W/L vs talent

[fansinceGWilson]

The more I consider this, the more annoyed I get. Just my take and I'd like (and know I'll get) opinions.
Before I start, I'll be including injured players and those who don't 'fit' in Miami. And I'll be including 'average' players in my list of talent since, by definition, half the teams in the NFL have to have below average players, which means although upgrades are possible, there is still talent. Even top teams have a number of below average players.
On O, Armstead, Williams, Hunt, TT, Hill, waddle, Gesicki. Tempted to include JWJ.
On D, Wilkins, Seiler, Phillips, Chubb, Ingram, Baker (no, he isn''t trash), X, Needham, BrJones, Holland. Tempted to include KK.
BTW, yes, I know Miami has a few bottom-dweller in the talent world.

A few comments. There are enough weapons and a talented QB Miami should be scoring more than ~20ppg in last 5 games.
Posted elsewhere, for all the JUSTIFIED complaints ABOUT the D, they are allowing about what the opposing O's score on average.
Which means, I'm more inclined to believe coaching is more of a concern than lack of talent.

 

[dolfan91]

The more I consider this, the more annoyed I get. Just my take and I'd like (and know I'll get) opinions.
Before I start, I'll be including injured players and those who don't 'fit' in Miami. And I'll be including 'average' players in my list of talent since, by definition, half the teams in the NFL have to have below average players, which means although upgrades are possible, there is still talent. Even top teams have a number of below average players.
On O, Armstead, Williams, Hunt, TT, Hill, waddle, Gesicki. Tempted to include JWJ.
On D, Wilkins, Seiler, Phillips, Chubb, Ingram, Baker (no, he isn''t trash), X, Needham, BrJones, Holland. Tempted to include KK.
BTW, yes, I know Miami has a few bottom-dweller in the talent world.

A few comments. There are enough weapons and a talented QB Miami should be scoring more than ~20ppg in last 5 games.
Posted elsewhere, for all the JUSTIFIED complaints ABOUT the D, they are allowing about what the opposing O's score on average.
Which means, I'm more inclined to believe coaching is more of a concern than lack of talent.

Yes, I agree wholeheartedly with all your points. The TE's in particular have been fazed out of the gameplan and are only used as a last resort. That's on the coaching. Going from a strength of 10 td's and about 1K yards two years, to nothing more than an after thought, is troublesome. Yeah, I know, they are there for blocking. But how much better is the blocking? The run game is in the bottom 1/3 of the league. As for the defense, we'll that's another story. Aside from the few plays they made early in the season to secure wins vs Buffalo and Baltimore, they've stunk. That's coaching, Boyer has done one thing well. He's put his defenders in the unenviable position, to fail. That's on him. I'm also confused as to why Miami lacks a pass rush, utilizing just 4 rushers? Seems like defense is a problem.

 

[tay0365]

The more I consider this, the more annoyed I get. Just my take and I'd like (and know I'll get) opinions.
Before I start, I'll be including injured players and those who don't 'fit' in Miami. And I'll be including 'average' players in my list of talent since, by definition, half the teams in the NFL have to have below average players, which means although upgrades are possible, there is still talent. Even top teams have a number of below average players.
On O, Armstead, Williams, Hunt, TT, Hill, waddle, Gesicki. Tempted to include JWJ.
On D, Wilkins, Seiler, Phillips, Chubb, Ingram, Baker (no, he isn''t trash), X, Needham, BrJones, Holland. Tempted to include KK.
BTW, yes, I know Miami has a few bottom-dweller in the talent world.

A few comments. There are enough weapons and a talented QB Miami should be scoring more than ~20ppg in last 5 games.
Posted elsewhere, for all the JUSTIFIED complaints ABOUT the D, they are allowing about what the opposing O's score on average.
Which means, I'm more inclined to believe coaching is more of a concern than lack of talent.

Actually though coaching has not pulled their weight, the Defense is the biggest reason Miami has had issues in this losing streak.

Scoring 20.8 on offense in last 5 games is acceptable, but allowing 27.4 on defense is very unacceptable.

Now yes, many blame Boyer for this, as do I a bit, but it's not close to all on him. Most of the secondary is out, with our supposed best corner in Howard not playing close to how he normally plays because of nagging injury...we have pretty good to special pass-rushers, yet opponants don't come close to feeling the pressure they normally should...finally tackling is a joke, and though most of that can go to coaching, these are not children learning how to play the game, by now they should know how to beat the blocks and get to the QB/RB, and they should know how to get a hold, and tackle the play maker on offense.

Every time they fail to hold an opponant on 3rd down, they should feel ashamed, and feel a fire inside them coming on that they will not as a defense let that happen again. If what they are being taught at practice by Boyer and the other coaches is not enough, then they should take matters into their own hands and work on their deficiencies on their own or unit after or before practice.

 

[NBP81]

There's a bunch of **** I've already said and I'm not going to reiterate here... But using W/L record over a 17 games span means absolutely nothing... I'm starting to think I could actually make money betting coinflips with some guys around here... After flipping 4 tails in a row they'd give me +150 on heads...

HCs shouldn't get canned after a year unless under the most extreme conditions... And leading the league in YPA, yards per play, top 5 in TD% and 4th in AFC scoring isn't one of them. You'd spread these though road games around the schedule with the same results and most people wouldn't bat an eye. Such irrational behavior.

 

[SF Dolphin Fan]

Unfortunately, a lot of those talented players listed are on IR. In addition, Tua and Armstead have missed numerous games. I believe Miami is 0-4 without Tua. That means 8-4 with Tua, which would be on track for playoffs.

