Why pats will never be a powerhouse under BB

[Dirtywater]

Well, I'll avoid the original point of the discussion as the majority of the smart level headed posters have already dealt with that.

Instead, I'll add to your original point. Saban is similar to Belichick. You will start to employ the same type of "loyalty" to your players. SO my question is, will you be happy when you start to win but show no loyalty?

 

[WestCoastPhins]

first I think people are reading the title to literaly, it was all i could think of, but seriously if we start winning ill be happy, but lets say we win the superbowl with jason taylor and he plays his *** off for us the whole season and is a big reason we are there, and we cut him, yes I will be pissed at saban. Basically my gripe is how they cut brown after he basically did more than he had to, for next to nothing, and when he was up for his fair share, which should be price of two players he got shafted. That is somthing I wish never happens here. You cut the undeserving players, but someone who gave his all for the team, and isnt looking to cap kill you I would really have a problem getting rid of, especially after a superbowl win because obviously your old team got the job done.

Would you want to play for a team that you help get a championship, and have them cut you because you wanted to be paid a 10th of what brady did. Yes they were a powerhouse, but I dont see there guys laying out for them anymore like they have, because no matter how hard you play they will cut you. it was bullshat. So instead of dwelling on syntactical crap, think about that.

 

[WestCoastPhins]

oh and to say there Corner backs were weak, remember alot of those good picks were from linebackers. And if you guys read the thread correctly it said they will not BE a powerhouse. they WERE one, but wont BE anymore.

I dont see them as being trusted by players anymore, based off this years actions, which were far worse than what they did to milloy. And they didnt do before this year. B.B. is a liar like Law said, and I believed him when he said it last year, and how there front office works I stil belive it now.

 

[Dirtywater]

oh and to say there Corner backs were weak, remember alot of those good picks were from linebackers. And if you guys read the thread correctly it said they will not BE a powerhouse. they WERE one, but wont BE anymore.

I dont see them as being trusted by players anymore, based off this years actions, which were far worse than what they did to milloy. And they didnt do before this year. B.B. is a liar like Law said, and I believed him when he said it last year, and how there front office works I stil belive it now.

Ho-hum. It is oh-so-fashionable-and-trendy to bash the Patriots.

Someday you'll look inwards and yourself why your team hasn't won it all about 3 decades.

 

[Gator Mike]

Basically my gripe is how they cut brown after he basically did more than he had to, for next to nothing, and when he was up for his fair share, which should be price of two players he got shafted.

Except you're wrong... Troy Brown's cap number last year was $3.2 million, which isn't exactly "next to nothing". That number is a lot higher than what the Pats otherwise would have paid a 4th WR and 4th CB... so in a sense, he was paid the price of two players.

someone who gave his all for the team, and isnt looking to cap kill you I would really have a problem getting rid of, especially after a superbowl win because obviously your old team got the job done.

And normally, you would. Except Brown was 33 years old with declining WR skills and a 2005 cap number in excess of $5 million. The Pats could have renegotiated his deal, but Brown chose to try the free agent market instead. What's the problem?

Would you want to play for a team that you help get a championship, and have them cut you because you wanted to be paid a 10th of what brady did.

Brady's cap number in 2004 was $5.0 million. Brown's was $3.2 million - the third highest on the Patriots last year. He was fairly compensated, and some would argue that he was over compensated for his actual contributions last year, despite his versatility.

no matter how hard you play they will cut you. it was bullshat.

Every team makes those decisions. Should the Cowboys have been obligated to pay Emmitt Smith whatever he wanted for as long as he wanted to play? Or do they have a responsiblity to their fans to field the best team they possibly can?

 

[BleedinGreenNY]

I have been reading the ty law thread and a point was brought up that I strongly believe.

The pats have no loyalty. They get there guys to sign low contracts for the better of the team. But when it comes time to renegotiate and guys like troy brown who gave his health to play both sides of the ball, they release him because its not cap friendly.

