What is the true impact of a full off season? | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

What is the true impact of a full off season?

Dolphinator530

Dolphinator530

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I just want to bring up the discussion point that has occurred to me recently, and that is what is the true impact of having a full off-season with workouts, training camp, preseason, weight training etc?

I think a lot of people are focused on Tua, and rightfully so, but what about guys like Austin Jackson who had the surgery and no ability to bulk pack up having an off-season to get bigger and stronger and work on technique or somebody like Robert hunt on Solomon Kindley losing bad weight and putting on good muscle while refining technique.

Or even guys like Iggy and B Jones just any more time to look at film work on their physicality work on technique and things of that nature.

And that would just be focusing on the young guys; somebody like AVG stepping into a new roll but having a lot of time to get used to it. I think that kind of stuff is going to be a more significant impact especially early on.

I think Flores has kind of have the deck stacked against him early in seasons, with his first year having a completely stripped down roster and very little overall talent in his second year having no rookie mini camp, mini camp, training camp, preseason, and having to bring along seven or eight rookies at light speed. I think the work he did and his staff did is more remarkable if you look at it like that.

So I’m interested to see not only what do you think the overall impact of a full off season will be but people in particular you think will benefit and we will see a significant jump from; or even if you expect rookies to make an impact faster because they will have a large number of reps going into the season as compared to last year.
 
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Dolphinator530 said:
I just want to bring up the discussion point that has occurred to me recently, and that is what is the true impact of having a full off-season with workouts, training camp, preseason, weight training etc?

I think a lot of people are focused on Tua, and rightfully so, but what about guys like Austin Jackson who had the surgery and no ability to bulk pack up having an off-season to get bigger and stronger and work on technique or somebody like Robert hunt on Solomon Kindley losing bad weight and putting on good muscle while refining technique.

Or even guys like Iggy and B Jones just any more time to look at film work on their physicality work on technique and things of that nature.

And that would just be focusing on the young guys; somebody like AVG stepping into a new roll but having a lot of time to get used to it. I think that kind of stuff is going to be a more significant impact especially early on.

I think Flores has kind of have the deck stacked against him early in seasons, with his first year having a completely stripped down roster and very little overall talent in his second year having no rookie mini camp, mini camp, training camp, preseason, and having to bring along seven or eight rookies at light speed. I think the work he did and his staff did is more remarkable if you look at it like that.

So I’m interested to see not only what do you think the overall impact of a full off season will be but people in particular you think will benefit and we will see a significant jump from; or even if you expect rookies to make an impact faster because they will have a large number of reps going into the season as compared to last year.
Click to expand...
Let's do it this way. Teams with a lot of vets, same HC/OC . . . missing a full OS is less important than . . .
Teams with fewer vets, same HC/OC is less important than . . .
Teams with few vets, a lot of rookies, 2nd year guys, same HC, different OC . . . missing a full OS is quite important.
Missing conditioning, drills, familiarity with the scheme/playbook/each other . . .
Miami isn't the only team in the last group, but the affect is the same
 
Dolphinator530 said:
I just want to bring up the discussion point that has occurred to me recently, and that is what is the true impact of having a full off-season with workouts, training camp, preseason, weight training etc?

I think a lot of people are focused on Tua, and rightfully so, but what about guys like Austin Jackson who had the surgery and no ability to bulk pack up having an off-season to get bigger and stronger and work on technique or somebody like Robert hunt on Solomon Kindley losing bad weight and putting on good muscle while refining technique.

Or even guys like Iggy and B Jones just any more time to look at film work on their physicality work on technique and things of that nature.

And that would just be focusing on the young guys; somebody like AVG stepping into a new roll but having a lot of time to get used to it. I think that kind of stuff is going to be a more significant impact especially early on.

I think Flores has kind of have the deck stacked against him early in seasons, with his first year having a completely stripped down roster and very little overall talent in his second year having no rookie mini camp, mini camp, training camp, preseason, and having to bring along seven or eight rookies at light speed. I think the work he did and his staff did is more remarkable if you look at it like that.