So, while I do think part of it is coaching... I'm particularly frustrated with the lack of a running game and sticking with the run.

I think the bigger issue is injuries.

 

[Rick Cartman]

I think it's important to note that every loss this year we had the ball in the fourth quarter with a chance to take the lead.
To me that indicates a team with a strategy/gameplan that at a minimum is giving them an opportunity to win every week.
I think there's sufficient talent on this team on both sides to win, i think the problem is the defensive playcalling and scheme.
I also think an expectation of Boyer to finally be able to comprise a competent game plan, which he has yet to exhibit in his three seasons besides Lamar Jackson last year, against a proficient QB is too big of a gamble.

 

[ForksPhin]

I mentioned something similar in another thread…

This was not a bottom-5 team when McDaniel was hired. We were not coming off a 2-15 or 3-14 season. McDaniel was actually in an odd position in today’s NFL - he was a new head coach taking over a team that had finished over .500 in consecutive seasons.

So, there was enough of a foundation to this team to have won 19 of 33 games over the past two seasons. There were minimal personnel losses of significance. We actually added Tyreek Hill, Terron Armstead, Connor Williams, Cedrick Wilson, Raheem Mostert, etc. to a foundation that won 19 of its prior 33 games.

I think McDaniel’s performance has to be viewed in that light.

He did a very good job of working with Tua (and hiring Bevell as his QB coach). But this 5-game collapse cannot be ignored.

 

[bdizzle00]

Unfortunately, a lot of those talented players listed are on IR. In addition, Tua and Armstead have missed numerous games. I believe Miami is 0-4 without Tua. That means 8-4 with Tua, which would be on track for playoffs.

So, while I do think part of it is coaching... I'm particularly frustrated with the lack of a running game and sticking with the run.

I think the bigger issue is injuries.

It's incredible the fact that football is truly a game of inches. There's probably like 5-10 pass plays the Dolphins called this year that should've been run calls, that might very well have resulted in 2-3 more wins. I guess that goes for a lot of teams but it's still hard to not look back at that in hindsight.

 

[NBP81]

There's probably like 5-10 pass plays the Dolphins called this year that should've been run calls

You're implying the run calls would've worked though...

 

[bdizzle00]

You're implying the run calls would've worked though...

Yeah. Not sure what the results would've been. It just seemed like there were obvious times when a run should've been the call, and the run game was working. I think McD got too cute at some important times and I think he'll learn from it.

 

[NBP81]

Yeah. Definitely. It just seemed like there were obvious times when a run should've been the call, and the run game was working. I think McD got too cute at some important times and I think he'll learn from it.

If you're talking about the 3rd and shorts... It's been pretty much 50/50 for the Fins all year whether they ran it or passed it in that situation... Its easy to say after the fact that well... passing didnt work so obviously, running was the call... completely ignoring the possibility that the run could have been stuffed... As was the result 50% of the time this season on offense.

 

[fansinceGWilson]

There's a bunch of **** I've already said and I'm not going to reiterate here... But using W/L record over a 17 games span means absolutely nothing... I'm starting to think I could actually make money betting coinflips with some guys around here... After flipping 4 tails in a row they'd give me +150 on heads...

HCs shouldn't get canned after a year unless under the most extreme conditions... And leading the league in YPA, yards per play, top 5 in TD% and 4th in AFC scoring isn't one of them. You'd spread these though road games around the schedule with the same results and most people wouldn't bat an eye. Such irrational behavior.

My point wasn't, primarily, that this team should be 12-4 (although it is better talent-wise than it's record). There are posts stating this team needs a rebuild or a massive influx of talent. I disagree. My 2 points were
injuries significantly damaged the talent,
coaching decisions weakened the potential of the talent
This team does need more talent, but it is not so devoid of talent as to require a rebuild. It appears too many think every other team has a do-it-all MLB, a Kelce, and a Derrick Henry. Anything below that is a bust. This team has talent. I just think it isn't being used to potential.

 

[SF Dolphin Fan]

It's incredible the fact that football is truly a game of inches. There's probably like 5-10 pass plays the Dolphins called this year that should've been run calls, that might very well have resulted in 2-3 more wins. I guess that goes for a lot of teams but it's still hard to not look back at that in hindsight.

To your point, in the Chargers game Mostert had 100 yards at the half. Yet, Miami went away from the run in the second half.

I think a more experienced coach would have kept running the ball there.

 

[NBP81]

My point wasn't, primarily, that this team should be 12-4 (although it is better talent-wise than it's record). There are posts stating this team needs a rebuild or a massive influx of talent. I disagree. My 2 points were
injuries significantly damaged the talent,
coaching decisions weakened the potential of the talent
This team does need more talent, but it is not so devoid of talent as to require a rebuild. It appears too many think every other team has a do-it-all MLB, a Kelce, and a Derrick Henry. Anything below that is a bust. This team has talent. I just think it isn't being used to potential.

My post wasn't directed at you personally... It was about what I've been seeing on the boards this week in general. My viewpoint is that specific coaching decisions didnt nearly have the impact on this team W/L record as Tua missing 4 games and the entire secondary minus X and Holland going out on IR... Hell if Tua doesnt get hurt alone we're looking at an entirely different discussion right now. McDaniel definitely has things to work on, but the fire talk is way the **** out of line.

 

[NBP81]

To your point, in the Chargers game Mostert had 100 yards at the half. Yet, Miami went away from the run in the second half.

I think a more experienced coach would have kept running the ball there.

Fins didnt even have 100 yards rushing in that game...?