This is much diffrent than the milloy case because he demanded an insane amount of cash. But people like law and brown, wanted fair amounts and job security.

Free agents will start to see this and be turned away from new england because kraft and Bill belichick could care less about there players.

Now lets look at another sport and a team I know, the bulls. They have taken care of Jay Willaims and Eddy Curry knowing one or maybe both depending on this offseason goes, may not come back. They honor contracts they dont have to. It makes players want to play there and maybe know they will be better taken care of. Exact opposite of new england. They will say help us, but when you get injured its bye, dont let the door hit you on the way out. And because of this, everyone except malcontents will not want to play for new england. Soon there entire team will be made of 2nd stringers trying to play in the system. Sorry, but Pats are on the downfall. There secondary is still exploitable, despite what they believe. And they can be rattled. And it will be a matter of time before they go from golden franchise to yet another bottom feeder.

Have you lived in a closet for the past 4 years? They are already being compared to one of the best teams of all time. As far as BB goes, what other coach in the league do you know of that took a receiver and turned him into a cornerback and actually had success doing that? One thing you have to understand is that pro sports is a business, it has to be run like a corporate structure, they are in the business to make money, if someone doesnt cut it they have to go, do i approve of it? No! But thats just the reality of it.

 

[patsdynasty]

I have been reading the ty law thread and a point was brought up that I strongly believe.

The pats have no loyalty. They get there guys to sign low contracts for the better of the team. But when it comes time to renegotiate and guys like troy brown who gave his health to play both sides of the ball, they release him because its not cap friendly.

This is much diffrent than the milloy case because he demanded an insane amount of cash. But people like law and brown, wanted fair amounts and job security.

Free agents will start to see this and be turned away from new england because kraft and Bill belichick could care less about there players.

Now lets look at another sport and a team I know, the bulls. They have taken care of Jay Willaims and Eddy Curry knowing one or maybe both depending on this offseason goes, may not come back. They honor contracts they dont have to. It makes players want to play there and maybe know they will be better taken care of. Exact opposite of new england. They will say help us, but when you get injured its bye, dont let the door hit you on the way out. And because of this, everyone except malcontents will not want to play for new england. Soon there entire team will be made of 2nd stringers trying to play in the system. Sorry, but Pats are on the downfall. There secondary is still exploitable, despite what they believe. And they can be rattled. And it will be a matter of time before they go from golden franchise to yet another bottom feeder.

:roflmao: keep smoking what ricky is smoking!!!!!!!

u have no clue whatsoever!!!!!!!!!

 

[patsdynasty]

Except you're wrong... Troy Brown's cap number last year was $3.2 million, which isn't exactly "next to nothing". That number is a lot higher than what the Pats otherwise would have paid a 4th WR and 4th CB... so in a sense, he was paid the price of two players.


And normally, you would. Except Brown was 33 years old with declining WR skills and a 2005 cap number in excess of $5 million. The Pats could have renegotiated his deal, but Brown chose to try the free agent market instead. What's the problem?


Brady's cap number in 2004 was $5.0 million. Brown's was $3.2 million - the third highest on the Patriots last year. He was fairly compensated, and some would argue that he was over compensated for his actual contributions last year, despite his versatility.


Every team makes those decisions. Should the Cowboys have been obligated to pay Emmitt Smith whatever he wanted for as long as he wanted to play? Or do they have a responsiblity to their fans to field the best team they possibly can?

the pats dynasty is still thriving because of how they handle the cap issues..
dallas one folded because they didnt manage the personel properly....

and troy brown will be back ....

 

[Wagon Circler]

the pats dynasty is still thriving because of how they handle the cap issues..
dallas one folded because they didnt manage the personel properly....

and troy brown will be back ....

I wouldn't count on the pats making it past the divisional playoff round.