So I’m interested to see not only what do you think the overall impact of a full off season will be but people in particular you think will benefit and we will see a significant jump from; or even if you expect rookies to make an impact faster because they will have a large number of reps going into the season as compared to last year.
Click to expand...
Being the youngest team in the league makes it very important for us.

Preseason/TC is when you have time to teach technique, form O-line cohesion, etc.
 
fansinceGWilson said:
Let's do it this way. Teams with a lot of vets, same HC/OC . . . missing a full OS is less important than . . .
Teams with fewer vets, same HC/OC is less important than . . .
Teams with few vets, a lot of rookies, 2nd year guys, same HC, different OC . . . missing a full OS is quite important.
Missing conditioning, drills, familiarity with the scheme/playbook/each other . . .
Miami isn't the only team in the last group, but the affect is the same
Click to expand...
Have to agree with the above statement, Tua had no training camp or off-season workouts and it showed in the product on the field. Couple this with the facts that we had other rookies come in and the product on the field shows. I think the Fins overachieved last year and am hoping for great years to come
 
Dolphinator530 said:
I just want to bring up the discussion point that has occurred to me recently, and that is what is the true impact of having a full off-season with workouts, training camp, preseason, weight training etc?

I think a lot of people are focused on Tua, and rightfully so, but what about guys like Austin Jackson who had the surgery and no ability to bulk pack up having an off-season to get bigger and stronger and work on technique or somebody like Robert hunt on Solomon Kindley losing bad weight and putting on good muscle while refining technique.

Or even guys like Iggy and B Jones just any more time to look at film work on their physicality work on technique and things of that nature.

And that would just be focusing on the young guys; somebody like AVG stepping into a new roll but having a lot of time to get used to it. I think that kind of stuff is going to be a more significant impact especially early on.

I think Flores has kind of have the deck stacked against him early in seasons, with his first year having a completely stripped down roster and very little overall talent in his second year having no rookie mini camp, mini camp, training camp, preseason, and having to bring along seven or eight rookies at light speed. I think the work he did and his staff did is more remarkable if you look at it like that.

So I’m interested to see not only what do you think the overall impact of a full off season will be but people in particular you think will benefit and we will see a significant jump from; or even if you expect rookies to make an impact faster because they will have a large number of reps going into the season as compared to last year.
Click to expand...
Don’t forget Lynn Bowden who spent the 12 months prior playing QB
 
Having a real off season is very important for us. A very young team needs to gel together, specially with most likely 4 guys starting at different spots this year on that O-line. Good chance Jackson is the only returning starter at the same position with Hunt and Kindley moving and Skura and Eichenberg starting. Also, we have a new offense and two OC's that even tho they were here last year, they were not calling the plays so TC and pre season games will be huge for our team.
 
I think it means more to younger teams like Miami. Veteran teams have been there, done that, so to speak.

For a quarterback, it is vital to get on the same page with receivers. Kind of amazing the year Herbert had, although the Chargers have a lot of talent on offense compared to Miami.
 
Great question @Dolphinator530 !

This time last year people were saying Tua would have a better rookie season than Dan Marino ... so hope tends to run pretty high here. I was labelled a hater for even mentioning that Tua was still recovering from a hip injury and with such a stilted and abbreviated offseason, we shouldn't get our hopes too high for his rookie debut. Fast forward to today ... and maybe people can see that I was not being a hater ... just being realistic about the high bar of challenges facing young Tua.

But this offseason it's all him. He's fully fit, understands the coaches, NFL grind, building rapport with his receivers, can fully sink his teeth into the playbook, and will hit the ground running with a full (albeit now only 3 games) preseason, a stable of high quality receivers and a bullpen full of hogs to protect him and create a run game. This is the year Tua can soar, so let's let him stretch his wings (and use his fabled mobility) to become the Russell Wilson so many projected him to become this time last year. It's time to take our Ferrari out for a spin and see what's under the hood.

