardle]

I think you are misunderstanding my point. Clearly Bo Jackson and Tua's situations are not identical, I already stated as much. That said, we are talking about assessing risk with draft capital, and as you have pointed out, no one knows how Tua will recover, but even the current most optimistic scenario, including from the player himself, are that his mobility and range of motion will not be the same. These statements and the previously seen examples of such injuries cast significant risk on drafting Tua, even more so if he can't run, plant, throw or cut prior to the draft.

All I am saying is that the risk in drafting him is huge, especially with a high pick, and that risk makes the notion that Miami needs to draft top 5 to get him really ridiculous. Teams let a healthy Tunsil slide for a picture of him smoking weed through a mask. Acting like Tua is a top 10 pick despite a current inability to walk is asinine and ignores the value of a pick that high and the severity of the injury.

If that's the case then I don't see the reason to bring up Bo Jackson at all, other than scaremongering.

Everything else you say is reasonable, but all open to interpretation. Yes Tua stated that his range of movement will not be the same, but that was based on common sense rather than any admission that he will not be able to perform to the same standards. He's having pins inserted into the joint to stablilse it, of course it isn't going to be as flexible as previously. But how less flexible will it be, and how much will that affect his ability to play QB to any noticeable degree? Are we talking about the guy walking with a limp for the rest of his life, or losing .01 of a second off his 40 time? I would also doubt that this is the most optimistic scenario, as his surgeon painted a far more optimistic picture than just 'it won't be the same as it was before'. Of course a lot can happen during his rehab journey, but there isn't any evidence to to contradict what was said (yet). You state that previous examples of such injuries cast doubt on his ability to perform at the same level, which is a reasonable concern, but what what are these previous examples and how relevant are they? If you're risk averse or don't like Tua then you're going to assess those comments and situations differently than someone who desperately wants him as a Dolphin, because there are no facts to go on.

We're four months away for the draft and trying to guess i) what condition Tua will be in, and ii) how NFL teams will react that condition. If the draft happened now would Tua be a top 10 pick? Probably not, but the draft isn't happening now. As for Tunsil, everyone knows than nothing causes an NFL scout or exec to lose a boner quicker than a 'bad attitude' or 'personal problems'. Sure there's a risk drafting an injured player, especially so high and at that position, but without evidence I'm not sure why people are doubting his recovery and scoffing at suggestions he'll still be chosen early on.

 

[Smith21]

My problem with tua (who I'm still all for with our 2nd or 3rd first round pick) is we don't know if he loses velocity on his throws. I don't want to be married to a noodle arm qb for 10 years because he can't step into throws. I still take a flyer if there's some hope. But in the NFL if you can't throw it deep you are done in the playoffs

 

[ATL_PHIN_FAN]

This has been completely debunked numerous times, Bo Jackson suffered the same injury but the injury itself did not cause him to have to retire, it's was the effects of continuing to play on the injury without the correct diagnosis and treatment. This does not not apply to Tua and has been confirmed. Not to mention that it was nearly 30 years ago, and there may have been some medical advances since then.

Despite the number of medical professionals who frequent these forums, some of which have declared that he will never play again and the best case scenario is that he'll be able to walk properly, the situation is that nobody knows how Tua will respond and what the injury will mean. There is no precedent for his situation. CJ Mosely dislocated his hip in college and has had a productive and injury-free career (so far). He didn't have a wall fracture like Tua did, so how much more of an effect will that have compared to a standard hip dislocation? Nobody knows. As Tua himself acknowledge having metal pins inserted will likely mean the joint will not be the same as it was before, but to what extent? Nobody knows. Some medical professionals have stated than the area will be less susceptible to further injury as it will be stronger due to being reinforced by pins. Is that true? Nobody knows.

A whole lot of baseless scaremongering going on regarding the injury, although of course there's a whole lot of blind optimism as well that is just as ignorant of the facts or the current situation.

I know this. No sane team will take Tua anywhere in the draft before their own medical professionals evaluate his injuries. Yeah, sometimes they can be wrong. See Drew Breez. However, I'm pretty sure the teams will go with what the professionals they pay tell them. I would.

 

[KingDolphin57]

The first pick is out of reach and there’s only one qb worth a top 4 pick so I don’t get this at all. So I guess all you tankers are going to be ever so thrilled when we draft Justin Herbert with the 4th pick???

They couldn't think we'd draft Tua there? Could they?

 

[deester11]

Bo Jackson never played again from the same injury, and while Tua's situation was treated quicker, there is no guarantee he will ever be able to plant and throw again.

It did end his football career, but he played for the White Sox and Angels I believe. It was devastating at that time and even now. With rehab, sure Tua could conceivably play again. I don't know how viable it is to take hits. Bo was a physical marvel though and did the smart thing. Play baseball.

Dr. Louis Levitt, who serves as Vice President and Secretary for The Centers for Advanced Orthopaedics in Washington, D.C. had this to say:

"Bo Jackson played professional baseball after having a hip replacement, and everybody thought that was the greatest thing since sliced bread. He probably set back hip replacements by about a decade because everybody thought they could go to the level of playing professional ball. I think Jackson's hip loosened after 3-4 years and he had to have a second hip replacement and never recovered from that.

"This is why you hope, the perfect scenario, the ball is back in the socket, there are no loose fragments in the socket, it is a single piece of the socket that can easily be put back. He doesn't get any complications and then, if all the Gods shine down on him, he then can probably get back to playing and retain his professional potential within a year."

 

[39wildman]

I disagree in terms of it being a 'bad move'. If he's going to be taken top 15, he should most definitely come out. Hell, if the NFL rules allowed it, he would have come out last year.

In terms of him going undrafted......come on. His decision will be based on whether or not he is projected to be in the first round.

If Tua got sit out yr. It may take him 2 to 3 yr. To see if he still got it.we might have new coaches by than.

 

[Retro_Marlins]

I think S Delpit, CB Fuller and Hurts would be an ideal first round for us.

 

[Rev Kev]

Bo Jackson never played again from the same injury, and while Tua's situation was treated quicker, there is no guarantee he will ever be able to plant and throw again.

The Team doctors didn’t set his hip right away - he thought he had a hip pointer

Small things like this loom large in recovery