 

[BlueFin]

first I think people are reading the title to literaly, it was all i could think of, but seriously if we start winning ill be happy, but lets say we win the superbowl with jason taylor and he plays his *** off for us the whole season and is a big reason we are there, and we cut him, yes I will be pissed at saban. Basically my gripe is how they cut brown after he basically did more than he had to, for next to nothing, and when he was up for his fair share, which should be price of two players he got shafted. That is somthing I wish never happens here. You cut the undeserving players, but someone who gave his all for the team, and isnt looking to cap kill you I would really have a problem getting rid of, especially after a superbowl win because obviously your old team got the job done.

Would you want to play for a team that you help get a championship, and have them cut you because you wanted to be paid a 10th of what brady did. Yes they were a powerhouse, but I dont see there guys laying out for them anymore like they have, because no matter how hard you play they will cut you. it was bullshat. So instead of dwelling on syntactical crap, think about that.

Its a business dude, the players know that, the owners know that.............why is it that you don't?

 

[patsdynasty]

I wouldn't count on the pats making it past the divisional playoff round.

:roflmao: i like our chances more than the jills chances of even seeing the postseason....

will be interesting who finishes with the better record, the phins or bills this yr
im leaning towards miami with the better record...

 

[70Dart]

I just want to reply to the Troy Brown comment that was made. Troy Brown is a great receiver and player I love him he is the epitomy of team. But right now with Deion Branch and David Givens in the mix, plus the young guys we have at WR, Brown would be no more than a 4th or 5th receiver and his cap hit would have been in the 5 million area. Would you pay that much for a 4th or 5th WR?

And as for the loyalty, the Patriots give them a chance to get the coveted prize of being SB Champs. This is how the NFL works, if you are a winner and the opportunity arises for you to make more money then you should take it. So basically the Patriots are giving them that chance to make a pile of money. And despite what you may think the Patriots are only 3 million under the car right now we haven't signed our rookies yet so to keep these high pricd players would have jeoparized the future of this team.

 

[Master Logos]

I have been reading the ty law thread and a point was brought up that I strongly believe.

The pats have no loyalty. They get there guys to sign low contracts for the better of the team. But when it comes time to renegotiate and guys like troy brown who gave his health to play both sides of the ball, they release him because its not cap friendly.

This is much diffrent than the milloy case because he demanded an insane amount of cash. But people like law and brown, wanted fair amounts and job security. ......

Lawyer Milloy didn't demand any cash. The Patriots wanted him to take a pay cut. He just wanted the Patriots to honor the contract that he signed.

If he wanted an insane amount of cash.... how did the Bills sign him?

 

[70Dart]

Lawyer Milloy was starting to fall off in performance. His never wrapped up when he tackled, and his attitude was terrible. I like Milloy don't get me wrong, but BB and SP made an offer as to what they thought he was now worth and he and his agents (the Postons) didn't like the deal. And for the record the Bills did offer money to Milloy than the Patriots did.

 

[The Myth]

Well I will start with the fact that I was suprized to see so many Fin fans and others who took up for the Patriots. Well done!

Now on to the subject of this thread.
Troy brown is now back as a member of the Patriots. He was waved to avoid a 10 mill cap hit that could have resulted .
Ty Law was offerd a 25 millon contract last off season and replyed with ("that is an insult") So tell me again, who was not showing loyalty?
Next, as for the loss of Romeo Crennel and Charlie Weis.
Eric Mangini the new DC was the guy who was able to use junk players and WRs as DBs and win. By the way the DBs for the Patriots now are by far better than last season. And Eric worked with Romeo and Belichick every day to create a D game plan. So its not like he hasn't been doing it all along. As for the OC position Dante Scarnecchia,and Josh McDaniels did the game plans on O with Weis every week. These two and Pete Mangurian will be doing the majority of the O. The Three of them and Belichick will set up and call the O plays with no problem. In case you have not been awake the Patriots O-Line got faster and stronger this off season. They added some new toys for brady in David Terrell and Tim Dwight Oh there is this TE who was hurt most of last season Ben Watson at 6'4" 255lbs with 4.3 speed. Then there is still Cory Dillon and his developing back up Cedric Cobbs. So I am not seeing how you think the Patriots have gotten weaker. They have gotten better.