The time is now for Tua. Or to put it this way ... it's Tua Time.
 
Youth, new coaches, lots of vet turnover, rookie QB's, new QB's of any age, losing veteran leaders, all make TC, preseason, and off season activities more important. Every team is getting those vs last yr, but it probably benefits us more than most. Not THE most though.
 
Its always a balance between experience/continuity and roster building restrictions/future considerations. I dont know of any other sport that relies more on timing and precision from such a large group of players as football. Remove cap restrictions and suddently the Fins are a badly shaped roster as having more players in their prime who are less likely to make mistakes than young guys who just got in would be preferable. If you can buy wins, then all those future draft picks and players on rookie contracts arent all that valuable.

In a cap setting, its a different story as the Fins future assets and young players do hold alot of value, but they're still very unbalanced when it comes to experience and continuity. They're absolutely still mistake prone on some units, OL, QB and WR come to mind even though the talent level is up there. You could also make a case for DL too. So yeah, those camps will certainly help the Fins explain their players why they're doing things instead of simply telling them what to do because of a lack of time to go deeper into the whys.

Im not sure this will be enough for the OL, this is the unit thats the most boom or bust on the Fins when you'd like that particular unit to be the most stable. They should have a solid core for a while but Im not sure they'll be solid from the get go or even this season... This is kind of critical as the way they play might change how this whole team looks in 2021... IMO
 
I believe the impact of what we went through last year had a greater impact on a younger team or a team with a new coaching staff and thus new system.

Another angle is our rookies should have had a lesser "rookie wall" later in the season since they did not start to practice in May. In my opinion many of our rookies still hit the "rookie wall". I am hopeful that our rookies from last year will be better for the trial by fire approach. Outside of Waddle and Phillips I believe all the other new guys will have time to produce.
 
Someone has to play devil's advocate and because I choose to be an optimistic homer I'll lay out the following:

Say you are a truly "generational" draft prospect. Lets take Sewell as an example (regardless of what we think of him as a prospect). You think you are all that and don't need any coaching, strength conditioning, diet nonsense, and so on. Then on your first day of training camp, in the dog days of summer, you are lined up against Cam Wake and then Jason Taylor. You get your butt kicked, are humbled and realize in a hurry that your God given talents alone aren't enough. You know in a hurry you better get with the program and buy into the coaching. I mean after all, Cam Wake was an UDFA. and Jason Taylor was a late round pick, and look at what they did to me. Maybe there is something to this NFL level coaching. Better get with it before the season starts.

Our guys didn't get that baptism by fire until the real games started. Tua even made a comment I think he later regretted. I think it is one reason they recanted and are at OTA's when so many other teams aren't. They know they need help and missed out on it last year.

In short it was a huge loss for us.

I think Flo's message is real simple. Listen to what we teach you. Apply it in life and on the field. If you do so and play hard I will make you a millionare. If you don't you will likely be flipping hamburgers at McDonald's within 4 years.
 
I have faith in Flo and Grier and their penchant for bringing in hard working, smart players so i truly think this offseason should make a big difference. There are reasons to expect improvements on every unit of the offense, not even mentioning defense. We are one step further along with their plan. Pundits are saying "THAT'S how you build a team." pointing at us. If they are right, then the result should be yet another big step forward. That doesn't mean if we go 9-7 it's failure. We'll be able to watch what happens on the field this year to decide that, but I expect playoffs this year.
 
To me it's like having a rookie hold out thru the entire offseason from the draft til a week before the season starts and then having him come in a few days before the first game of the season. There's only a few positions that you can get away with that. At most positions that would leave a player so far behind the vets on the roster that they would have a very limited impact. The few exceptions are players that excell due to a specific skill set. For example if you're a wr who just gets by due to pure speed then you will likely be less impacted than a wr known for route running.
 
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